RIMS for Dummies

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I've been lurking on this forum for a really long time and never got around to actually registering. It seems that every question I had was either already answered or my local club fellows had the answers.

I started about two years ago and still use my 10-gallon Igloo cooler system with a march pump just to avoid lifting hot liquids.

In the last 6 weeks I've accumulated all I think I need to build out my Initial automated RIMS system.

This thread, along with all the individual build threads, has been the single greatest source of information for me.

Just wanted to throw the thank you out there to everyone that's participated here and made it easier for noobs like me to plan out a system.

-S
 
Hey all. been lurking for awhile and finally decided to go for this!

Just ordered the following:
http://bostonheatingsupply.com/sp10868gl.aspx
-Rheem SP10868GL 9.5" 120V 2000W Stainless Steel Element

-Liquid Tight RTD Sensor 4" from Auber

http://www.brewershardware.com/RIMS-Tube/
-RIMS TUBE

-Auber 1/16DIN Control Box

-Auber 40A SSR

-Auber 40A Heat Sink

Can someone help me figure out which 1/16 PID is the best for this application from Auber? Is is the 2352???

I was looking at the wiring diagram on the first post and it looks like the pump and element are on the same circuit and plug for that matter. The way that is wired does the switch turn both the PID and pump on/off or just the pump? (I couldn't find a switch on auber that handles more than 10A so I am still searching for that)

What kind of wire should i use throughout and for the power cord? 12 gauge?

Is a Magnetic March Pump(from Morebeer.com, the improved version) better mounted vertically or horizontally for flow?

Is the RIMS tube better mounted horizontally or vertically for flow?

This is my first real electrical project other than changing out some basic outlets and stuff but thats easy...

Am I missing anything?
 
sethhobrin said:
Hey all. been lurking for awhile and finally decided to go for this!

Just ordered the following:
http://bostonheatingsupply.com/sp10868gl.aspx
-Rheem SP10868GL 9.5" 120V 2000W Stainless Steel Element

-Liquid Tight RTD Sensor 4" from Auber

http://www.brewershardware.com/RIMS-Tube/
-RIMS TUBE

-Auber 1/16DIN Control Box

-Auber 40A SSR

-Auber 40A Heat Sink

Can someone help me figure out which 1/16 PID is the best for this application from Auber? Is is the 2352???

I was looking at the wiring diagram on the first post and it looks like the pump and element are on the same circuit and plug for that matter. The way that is wired does the switch turn both the PID and pump on/off or just the pump? (I couldn't find a switch on auber that handles more than 10A so I am still searching for that)

What kind of wire should i use throughout and for the power cord? 12 gauge?

Is a Magnetic March Pump(from Morebeer.com, the improved version) better mounted vertically or horizontally for flow?

Is the RIMS tube better mounted horizontally or vertically for flow?

This is my first real electrical project other than changing out some basic outlets and stuff but thats easy...

Am I missing anything?
Click to expand...

In the first diagram of this thread the element is switched by the SSR and the pump with a single pole switch.
2352 is good
12G (solid) is rated for 20A
120V (20A)switch from Radio Shack or standard wall switch(20A)
Pump orientation is debatable. March says output up, others say horizontal.
RIMS tube doesn't matter as long as the output is up for air to bleed.
 
I've been having trouble getting my rims to accurately measure mash temps.
I my build is like the original post, have a 4 inch probe going into my tube and have it plumbed so the input flows over the probe before passing over the element and exiting the RIMS tube. My RIMS is mounted vertically (element on the bottom) and recirculates the wort in my round coleman mashtun with a kal style sparge arm.
My mash temps seem to always start out accurate, but when I ramp up the temperature for saccrification from protein rest it always seems to overheat the mash by 5-8*F.
Is there a reason why it would do this? And what can I do to fix it?
 
Thundercougarfalconbird said:
I've been having trouble getting my rims to accurately measure mash temps.
I my build is like the original post, have a 4 inch probe going into my tube and have it plumbed so the input flows over the probe before passing over the element and exiting the RIMS tube. My RIMS is mounted vertically (element on the bottom) and recirculates the wort in my round coleman mashtun with a kal style sparge arm.
My mash temps seem to always start out accurate, but when I ramp up the temperature for saccrification from protein rest it always seems to overheat the mash by 5-8*F.
Is there a reason why it would do this? And what can I do to fix it?
Click to expand...

My setup is reverse. The wort flows into the rims tube, over the element, then past the temp probe.
 
Thundercougarfalconbird said:
I've been having trouble getting my rims to accurately measure mash temps.
I my build is like the original post, have a 4 inch probe going into my tube and have it plumbed so the input flows over the probe before passing over the element and exiting the RIMS tube. My RIMS is mounted vertically (element on the bottom) and recirculates the wort in my round coleman mashtun with a kal style sparge arm.
My mash temps seem to always start out accurate, but when I ramp up the temperature for saccrification from protein rest it always seems to overheat the mash by 5-8*F.
Is there a reason why it would do this? And what can I do to fix it?
Click to expand...

