Corn Sugar Storage + Yeast Resurrection?

[Simon McIlroy]

Disclaimer - again I'm new to this forum and just getting back into brewing after a 2+ year break, so please forgive anything stupid I say and mods, please feel free to move this post into a more fitting thread.

So I'm gearing up to brew my first batch of beer in 2+ years and I am going to attempt to revive a 1 year old vial of Whitelabs Abbey Ale yeast that was stored in a cold fridge using my stir plate and Erlenmeyer flask. I've used this system before with great success, but not for reviving yeast this old.

I picked up a 4lb bag of corn surgar off Amazon (great price for the volume) to hopefully get it going but I'm concerned about how to properly store it, as my past attempt at storing corn sugar ended up with it turning into a brick, even though the bag was sealed.

Also, if this is a fools errands and this yeast is unquestionably deceased feel free to let me know so I don't waste time and resources.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[IslandLizard]

You shouldn't use corn sugar (dextrose) for making yeast starters, especially yeast that will be used for fermenting beer.

Use beer wort instead, it contains maltose and pretty much all nutrients the yeast needs.
Make the starter at a ratio of 1:10 DME to water. For example: 100 gram DME per 1 liter (1000ml) water.
That should yield a bit over a liter of starter wort at a gravity of around 1.037.

If the yeast is particularly old or potentially damaged, start with smaller, lower gravity starter worts, to get her acclimated, preventing cell shock. Then step up to get to the (proper) cell count for your pitch.

Here's a yeast/starter calculator as a guide for how many cells you'd need for your pitch:
http://www.brewunited.com/yeast_calculator.php
Keep your dextrose (powder) dry in well-sealing (e.g., Ziplock type) plastic bags. When closing, push as much air out, slowly, before sealing the last corner.
Store the sealed bags in a cool, low humidity environment.

BTW, I've moved this thread to our Fermentation & Yeast Forum.
--Mod

 

[passedpawn]

You shouldn't use corn sugar (dextrose) for making yeast starters, especially yeast that will be used for fermenting beer.

I can assure the OP that this is not true. I did it for many, many years without noticeable effect. I'm sure that some of the awards I won were beers based on yeasts grown with simple sugars.

On forums like this one, there are many old myths that continue. This is one. Perhaps if you made many successive generations of yeast with only simple sugars, it would result in some mutant yeast. But that was not the question posed.

So I'm gearing up to brew my first batch of beer in 2+ years and I am going to attempt to revive a 1 year old vial of Whitelabs Abbey Ale yeast that was stored in a cold fridge using my stir plate and Erlenmeyer flask. I've used this system before with great success, but not for reviving yeast this old.

Don't do that. Highly unlikely to produce what you want. Buy new yeast.

 

[IslandLizard]

my past attempt at storing corn sugar ended up with it turning into a brick, even though the bag was sealed.

The hardened sugar will still dissolve though, given enough time. To speed it up, crush it up into smaller chunks and/or powder (inside a bag) using a mallet or hammer.

Not sure anything can grow in sugar, but maybe give it a boil (and chill it) before using, just in case.

 

[IslandLizard]

I am going to attempt to revive a 1 year old vial of Whitelabs Abbey Ale yeast that was stored in a cold fridge using my stir plate and Erlenmeyer flask. I've used this system before with great success, but not for reviving yeast this old.

Yeast in a PurePitch sleeve tends to lose 3-6% viability per month when stored in a refrigerator (34-36F).

I have successfully propagated liquid yeast to pitchable amounts that had been stored in a refrigerator for much longer (8 years and counting). But it takes time and ingredients, not sure if it's worth your time and efforts vs. buying a fresh pack. Making a starter from liquid yeast before you pitch is still encouraged for a few reasons.

 

[Simon McIlroy]

I can assure the OP that this is not true. I did it for many, many years without noticeable effect. I'm sure that some of the awards I won were beers based on yeasts grown with simple sugars.

