Yeast Washing Illustrated

[Aschecte]

I'm through the first 40 pages and I havent found the answer to my question. I have two jars of washed yeast (1056). I am looking to make a starter to pitch in to an IPA. I usually use mr. malty calc for my starter size. How do I know what size of a starter to make?

Sorry for the dumb question. It may have been asked before but I never read a clear answer.

Cheers..

Well im not 100% sure but I believe you set the tab at repitch from slurry than adjust the slider bar between thick and thin slurry based on the thickness of yeast you have collected. Maybe someone with more experience with this method could back this up ( or not ).

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[mistercameron]

On a related note, can we decant some of the liquid and re-use the white labs vials? Seems like a better way to save space in the fridge. So far SWMBO hasn't complained, but fridge space is limited and mason jars take up quite a bit of room.

 

[badhabit]

On a related note, can we decant some of the liquid and re-use the white labs vials? Seems like a better way to save space in the fridge. So far SWMBO hasn't complained, but fridge space is limited and mason jars take up quite a bit of room.

After asking some questions here a short time ago I started doing just what you proposed. It works fine and a week ago I used two WLP tubes without a starter after a month in the fridge. (OOPS, forgot to save a cup of the cake so had to go to the harvested yeast without any advanced notice) Had active fermentation within six hours. The only real question is how much of the tube saved yeast to use. I decant and reduce harvested yeast for about ten days before I put it in the tube for the final. After about a month the yeast in the tube settles to about 60% of the tube. What is there appears to be clean pure thick yeast but....who knows. I more or less calculated that two to three full tubes of yeast should be the correct pitching rate after using a starter and about a month after harvest. For sure my method is not pure science, at most it is best guess calculation. Next I am going to wait six manths and build a starter and use two more harvested tubes and see what happens. I will report back results.

 

[bmock79]

Isn't that what the 'Repitching from slurry' option on mr malty is for. I'm just starting to save harvest/freeze yeast but I assumed thats what that option is for.

L

so if i go in mr malty and click on repitch from slurry and it says i need 214 ml of yeast i would make a starter of roughly a cup or roughly a half pint?

 

[cravej]

so if i go in mr malty and click on repitch from slurry and it says i need 214 ml of yeast i would make a starter of roughly a cup or roughly a half pint?

Not exactly. Pitching from the slurry instead of making a starter, because the slurry already has lots of yeast cells, but you need a full cup of yeast slurry in order to skip making a starter.

 

[Kealia]

On a related note, can we decant some of the liquid and re-use the white labs vials? Seems like a better way to save space in the fridge. So far SWMBO hasn't complained, but fridge space is limited and mason jars take up quite a bit of room.

Yes. I started doing this about a year ago to save space, too. I brewed a batch about a month ago that was from year-old yeast so I opted to use two vials in a 1L starter and had no issues at all. From my notes, that batch hit the exact same apparent attenuation that the original batch did.

 

[badhabit]

Yes. I started doing this about a year ago to save space, too. I brewed a batch about a month ago that was from year-old yeast so I opted to use two vials in a 1L starter and had no issues at all. From my notes, that batch hit the exact same apparent attenuation that the original batch did.

Your info on this topic helped me get started using the WLP tubes...thanks for that!!! Do you decant until you get the tube completely full of yeast? As I noted in my last post I have been decanting the washed yeast for about 10 days to two weeks but still now end up with a tube that is only 60% or so yeast. Again thanks for your help it is much appreciated.

 

[Kealia]

I'm glad that I've been able to help. I decant as much liquid as I can and end up with anywhere between 60% - 80% of the vial full (eyeballing).

 

[ResumeMan]

So to be sure I'm clear on the process you're describing, you wash the yeast into pint jars, let it settle, then decant and pour the bottom layer into the WL vials? Assuming that's it it sounds like a good space-saver, though it's one more transfer for something to possibly go wrong.

 

[Kealia]

Yes, I wash and then let it settle in the mason jars for a week or so in the fridge so it's nice and clear (and that's when I get back around to moving it...), then I move to the vials.

Yes, its another transfer so there are additional risks but proper sanitization and a little luck (with a pour for the homies) goes a long way

 

[jonmohno]

If i were to do this racking a beer then making another the next day doing a small 2 gal batch. Would i just scoop a half small jar of the used yeast adding sanitized water to fill it up the rest of the way, let it sit on the counter overnight then when i brew just pour off the water and pitch. Or do i have to stick it in the fridge over night?
Also im dryhopping in a hop sack with this beer,since this would be washing would it be ok to pitch for the next batch. I would like to reuse this liquid yeast a few more times. Also is distilled water ok or do i need to boil spring or filtered water?

