Why does all Samuel Adams Beer Taste Bad?

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TheMadKing said:
Most beers do not benefit from cellering, the exceptions being barleywine and sours.
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Add to the list of exceptions? Lagers, Stouts, Porters, California Common, Saisons, probably many more I can't think of right now.
But back to the original subject of Sam Adams: I agree many of their offerings aren't all that great, but homebrewers and beer nerds (enthusiasts)
aren't their target market. Sam Adams is a large industrial brewery seeking mass acceptance.
 
madscientist451 said:
Add to the list of exceptions? Lagers, Stouts, Porters, California Common, Saisons, probably many more I can't think of right now.

But back to the original subject of Sam Adams: I agree many of their offerings aren't all that great, but homebrewers and beer nerds (enthusiasts)

aren't their target market. Sam Adams is a large industrial brewery seeking mass acceptance.
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Disagree, lagers should be lagered appropriately but, as I said, a 2 year old pilsner was absolutely ruined.

Stouts and porters should be consumed within 3 months of brewing. RIS is a different story and should be aged though.

California common I don't know enough about, but arrogant bastard and dead guy both should not be aged excessively (less than 6 months). and Saisons are designed to be consumed young and fresh, and should never be aged... They shouldn't even be a thing for that matter.. Nasty clove flavored Belgian milkshake [emoji16]
 
I've tried most of SA's beers including their Winter variety 12 pack and never desired to drink most of them again. Oktoberfest is the only SA beer I'll buy every year. It's not great but at least I can use the empty bottles for my home brew.
 
My hypothesis on SA is not specific to them, but to any bottled beer. The beer you poured from a bottle at your house is absolutely NOT the same beer that left the brewery. Sam Adams is going to really suffer from this, since they are sold everywhere...from bottle shops to convenience stores. There is no telling how many miles are on that bottle. You brew a batch, or get something fresh and local, there is good reason why that beer tastes so much better.

Judging SA by the skunked bottle you bought at Sheetz isnt really a fair assessment.
 
mesooohoppy said:
I don't like sam adams because I remember their owner stating he wasn't an 'ipa guy' and that isn't what they make, from an interview. which is fine, I don't have a problem with that, (I don't like traditional Belgian beers and I don't ***** about it).

What I do have a problem with is the fact that 6 months later, not only did I see a couple of brand new sam adams ipas on my local shelves, i also saw a flippin mixed ipa pack from sam adams.... they obviously realized the huge market for ipas and decided they wanted to cash in on that money train. that is what bothers me to no end.

i realize this thread is about the taste of the beer, but there is something more important than taste when discussing beer, its character of the person/brewery brewing it. i love ipas, and ill be damned if i am going to support a brewery that 'doesnt like' ipas, yet still brews them.
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To be fair he wasn't on board for most of the stuff they've come out with thats why he only does commercials for Boston Lager. Thats what happens when other people own more stock in your company than you do. And FWIW I think SA beer is mediocre at best. Maybe their Boston stuff is good but IIRC the majority of their beer is made in regional facilities not from home base.
Concrete Beach, which Koch started, beats the pants off anything Ive ever had from Sam Adams.
 
I don't actively seek out SA, but neither do I avoid it, with the notable exception of the Cherry Wheat, that stuff should be outlawed in civilized countries.

That said I really like their Noble Pils, Ruthless Rye, and for some bizarre reason I have a soft spot in my heart for Old Fezziwig.
 
mesooohoppy said:
I don't like sam adams because I remember their owner stating he wasn't an 'ipa guy' and that isn't what they make, from an interview. which is fine, I don't have a problem with that, (I don't like traditional Belgian beers and I don't ***** about it).

What I do have a problem with is the fact that 6 months later, not only did I see a couple of brand new sam adams ipas on my local shelves, i also saw a flippin mixed ipa pack from sam adams.... they obviously realized the huge market for ipas and decided they wanted to cash in on that money train. that is what bothers me to no end.

i realize this thread is about the taste of the beer, but there is something more important than taste when discussing beer, its character of the person/brewery brewing it. i love ipas, and ill be damned if i am going to support a brewery that 'doesnt like' ipas, yet still brews them.
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"cash in on the money train"?
Or how about Jim Koch runs a major business enterprise that employs hundreds of people, so despite his personal preferences, he reacts to the market demands so he can stay in business.
Yeah, what a sellout...
Come on, man - as a hobbyist, you can make whatever the hell you want without catering to anyone. If you were in the beer business, I guarantee you would make what the consumer wants, otherwise you'd be out of business.
 
I like quite a few SA products, and their Boston Lager is a great anytime go-to, but it really needs to be on draft from a place that goes through a lot of it (so it's fresh), and keeps good, clean lines. Under those circumstances, it's fantastic. I don't like it in bottles or cans though.