On forums like this one, there are many old myths that continue. This is one. Perhaps if you made many successive generations of yeast with only simple sugars, it would result in some mutant yeast. But that was not the question posed.



Don't do that. Highly unlikely to produce what you want. Buy new yeast.

So this is why I had the disclaimer in my post about saying something stupid...

So I went back and checked my notes and they did in fact call for DME in the starter, not corn sugar. I knew I used corn sugar for something though, which as I recall was as primer for bottling, does this sound correct? I still haven't not located all my books/ records from my move, that plus the time since my last brew is aiding my confusion.

Regarding the yeast resurrection topic, what happened was that last year I thought I was ready to start breaking again and bought 5 kits (custom built, not pre-assembled) which included my grains, hops, and yeasts. Then life got in the way, as it does, and it all sat in my fridge for a year (with the exception of the extract). The total I sent on the yeast was about $60 (4 smack packs and 3 vials) so my thinking is... rather than discard this all, do I have anything to lose by trying to resurrect it? Considering I have the stir plate and Erlenmeyer/ magnet set up, IF I can get it back to life over a few days then I'll be saving some cash minus the DME - or is there a reason this won't work? I figure even as an experiment I have nothing to lose but time and some DME. IF it doesn't work the I can drive the 2 hours (there an back) to my nearest home-brew supply and just buy new yeast.

 

[IslandLizard]

So this is why I had the disclaimer in my post about saying something stupid...

None of these are stupid questions, relax.

So I went back and checked my notes and they did in fact call for DME in the starter, not corn sugar.

Here's an Exbeeriment about using corn sugar vs. DME in a yeast starter. These guys are not scientific, more like the mythbusters of homebrewing. Yet, there are things that can be learned from them, or a good start to look into more seriously.
https://brulosophy.com/2015/06/05/real-wort-vs-dextrose-yeast-starter-exbeeriment-results/

 

[IslandLizard]

Then life got in the way, as it does, and it all sat in my fridge for a year (with the exception of the extract).

So you've got a 20-30# stockpile of over a year-old extract(s) that were not refrigerated?
Were they kept cool?
How are they packaged?
Liquid (LME) or dry (DME)?

The total I sent on the yeast was about $60 (4 smack packs and 3 vials) so my thinking is... rather than discard this all, do I have anything to lose by trying to resurrect it?

Well, the $60 is a bit of a bargain compared to today's world, where a pack of liquid of yeast can go for as much as $14-20, before shipping.

IF I can get it back to life over a few days

I'd say it would take at least a week, to get the first starter round propagated, but YMMV.
Then another 3-7 days for the second round, to grow a good pitchable amount, and perhaps large enough to save some out for keeps (to make another starter from in the near future). Yeast ranching can save money, yes!

One stir plate is your limitation in how fast you can grow all those packs of yeast into pitchable amounts. But if you plan to brew a batch no closer than every 2-4 weeks apart, I don't see any issues.

I am going to attempt to revive a 1 year old vial of Whitelabs Abbey Ale yeast

Is that yeast in an actual vial, a 5" round plastic tube with a screw lid on it? Or one of those PurePitch sleeves?

I figure even as an experiment I have nothing to lose but time and some DME.

If you're not in hurry to brew, you've got little to lose, it's only a hobby.

I've found making yeast starters to be a lucrative part of homebrewing. I plan to brew a batch 1-2 weeks ahead of time, by making a yeast starter, and usually do a 2nd round to get enough for ranching some for another or future batch.

IF it doesn't work the I can drive the 2 hours (there an back) to my nearest home-brew supply and just buy new yeast.

I'd combine trips such as those with other errants in that larger area, even if it is to visit a craft beer bar or brewery.
Make it an outing worth the time, effort, and fuel cost.

Now chances are, you'll still need to make a starter, as typical LHBS liquid yeast is 3-4 months old, on average. The newer packaging White Labs uses (PurePitch and more recently, PurePitch Next Generation) keeps yeast in better shape, with only a 3-6% of population decline per month.