 

[ACESFULL]

Ok so I have 2 beers fermenting ATM and I am going to attempt to "wash/reuse" my yeast. Now went ahead with the mason jars and boiled for at least 20 min removed the jars added lids etc. Now that they have cooled for a little while I noticed I have some sediment at the bottom of the jars. Should I be worried about this or would the long boil kill anything that may be at the bottom? This water was drawn straight out of the tap.

 

[Aschecte]

If i were to do this racking a beer then making another the next day doing a small 2 gal batch. Would i just scoop a half small jar of the used yeast adding sanitized water to fill it up the rest of the way, let it sit on the counter overnight then when i brew just pour off the water and pitch. Or do i have to stick it in the fridge over night?
Also im dryhopping in a hop sack with this beer,since this would be washing would it be ok to pitch for the next batch. I would like to reuse this liquid yeast a few more times. Also is distilled water ok or do i need to boil spring or filtered water?

Do not use distilled or RO water as the osmotic pressure in RO water will cause the yeast cell wall to rupture. I believe the general consensus will be to just use boiled and cooled tap water.

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[Accidic]

Ok so I have 2 beers fermenting ATM and I am going to attempt to "wash/reuse" my yeast. Now went ahead with the mason jars and boiled for at least 20 min removed the jars added lids etc. Now that they have cooled for a little while I noticed I have some sediment at the bottom of the jars. Should I be worried about this or would the long boil kill anything that may be at the bottom? This water was drawn straight out of the tap.

I've seen sediment in very large cylindrical containers after a boil that turned out to just be calcium deposits. I might be a little concerned given the small size depending on volume. If it is just your water you could reproduce it with another small boil in another jar. Plus you'd get a little more water to use while washing.

That said, I've used bottled water in a pinch and had zero issues with it. As mentioned above don't use bottled or distilled but plain filtered or UV treated is fine. The way many are processed the oxygen content is minimal anyway and frankly anyone washing from carboys is adding far more oxygen no matter how they do it anyway and you see no outcry that it's not possible with carboyed yeast cakes...

 

[BullGator]

Ok, there are many pages and I read over half but have not seen anybody with a similar question. So I brewed an IPA dry-hopped with about 2.5 oz of hop pellets. I believe I followed the procedure exactly and I think I screwed it up big time. I poured the cooled boiled water in the glass carboy (of course after I siphoned my beer off). I let it sit for about 20 to 25 minutes. There were definitely 3 distinct layers in the carboy. So when trying to decant in the carboy, I first had a hard time getting it to decant without mixing because of the weight of the carboy with water. But there was still clear liquid on top. Then because I thought there might be too much of the clear liquid I poured off a little. So I let the larger jar sit for around 20 minutes. I saw what appeared to be cloudy water up top and darker material on the bottom and a thin white line in the middle. I then poured this into 4 smaller jars and put in the fridge.

Here's my problem. The first 2 jars have no cake at the bottom after 2 days and are still just cloudy water/beer. The last 2 jars (that I thought had gotten too much trub in) look like everyone's picture here of the final product. So here are some of my thoughts: 1 - I may need a bigger initial mason jar. 2 - I may have had too much fluid or I need to 'pour off' some more of the clear fluid. 3 - I may need to pour out the entire contents of the carboy into another container to start with because of the mixing. 4 - I think having all the hop pellets in suspension may have 'blurred' the line between the yeast and the trub.

Well, at least I have 2 viable jars (i think). Thoughts?

 

[jonmohno]

Not much responses on this thread,ive never done this yet, but i would say try a starter? Your 2nd pic looked better, but in your 2nd pic this liquid is what you added to the water? Then threw out the bottem trub? It almost looks like you wanted to keep the stuff in the bottem of your 2nd pic.Meaning toss the liquid then splitt the sediment between the jars.
Im unshure which way i want to try this,either scooping up some from the fermenter letting it seperate ,pouring the cloudy water then using that.All in a day or two? Thats where im uncertain. Im kinda confused as hell.

 

[sheeshomatic]

That first picture it looks like you have a good 1/4 inch layer of yeast sitting on top of the trub, but it is somewhat tough to tell.

What you *might* have done wrong was letting the initial wash settle a little too long. When you add your boiled cooled water to the carboy and shake it up, you want to wait long enough for the trub to settle but NOT the yeast. Your liquid should be cloudy and you noted that it was clear. You want to be decanting that cloudy liquid into your jars/gallon jug for the second wash.