But they also make some other excellent beers - Cold Snap (unless you don't like coriander), their Double Bock is fantastic (if you can find it), and several of their other lagers and lighter IPAs.

If you're a hardcore hophead and are always drinking Pliny and Heady, then no, they don't make anything for your tastes. Or, if you are younger, and relatively new (within the last 10 years) to the beer scene, you probably have no appreciation for SA's contribution to the world of beer, and probably don't remember when Boston Lager was one of the only interesting beers you could get, at least on the East Coast (in which case, you probably also grew up with a beer palate more oriented toward newer, "extreme" styles, which is not what SA does or is known for).
 
sam adams is the beer to drink when that's all that's available other than the BMC on tap. It's consistent and i know what I am getting. to me it's better than lite, bud light, etc..

in bottles their rebel series is actually not to shabby.

but I don't bother with their Oktoberfest, since I am so close to Capitol brewery, who makes an Oktoberfest that I love.
 
I used to like their Oktoberfest, say, 10 years ago, but nowadays I feel like it is too caramelly for the style. (I don't think their recipe has changed - I just think I've had a lot more exposure to real German festbiers, and I think MOST american attempts at the style are too heavy and caramelly.
 
Cavpilot2000 said:
I used to like their Oktoberfest, say, 10 years ago, but nowadays I feel like it is too caramelly for the style. (I don't think their recipe has changed - I just think I've had a lot more exposure to real German festbiers, and I think MOST american attempts at the style are too heavy and caramelly.
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I agree that it's heavy for a festbier but that's because it's brewed more like a traditional Marzen :mug:

Festbier anymore is much lighter and more drinkable than the Marzen that used to be considered the same as oktoberfest beer.
 
Cavpilot2000 said:
"cash in on the money train"?
Or how about Jim Koch runs a major business enterprise that employs hundreds of people, so despite his personal preferences, he reacts to the market demands so he can stay in business.
Yeah, what a sellout...
Come on, man - as a hobbyist, you can make whatever the hell you want without catering to anyone. If you were in the beer business, I guarantee you would make what the consumer wants, otherwise you'd be out of business.
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The thing is the guy hasn't owned 50+% of Sam Adams for some time now. While as of 2012 he was still one of 5 people on their executive team "a number of financial institutions follow Koch in terms of ownership of the company, led by Neuberger Berman Group LLC with 14%. The ownership from these financial institutions comprise well over 25% of Boston Beer. "

http://www.beerpulse.com/2012/04/bo...jim-koch-owns-common-stock-worth-460-million/

My point here is he could have fought for everything he said in the video only to be overruled at the end of the day by other players in the business. This happens a lot.
 
I think Sam Adams is fine. All that I can get waaay up in the frozen north is Boston Lager and Rebel IPA, both are alright. Nothing mind blowing but I wouldn't turn one down if offered. I buy Sam Adams for the bottles, empty Rebel IPA bottles hold my homebrew very nicely.
 
To me, SA is just fine and I often order it when I'm out and the restaurant's only "different" offerings are Shock Top and Michelob Ultra. I have tried several SA brews and the only ones I have not enjoyed at all are the fruit beers. Oktoberfest is very good (usually) and Rebel IPA is pretty good (but not as good as many other readily available IPAs). Boston Lager is an extremely drinkable go-to beer.

Everyone is entitled to his opinion. The only time I question a person's opinion is when they say that xyz brewery makes bad beer because that person doesn't like the taste. One can say a beer tastes awful, but that doesn't mean the brewery makes bad beer.
 
IslandLizard said:
Questions?

If you don't like it, why do you buy SA beer then? Aren't there better choices out there you do like? How about your own homebrew?

I don't care for most SA beer either (anymore). There's so much better to be had nowadays, so I avoid it, it's simple. There are a few other breweries I just can't get into their beer either.
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True, but then again they aren't trend-chasers either.
They make solid, mostly classic style variations, and often classic styles don't go over well with the crowd that wants Heady Topper. Then again, while I love some NEIPA, I think Heady Topper so massively overhyped.
 
KeyWestBrewing said:
The thing is the guy hasn't owned 50+% of Sam Adams for some time now. While as of 2012 he was still one of 5 people on their executive team "a number of financial institutions follow Koch in terms of ownership of the company, led by Neuberger Berman Group LLC with 14%. The ownership from these financial institutions comprise well over 25% of Boston Beer. "

http://www.beerpulse.com/2012/04/bo...jim-koch-owns-common-stock-worth-460-million/

My point here is he could have fought for everything he said in the video only to be overruled at the end of the day by other players in the business. This happens a lot.
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Sure, but my point is that he would be dumb to fight that fight, because of the consumer/market realities.
Sticking to "your guns" and arguing against making what the consumer wants is just dumb and bad business. Making what the consumer wants isn't selling out - it's keeping your business afloat.
I mean sure, if Sam Adams were a punk band, Koch and crew should stick to what they like and what they believe in. But when you are a company with hundred of people depending on your decisions for a livelihood, you do what makes business sense.
 