Are you using a PID? If so, what kind?
 
Thundercougarfalconbird said:
I've been having trouble getting my rims to accurately measure mash temps.
I my build is like the original post, have a 4 inch probe going into my tube and have it plumbed so the input flows over the probe before passing over the element and exiting the RIMS tube. My RIMS is mounted vertically (element on the bottom) and recirculates the wort in my round coleman mashtun with a kal style sparge arm.
My mash temps seem to always start out accurate, but when I ramp up the temperature for saccrification from protein rest it always seems to overheat the mash by 5-8*F.
Is there a reason why it would do this? And what can I do to fix it?
Click to expand...

Simple fix. The PID doesn't matter. The probe must be after the element, otherwise the element doesn't know when the output has reached temp. Go back over the original post, it describes it correctly. I'd flip it over and have your wort go in the bottom also.
 
Huh, that just seemed counter intuitive to me, like the PID would immediately shut off the element every time it turned on as it will heat the wort in the tube very quickly. I suppose it will immediately kick back on though. Hrmmm
Ok, so wort into the bottom, element on bottom. Wort out on top, probe on top.
If thats the case I just need to reverse my lines. Bah to think I set it up that way for a brew im in the middle of at the moment and reversed them thinking I had it set up backwards. :drunk:
 
It will be switching on and off alot, yes. But that is the SSR's intended function. You can experiment with tweaking the speed of the wort flow to maximize the heating times. But no matter the speed, trust me it won't overshoot if you set it according to how hot it comes OUT of the RIMS tube, rather than how hot it is going in.
 
I appreciate the help :mug: Thank god I check my mashtemps frequently. I overshot this pils by like 6*f but just added cold water to get the correct temp and used the cooler the old fashioned way.
Hopefully next brewday I'll finally have the hang of this thing.
 
I'm having a similar problem. My rims tube is set up correctly, but my mash temps are overshooting big time. Ill have the set temp at 152 and the temp reading will go up to 158, sometimes higher. And what's even more confusing is that the pid is still turning my heating element on when it is reading over the set temp? What is going on? Any ideas? Is there a calibration I can do?
 
armurray189, which pid do you have? Most have an autotune feature that you should run on your specific system with conditions as close to that of brewing as possible.
 
Thundercougarfalconbird said:
What is the autotune command for an auber syl-2352? I'd like to recalibrate mine
Click to expand...


Get into setup mode.
Go to At and change the value to 1 or 2. 2 if your ready right now to autotune or 1 to get autotune ready then press A/M to start the autotune.

Here's the link to the 2352 manual. You really should become familiar with it. Autotune is on page 4. Section 4.4.3.
 
stlbeer said:
armurray189, which pid do you have? Most have an autotune feature that you should run on your specific system with conditions as close to that of brewing as possible.
Click to expand...

I'm using an auber syl-2352
 
So when you auto tune, do you start the auto tune and then run it through an entire mash? (From heating strike water to mash out)
 
armurray189 said:
So when you auto tune, do you start the auto tune and then run it through an entire mash? (From heating strike water to mash out)
Click to expand...


You don't have to run it through and entire mash, in fact it won't run that long. SO it's best to set the SV to a temp you would normally mash at - 148-152 *F then when start up the pump and heating the water, etc. Set the flow to what you would when you mash - not full open since that generally results in a stuck mash. Then when it gets to about 10*F below the SV, turn on autotune. LET IT RUN TO COMPLETION. It will probably overshoot your SV. Let it alone. It will probably go less than your SV. Let it alone. It is determining your systems ability to heat water and how quickly it loses heat.

When it's done it'll be damn close to where it needs to be. Then do it again on a brew day with wort. After that you shouldn't have too many issues.

Realize that if your flow rate changes, don't expect your PID to compensate automatically for it. It knows nothing of your flow rate, just the ability to apply heat to that part of your system. This is why you put the temp probe after the heater element and not before.

Good luck! and report back if this doesn't work.
 
stlbeer said:
...
Realize that if your flow rate changes, don't expect your PID to compensate automatically for it. It knows nothing of your flow rate, just the ability to apply heat to that part of your system. This is why you put the temp probe after the heater element and not before.

Good luck! and report back if this doesn't work.
Click to expand...
Excellent advice. Well done!

P-J
 
I built the tubes exactly as depicted on the first post in this thread. I too could not regulate temperature correctly. My tubes are mounted vertically. I had to swap the out flow and the RTD, i.e. put the outflow on the top. I can now hold my mash temps within a degree. There is too much dead space on the top when using 1.5 inch pipe and a 3 inch RTD. Thought I would post as this worked for me.
 
Picture for clarity.