 

[Accidic]

Here's my problem. The first 2 jars have no cake at the bottom after 2 days and are still just cloudy water/beer. The last 2 jars (that I thought had gotten too much trub in) look like everyone's picture here of the final product. So here are some of my thoughts: 1 - I may need a bigger initial mason jar. 2 - I may have had too much fluid or I need to 'pour off' some more of the clear fluid. 3 - I may need to pour out the entire contents of the carboy into another container to start with because of the mixing. 4 - I think having all the hop pellets in suspension may have 'blurred' the line between the yeast and the trub.

Well, at least I have 2 viable jars (i think). Thoughts?

I double wash to avoid the trub almost completely but I get less yeast as a result. In all likelihood the reason you're cloudy is yeast suspension in my experience and fwiw those yeast are the best yeast to work with as they seem to be much healthier. If it takes more than 4 days for the water to become clear I won't bother with a starter out to 2wks so long as I have enough slurry regardless of OG of the target. My first try ended up a lot like yours tho. I migrated to a large pickle jar for the first and a decent size for the second and usually put in cup jars to make three slurry easy to measure. I can't imagine your hops are staying suspended with no activity more than 24hrs tho.

 

[BullGator]

ok, well I got to page 63 of this post and realized my problem. My yeast was WLP007 which White Labs says is "highly flocculent". So I think my yeast settled out much faster than the 20 to 25 min I waited. Also I guess I was supposed to wash from the primary (which for some reason I didn't catch even after reading over 60 pages of this thread). I surmise that I compounded this problem by washing from secondary using a highly flocculent yeast. Double Whammy!

Well, I have another IPA in primary now where I used WLP005 so I will have another chance (although different strain).

My only question now is I wonder if the 2 jars I did get are worth anything? They appear to be ok but I am not sure how much trub I got in there.

 

[gingerdawg]

ok, well I got to page 63 of this post and realized my problem. My yeast was WLP007 which White Labs says is "highly flocculent". So I think my yeast settled out much faster than the 20 to 25 min I waited. Also I guess I was supposed to wash from the primary (which for some reason I didn't catch even after reading over 60 pages of this thread). I surmise that I compounded this problem by washing from secondary using a highly flocculent yeast. Double Whammy!

Well, I have another IPA in primary now where I used WLP005 so I will have another chance (although different strain).

My only question now is I wonder if the 2 jars I did get are worth anything? They appear to be ok but I am not sure how much trub I got in there.

You'll have yeast. It just may take a couple more step-ups with the starter.

 

[wolverinebrewer]

ok, well I got to page 63 of this post and realized my problem. My yeast was WLP007 which White Labs says is "highly flocculent". So I think my yeast settled out much faster than the 20 to 25 min I waited. Also I guess I was supposed to wash from the primary (which for some reason I didn't catch even after reading over 60 pages of this thread). I surmise that I compounded this problem by washing from secondary using a highly flocculent yeast. Double Whammy!

IMO, I don't think the yeast will settle out that fast. By looking at your jars, you either didn't wait long enough or somehow sucked up a bunch of trub and hops.
My washing method is a different than here. Since, when I wash, I always fill up 8 pint jars (8*16oz=128 oz) I only add about 140 oz. of water to the bucket. This allows me to get a higher concentration of yeast in each jar. After I add the water, I shake it up for a good 20 seconds to break up the yeast cake and get all of it into suspension. Then I let it settle for 30 min. Using my sanitized auto-siphon, I keep just the black tip under the surface and suck up just the top liquid. I move my outlet hose from jar to jar as they fill. As the liquid in the bucket lowers, I gently lower the siphon. After all jars are filled, the siphon should be just above the trub line. The reason I don't put more water in the bucket is because the yeast concentration will be thinner and you won't get as much in each jar. Then just boil the lids, add the rings, date the jars, and refrigerate. This should only take about 45 min.

As far as what you have there, I am not sure I would use any of it only because they aren't "clean". Just my $.02.

 

[Esmitee]

IMO, I don't think the yeast will settle out that fast. By looking at your jars, you either didn't wait long enough or somehow sucked up a bunch of trub and hops.
My washing method is a different than here. Since, when I wash, I always fill up 8 pint jars (8*16oz=128 oz) I only add about 140 oz. of water to the bucket. This allows me to get a higher concentration of yeast in each jar. After I add the water, I shake it up for a good 20 seconds to break up the yeast cake and get all of it into suspension. Then I let it settle for 30 min. Using my sanitized auto-siphon, I keep just the black tip under the surface and suck up just the top liquid. I move my outlet hose from jar to jar as they fill. As the liquid in the bucket lowers, I gently lower the siphon. After all jars are filled, the siphon should be just above the trub line. The reason I don't put more water in the bucket is because the yeast concentration will be thinner and you won't get as much in each jar. Then just boil the lids, add the rings, date the jars, and refrigerate. This should only take about 45 min.