TheMadKing said:
I agree that it's heavy for a festbier but that's because it's brewed more like a traditional Marzen :mug:

Festbier anymore is much lighter and more drinkable than the Marzen that used to be considered the same as oktoberfest beer.
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True, but I've been drinking a lot of German beers in the last few years (mainly because I'm making lots of trips to Germany in the last few years) and I still think "we" (Americans) tend to overdo it with caramel malts when brewing Marzens and Oktoberfests, but it's not surprising because "we" seem to think bigger/more is better in everything, and brewing is no exception (see the rise of West Coast IPA, Then NEIPA, and the "Imperialization" of everything).
I often lament that not many breweries do enough classic, old world styles, but then again, the American beer drinker's palate has become so attuned to "Big" beers (be it IBU, ABV, massive dry hops, or bourbon-barrel-triple-chocolate-mocha-cherry-latte-stout).
Too many drinkers here think classic styles are boring, so they don't buy or brew them.
That's not a value judgement, because to each his own, and who am I to say that there's anything wrong with a bourbon-barrel-triple-chocolate-mocha-cherry-latte-stout, but I lament that the nuanced delicacies of German lagers and British ales are so often lost to the newer trend-chasing "beer snob" crowd.

Okay, old curmudgeon rant complete.
 
Cavpilot2000 said:
True, but I've been drinking a lot of German beers in the last few years (mainly because I'm making lots of trips to Germany in the last few years) and I still think "we" (Americans) tend to overdo it with caramel malts when brewing Marzens and Oktoberfests, but it's not surprising because "we" seem to think bigger/more is better in everything, and brewing is no exception (see the rise of West Coast IPA, Then NEIPA, and the "Imperialization" of everything).
I often lament that not many breweries do enough classic, old world styles, but then again, the American beer drinker's palate has become so attuned to "Big" beers (be it IBU, ABV, massive dry hops, or bourbon-barrel-triple-chocolate-mocha-cherry-latte-stout).
Too many drinkers here think classic styles are boring, so they don't buy or brew them.
That's not a value judgement, because to each his own, and who am I to say that there's anything wrong with a bourbon-barrel-triple-chocolate-mocha-cherry-latte-stout, but I lament that the nuanced delicacies of German lagers and British ales are so often lost to the newer trend-chasing "beer snob" crowd.

Okay, old curmudgeon rant complete.
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Young curmudgeon agrees. I brew mostly old-world styles, specifically German styles. My last 4 brews have been a Dopplebock, ESB, Munich Lager, English Porter. I had several members of my brewing club say "while its really good, for what it is.. It's boring"

I think of it in painting terms: picasso did something new and exciting and crazy and was a great painter. Da vinci just painted the world around him the way we all see it, but he did it SO WELL that it stood out. That's my goal in brewing. :mug:
 
I'm not opposed to SA and in fact, I used to order one wherever possible. For better or worse, since home brewing, I have become more critical of beers I used to enjoy without question.
 
Boston Lager is a solid beer for what it is and I remember really enjoying their Cream Stout, though I haven't had one in a very long time.
 
boston lager is pretty much junk, their winter beers are pretty decent
 
my very first attempt at homebrew was an extract with specialty grains attempting to clone Boston Ale, back in like 1995. That house had a large "Florida" room with a huge brick fireplace and bluestone floors, perfect for cool fermenting in the spring, which was unique to the Boston Ale. Back then it was one the better beers we could find. Boston Lager soon moved it from the shelves
 
Anyhowe said:
One should not mistake 'bad' for not your preference.
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Exactly!

I don't think their beers are bad, and the "soapy" flavor some refer too, is probably their yeast. Many homebrews have a bit of a soapy flavor too.

Back in the days SA was a breath of fresh air in the world of beer. I really enjoyed their Boston Lager and Oktoberfest (on tap) and their variety of ales at the time. By today's standards, I think we expect more from craft beer. It has to be a superb lager or an exquisite ale that can stand alone against the competition.

For example, I really dig a draught of Blue Point's Toasted Lager or Devils Backbone's Vienna Lager. I've tasted them, compared them, judged them, side by side on many occasions, and find it hard to choose which I prefer. They are both wonderful, yet slightly different. Either can stand alone, and not just in a competition. Today's SA's Boston Lager wouldn't even come close to those two.

But, I also had the most wonderful Sam Adams' Pumpkin Ale (on tap), and for that style, it remains my favorite because I can still taste pumpkin! I'm sure many prefer any of the other different breweries' offers. More spicy, clovey, cinnamony, sweeter, drier, whatever. That's mostly preference.

During one of the beer festivals I came across Gordon Biersch' Oktoberfest. Hmm, I remember having had that in the past. GB never impressed me that much (aside from a sumptuous "dirty" Saison 11 years ago) and is really not all that "crafty" by today's standards, but what the heck... Perfect! Better than you would probably get in Germany, or anywhere else.
 
APendejo said:
Nope, 12 packs. Some of those SA mixed packs and Boston Lager.
The beer tasted ok but had that dirty mop water smell.
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I gotta say, man, that sounds like the rim of your glassware dried damp and got a little funky, not like the beer was bad. Obviously we'll never know either way, but especially if it was the aroma and not the taste...I've had glasses do that to me before.
 
I really like their Summer Ale. It's something I've been meaning to try making. Most everything I've tried of theirs (which is not many, since I live in the beer desert known as Newfoundland) has been enjoyable enough, if a bit unremarkable.

flattie said:
Can't bring myself to try their cherry wheat.
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I've had it, and I enjoyed it. Then again, I like cherries in beer, when it's done carefully (ie. doesn't taste like cough medicine).
 
There is no such thing as a 'bad" beer (unless it has faults) only different beer...
 
TheMadKing said:
I actually like several sam adams beers. The original Boston Lager is a very good beer, and is much better on tap than from a bottle. The octoberfest is not bad. There are certainly better octoberfests out there though. Their winter lager is also good, but it varies year to year since it's a seasonal. This year's was good.

I don't like any of their other beers though. I wouldn't call them watered down, as their alcohol content is correct for style, but they are intentionally designed to be approachable beers. So even their IPAs are not terribly hoppy. They sometimes do more extreme small batch beers, but I'm not close enough to Boston to actually get any of those.

Different strokes.. I don't like anything New Belgium has ever made.
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My understanding was many of their recipes now come from home brewers that win a yearly competition he does?
 
Cavpilot2000 said:
True, but I've been drinking a lot of German beers in the last few years (mainly because I'm making lots of trips to Germany in the last few years) and I still think "we" (Americans) tend to overdo it with caramel malts when brewing Marzens and Oktoberfests, but it's not surprising because "we" seem to think bigger/more is better in everything, and brewing is no exception (see the rise of West Coast IPA, Then NEIPA, and the "Imperialization" of everything).
I often lament that not many breweries do enough classic, old world styles, but then again, the American beer drinker's palate has become so attuned to "Big" beers (be it IBU, ABV, massive dry hops, or bourbon-barrel-triple-chocolate-mocha-cherry-latte-stout).
Too many drinkers here think classic styles are boring, so they don't buy or brew them.
That's not a value judgement, because to each his own, and who am I to say that there's anything wrong with a bourbon-barrel-triple-chocolate-mocha-cherry-latte-stout, but I lament that the nuanced delicacies of German lagers and British ales are so often lost to the newer trend-chasing "beer snob" crowd.

Okay, old curmudgeon rant complete.
Click to expand...

Never mind "curmudgeon," I think this type of thing needs to be said as a counterpoint to the obsession with bigger and bolder everything.

I cringe when I hear supposed beer enthusiasts dismiss, for example, classic German and English styles as garbage, then go on to extoll the virtues of the latest 10% ABV / 100 IBU IPA with a stupid name. I enjoy a crazy IIPA or bourbon barrel aged imperial stout once in a while too, but there is much more to the world of beer than what lay at its extremes. Likewise, occasionally I will enjoy some kind of meal that I drench in sriracha sauce; it makes for a nice complement to the lighter tasting meal I may have had the day before, but it’s not nearly my entire diet.

As for SABL, I think it’s a great product. I buy it from time to time and it never lets me down. Drank a whole bunch of it while in Boston this past summer… when in Rome, and all that.
 
TheMadKing said:
I actually like several sam adams beers. The original Boston Lager is a very good beer, and is much better on tap than from a bottle. The octoberfest is not bad. There are certainly better octoberfests out there though. Their winter lager is also good, but it varies year to year since it's a seasonal. This year's was good.

I don't like any of their other beers though. I wouldn't call them watered down, as their alcohol content is correct for style, but they are intentionally designed to be approachable beers. So even their IPAs are not terribly hoppy. They sometimes do more extreme small batch beers, but I'm not close enough to Boston to actually get any of those.

Different strokes.. I don't like anything New Belgium has ever made.
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Bought a 12 pack of the Winter Lager w/o having tasted it as it was a good price. UGGGGG. Couldn't finish the first bottle. Now I have 11 more I try to porn off to friends that visit. LOL
 
SA Boston Lager started me down this path 30 years ago ..... I'll forever have a special place in my heart for it. I beleive it was better 30 years ago, in terms of hop flavor and aroma but it could just be that my tastes have evolved.
 

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