IMG_0279.jpg
 
fxbghokie said:
I built the tubes exactly as depicted on the first post in this thread. I too could not regulate temperature correctly. My tubes are mounted vertically. I had to swap the out flow and the RTD, i.e. put the outflow on the top. I can now hold my mash temps within a degree. There is too much dead space on the top when using 1.5 inch pipe and a 3 inch RTD. Thought I would post as this worked for me.
Click to expand...

I had the same problem with a 2 inch RTD though my tube was mounted horizontally. Got the 4 inch RTD and problem solved. Glad to hear you found a suitable solution. It's nice to get the problems solved.
 
Finally got around to building a new brew stand with a rims tube inspired from this thread. Not done yet but I'm almost there.

image-627044479.jpg


image-3023680411.jpg


image-98300426.jpg
 
GoodDogShelby said:
Rossi46, sorry if this is a stupid question, I am new at this, but why 3 pumps?
Click to expand...

Mostly because I'm lazy, but I got them for all three brand new for $300 they are 815's so it was like buy 2 get one free.
 
Man my butt hurts just from looking at your bike, I have a Street Glide for touring I had to trade in my Nightster though :(
Nice brew setup BTW, can you get closer pics of your pumps? When I build my stand I am going to have to actually mount my pumps to my stand and was just curious if you used street elbows with camlocks on them.

Thanks,
-G
 
The rides really not bad. The saddle is mounted to an adjustable air shock, so it has some give to it.
Any way the pumps have street elbows and the hoses have street elbows to complete the 180.

image-234445088.jpg


image-123747953.jpg
 
I hope this hasn't already been answered, but when wiring everything together, what kind of wire is used for everything?

I have the Auber SYL-2362 controller, 120v 1500w heating element, 25A SSR, March pump, and switches to turn everything on/off. I have designed it much like the OP. I am just not sure of the wire? Specifically what gauge. Is it all the same or is it different, ie, controller to SSR vs SSR to heating element.

I have done some electrical work, but it has been mainly with wiring outlets in a house during a remodel, using 12-2 or 14-2 Romex wire.

Thanks.
 
I used 10 gauge and 16 gauge inside my control panel. 10 is overkill but I already had some. For the element I used 12-3 so cord.

image-1789707742.jpg
 
hey Rossi how far in your Mash Tun does that temp probe go?

I've been running two temp probes as well, one in the tail of the RIMS tube, which is convention, and one in the base of the sight-glass. I use it to monitor the delta between what the RIMS is maintaining and the actual tun temp just in case there is a variance.

I had been noticing about a 2 degree difference but then during a mash on Sunday stuck my thermo pen down inside the grain bed and realized that the bed was holding the rims temp and only losing about 1/2 a degree. I realized that my temp probe just isn't getting into the center of the tun enough to get a reading on the actual grain bed and the variance is probably caused by the fact that it's so close to the edge of the kettle.

how far in does yours go and what type of variances are you seeing if any?
 
ScottSingleton said:
hey Rossi how far in your Mash Tun does that temp probe go?

I've been running two temp probes as well, one in the tail of the RIMS tube, which is convention, and one in the base of the sight-glass. I use it to monitor the delta between what the RIMS is maintaining and the actual tun temp just in case there is a variance.

I had been noticing about a 2 degree difference but then during a mash on Sunday stuck my thermo pen down inside the grain bed and realized that the bed was holding the rims temp and only losing about 1/2 a degree. I realized that my temp probe just isn't getting into the center of the tun enough to get a reading on the actual grain bed and the variance is probably caused by the fact that it's so close to the edge of the kettle.

how far in does yours go and what type of variances are you seeing if any?
Click to expand...

I got a six inch probe. I haven't brewed with it yet. I planning the maiden voyage on Saturday.
 
Electrical moron here....any detailed info/pics on control panel wiring for just the RIMS element? I'm building one to be used with NG fired boil kettle.

Don't worry, my electrical engineer brother is going to double check it for me prior to testing, but he's too busy to build it for me...kids will do that I guess.

Thanks in advance. Sorry if it is earlier in the thread, I read 30 some pages and gave up looking.
 
billysparrows said:
Electrical moron here....any detailed info/pics on control panel wiring for just the RIMS element? I'm building one to be used with NG fired boil kettle.

Don't worry, my electrical engineer brother is going to double check it for me prior to testing, but he's too busy to build it for me...kids will do that I guess.

Thanks in advance. Sorry if it is earlier in the thread, I read 30 some pages and gave up looking.
Click to expand...
Here you go:
(Please note that the RIMS is interlocked with the pump so that the RIMS cannot fire unless the pump is switched on.)

As always - click on the image to see a full scale diagram printable on Tabloid paper (11" x 17")



Hope this helps you.

P-J

(EDIT: Wow. I just posted # 1000 in this thread.)
 

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