As far as what you have there, I am not sure I would use any of it only because they aren't "clean". Just my $.02.

So you really only Wash the yeast 1 time...Carefully right?

Do you have help with the end of the hose while you do this method?

I ferment in a glass carboy, soo Little HOLE, Not so good to move around easy!

Last time I washed, I used someone's ( I forget who at the moment...SORRY)
cool trick to gather most of the yeast and hardly no trub.

It worked great and kicked my self in the ass for not thinking of it LOL,

Just add your water, shake, and then lay the carboy on the side slowly, It won't spill out, cause you don't have that much water in there and the mix won't get even close to the neck of the carboy.

when you decant, do it slow and NO trub goes over the high side, it just slides to the neck .At that point, I have collected enough mix in my 1 gal jar.

Gotta LOVE this place with all the info one can gather!!!

 

[wolverinebrewer]

So you really only Wash the yeast 1 time...Carefully right?

Do you have help with the end of the hose while you do this method?

I ferment in a glass carboy, soo Little HOLE, Not so good to move around easy!

Last time I washed, I used someone's ( I forget who at the moment...SORRY)
cool trick to gather most of the yeast and hardly no trub.

It worked great and kicked my self in the ass for not thinking of it LOL,

Just add your water, shake, and then lay the carboy on the side slowly, It won't spill out, cause you don't have that much water in there and the mix won't get even close to the neck of the carboy.

when you decant, do it slow and NO trub goes over the high side, it just slides to the neck .At that point, I have collected enough mix in my 1 gal jar.

Gotta LOVE this place with all the info one can gather!!!

Yes, I only wash one time. Thirty minutes is enough time to settle all of the crap you don't want while keeping the yeast in suspension.

My method works best with 2 people but I do manage it myself. I have a large stock pot that holds 7 pint jars tightly so I don't have to worry about one tipping over. One hand holds the outlet hose, one holds the auto siphon.
I have also used a carboy and the tip-sideways method but the issue of pouring it out while being steady was hard to do because I always ended up moving abruptly causing wave action which messed up the settling. Shaking up the carboy with only a little more than a gal. of water plus the yeast cake is not hard to do. I like my way much better because after I shake it up and let it sit, I never have to move it. I just lower the auto-siphon, pump a couple of times, and suck away. After moving the outlet hose from jar to jar, just use a star-san soaked napkin to wipe the mouth of the jar where the liquid dripped. Let it dry and add your hot lids.
This is no different than racking your beer into your bottling bucket with a siphon. Now you are just racking the yeast solution into pint jars.

 

[Esmitee]

wolverine, If I fermented in a bucket, I would give your way a try. Sounds very easy. AND I'M LAZY to boot. You way sounds fast and easy and with Good results. If it works for you, I'd stick with works best.

I tried the auto siphon once with my wife on the end of the hose (where she should be ) lol But it didn't work out too well. I may try it again though. 1 thing with a carboy and the large auto siphon is, it fits so tight at bung hole, it hard to move the siphon around.

All in ALL i'd give your method a try if I got a bucket!

 

[bmock79]

So now that I have washed my first batch of yeast and have collected four jars how do I know how big of a starter to make?

I am confused on this step for sure. I normally use mr malty and Im not sure how or what info to enter.

Any help is appreciated. Thanks

 

[wolverinebrewer]

wolverine, If I fermented in a bucket, I would give your way a try. Sounds very easy. AND I'M LAZY to boot. You way sounds fast and easy and with Good results. If it works for you, I'd stick with works best.

I tried the auto siphon once with my wife on the end of the hose (where she should be ) lol But it didn't work out too well. I may try it again though. 1 thing with a carboy and the large auto siphon is, it fits so tight at bung hole, it hard to move the siphon around.

All in ALL i'd give your method a try if I got a bucket!

It works equally as well with a carboy because there is no need to move the siphon around. Just hold it straight down and steadily lower it.

So now that I have washed my first batch of yeast and have collected four jars how do I know how big of a starter to make?

I am confused on this step for sure. I normally use mr malty and Im not sure how or what info to enter.