 

[Simon McIlroy]

So you've got a 20-30# stockpile of over a year-old extract(s) that were not refrigerated?
Were they kept cool?
How are they packaged?
Liquid (LME) or dry (DME)?

Liquid in a box on a shelf in the garage. Powdered in a sealed Tupperware box on the same shelf. They were very cool from November though April, less so since then, but def not in direct sunlight or a high heat source.

Well, the $60 is a bit of a bargain compared to today's world, where a pack of liquid of yeast can go for as much as $14-20, before shipping.

Yeast was selling for $8 a pack a year ago- what happened? Supply chain issues?

I'd say it would take at least a week, to get the first starter round propagated, but YMMV.
Then another 3-7 days for the second round, to grow a good pitchable amount, and perhaps large enough to save some out for keeps (to make another starter from in the near future). Yeast ranching can save money, yes!

One stir plate is your limitation in how fast you can grow all those packs of yeast into pitchable amounts. But if you plan to brew a batch no closer than every 2-4 weeks apart, I don't see any issues.


Is that yeast in an actual vial, a 5" round plastic tube with a screw lid on it? Or one of those PurePitch sleeves?

I again misspoke, in my head they were vials but are in fact these little packets, which appear to be PurePitch sleeves.

They've been in a pretty cold fridge since I got them 11 months ago. Do you think I should dump all 3 in the flash and see or try one first to see if I can bring it back to life? It would be for a Belgian Tripel.

If you're not in hurry to brew, you've got little to lose, it's only a hobby.

I've found making yeast starters to be a lucrative part of homebrewing. I plan to brew a batch 1-2 weeks ahead of time, by making a yeast starter, and usually do a 2nd round to get enough for ranching some for another or future batch.


I'd combine trips such as those with other errants in that larger area, even if it is to visit a craft beer bar or brewery.
Make it an outing worth the time, effort, and fuel cost.

Now chances are, you'll still need to make a starter, as typical LHBS liquid yeast is 3-4 months old, on average. The newer packaging White Labs uses (PurePitch and more recently, PurePitch Next Generation) keeps yeast in better shape, with only a 3-6% of population decline per month.

 

[IslandLizard]

Liquid in a box on a shelf in the garage. Powdered in a sealed Tupperware box on the same shelf. They were very cool from November though April, less so since then, but def not in direct sunlight or a high heat source.

If the liquid extract containers were filled (plastic) jugs from a bulk container at the homebrew store or online shop it's 50/50. They may have oxidized/darkened a tad. We have fairly recent threads featuring methods on how to evaluate them.
I'd move those to a cool area, stat!

Dry malt powder (DME) fares much better in storage, again, cooler is better, but room temps or a little lower is fine. But also watch out for moisture getting inside the bags, the stuff is highly hygroscopic.

I again misspoke, in my head they were vials but are in fact these little packets, which appear to be PurePitch sleeves.

They've been in a pretty cold fridge since I got them 11 months ago. Do you think I should dump all 3 in the flash and see or try one first to see if I can bring it back to life? It would be for a Belgian Tripel.

If you know and trust your yeast/starter sanitation regimen being excellent when making starters, and the yeast didn't suffer from heat or extreme cold,* I'd pitch all 3 together into a 1-2 liter starter of 1.037 wort. Give it a few days on the stir plate, see what happens. You can probably pitch that next week into a batch, while keeping some behind to make the next starter from, etc. This is called yeast ranching.

By ranching yeast you can keep making starters, many times, as long as you don't pick up an infection along the road. That's why I like to have backups stored, so I can start again, from a earlier, fresher generation if the yeast becomes suspect for whatever reason.

If you're not confident about your yeast/starter sanitation, start with one sleeve, keep the others as back-ups, each for their own fresh batch. But

* If the yeast was shipped last year in hot Summer weather and may have suffered "heat stroke," I'd start with 1-2 liters of lower gravity wort (1.010). Otherwise, that may not be necessary. The sleeves themselves keep the yeast very well!