Any help is appreciated. Thanks

Put your beer numbers (OG and gal.) into Malty. Then change the 'harvest date' on that calendar to the date you washed the yeast. Then click on the "repitching from slurry" tab. Move the "yeast concentration" all the way to the right to where it says 'thick yeast'. This gives you the mL. of yeast you need. And it's only the thick yeast cake on the bottom. Nothing more. Calculate the volume of yeast cake you have by using the vol. of a cylinder formula (v=pi*r2h) and then convert to mL. If you are using Ball mason jars, they usually have mL. marks on the side.

 

[Thehopguy]

I wish these instructions would have mentioned something about a canning rack. Maybe this is common knowledge for most people but I did not know the jars were going to scorch my kettle.

This is my only kettle and I'll have to use this for brewing beer still. Will this have any negative effects on the beer?

 

[sheeshomatic]

No.

 

[EarthBound]

I've never used a canning rack nor scorched my kettle like that. Is it SS or Al?

 

[Thehopguy]

i've never used a canning rack nor scorched my kettle like that. Is it ss or al?

ss

 

[brian_n]

I made a Pale Ale with Nottingham Dry and yesterday transferred to the secondary after 10 days. I followed these instructions, but after my two 24oz mason jars sat in the fridge for an hour I had like an inch of yeast on the top of container, and the rest was sediment. So I poured what little yeast I had from both into three other sanitized containers, and left the rest of the sediment and yeast in one of the 24oz jars. Got home from work today, and all four containers had significant separation. In below pic, the right jar is what I think is the yeast, and the left jar shows what I had a bunch of last night. I did one more transfer of the liquid than most yeast washing instructions say, but is there any reason I shouldn't be able to use the yeast in the jar on the right in a starter? And if there isn't, would that be an appropriate amount of yeast to use in a normal 5 gallon batch?

 

[pabloj13]

I made a Pale Ale with Nottingham Dry and yesterday transferred to the secondary after 10 days. I followed these instructions, but after my two 24oz mason jars sat in the fridge for an hour I had like an inch of yeast on the top of container, and the rest was sediment. So I poured what little yeast I had from both into three other sanitized containers, and left the rest of the sediment and yeast in one of the 24oz jars. Got home from work today, and all four containers had significant separation. In below pic, the right jar is what I think is the yeast, and the left jar shows what I had a bunch of last night. I did one more transfer of the liquid than most yeast washing instructions say, but is there any reason I shouldn't be able to use the yeast in the jar on the right in a starter? And if there isn't, would that be an appropriate amount of yeast to use in a normal 5 gallon batch?

A lot of the threads I have been reading where people had trouble washing were with the Nottingham. At $2 something a pack, is it worth washing and re-using?

 

[jonmohno]

I would pitch the white stuff, looks like thats your yeast.

 

[Thehopguy]

I washed my yeast and have 4 pint jars full of yeast but I'm confused about how to reuse the slurry.

I use mr. malty and it tells you how many mL of slurry you need but do I make a starter or just pitch x amount of mL straight into the fermenter?

If I do make a starter how many liters of water do i need. or in other words, how big of a starter with x amount of mL?

 

[Accidic]

Starter is safest. If it's over a month old I wouldn't dare pitch without doing a starter (a friend of mine cuts off at 2 weeks) and tbh I usually do a starter anyway as there cheap and you can go the malta route with bottled water without a boil for under a buck. Make sure you added in the age of the slurry on mr malty tho. Amount of slurry needed increases the older yeast.

 

[vegas20s]

Well I tried this for the first time. I was using us-05. Yes I know it's cheap but so am I. Anyways followed all the instructions. I had to jars to use and they were around month old. I just shook them up and tossed into the batch. No starter. I was a little worried about and under pitch. But after 24 hours I got vigorous fermentation. And now 3 days later I see a nice thick yeast cake has formed. Now that I now I can do this successfully I won't mind spending a little more on liquid yeast. Just another reason to love HBT.

 

[i4ourgot]

Sorry if someone answered this question but is there an easy way to tell if the washed yeast in your mason jars is not good to use, does it smell or look different? Thanks

 

[jonmohno]

When it looks like peanut butter and you do a starter and it smells like rubber or something.

 

[Reno_eNVy]

Washed some 1272 on the 29th, first wash in a while since I've been using mostly dry yeast the last couple years. It went really well, but medium sized jar definitely got the most junk along with the yeast. No worries, though.

First photo is right after washing. Second photo is about 48hrs in the fridge

 

[Reno_eNVy]

Another 48hrs and there is complete separation. Now all I have to do is wait for my new propane hose to come in the mail and I can use the big jar on my next brew :rockin: