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I am putting my stand together, and my pump mounts directly below the kettle. So realistically, my mounting choices come down to Inlet South and Outlet North with two elbows making a u bend from the kettle to the inlet or, choice two, Inlet to the East and Outlet to the West. The pump is mounted approximately 18 inches below the kettle drain and both the Inlet and Outlet will be fed from 1/2 in silicone hose through Bargain Fittings QD fittingss. Before I cut all the hoses, etc, can you give me an idea what would be the better configuration?

Thanks in advance.
 
WalterAtMarchPump said:
If it spins freely on the shaft, but not when its inside the rear housing, then you probably have some damage to the impeller and the rear housing....you can replace just those two items and be back in business....
Click to expand...

It didn't spin freely on the shaft. I figured WTH and drilled out the impeller shaft to 17/64 and it is functioning again. I first drilled out 1/4 but still had sticking. I now have perhaps too much clearance and it rattles a little. Any danger in that?
 
DFP51 said:
I am putting my stand together, and my pump mounts directly below the kettle. So realistically, my mounting choices come down to Inlet South and Outlet North with two elbows making a u bend from the kettle to the inlet or, choice two, Inlet to the East and Outlet to the West. The pump is mounted approximately 18 inches below the kettle drain and both the Inlet and Outlet will be fed from 1/2 in silicone hose through Bargain Fittings QD fittingss. Before I cut all the hoses, etc, can you give me an idea what would be the better configuration?

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

If you have the room then do it with the outlet on top (North) and with the 90* fittings and your U-Bends i would step it up to 3/4" plumbing for that U-bend and just put adapters to hook up your hose and to the pump head....this way the U-bend is not posing much of any restriction....
 
Jhenjum said:
It didn't spin freely on the shaft. I figured WTH and drilled out the impeller shaft to 17/64 and it is functioning again. I first drilled out 1/4 but still had sticking. I now have perhaps too much clearance and it rattles a little. Any danger in that?
Click to expand...

If it didnt spin frely on the shaft then it may have been run dry...either from thermal expansion from running it too hot or with no liquid....drillig it out will fix your issue and the noise wont hurt anything...other then annoying you of anything :)
 
Walter, I scored a new 809 pump with the stainless head (center inlet, 3/4" in, 1/2" out)... I didn't see the same white 'washer' between the impeller and the plate that goes to the pump body. Does the stainless pump not use the washer? I also see that the bore of the outlet of the pump is smaller than I would have thought it would be. Would that create an issue down the road, or am I just worried about nothing? Also, if I picked up an impeller for the 815 pump, will that work just as well as it does in my standard 809 pump? The new impeller in my older pump turned it into a BEAST of a pump. :D

Now I need to get a new toolbox to house the new pump. Since I no longer need to worry about the inlet pointing down, below the pump motor, it opens up the possibility of what I can use for a toolbox. :rockin:
 
WalterAtMarchPump said:
If you have the room then do it with the outlet on top (North) and with the 90* fittings and your U-Bends i would step it up to 3/4" plumbing for that U-bend and just put adapters to hook up your hose and to the pump head....this way the U-bend is not posing much of any restriction....
Click to expand...

Thanks Walter.
 
Golddiggie said:
Walter, I scored a new 809 pump with the stainless head (center inlet, 3/4" in, 1/2" out)... I didn't see the same white 'washer' between the impeller and the plate that goes to the pump body. Does the stainless pump not use the washer?

Depending on how old the pump is, it may have a black washer instead of a white.....either way there should be one there....if not give me a call and i will send you one out.

I also see that the bore of the outlet of the pump is smaller than I would have thought it would be. Would that create an issue down the road, or am I just worried about nothing?

Nothing to worry about....Its a little smaller then it can be....but if you bore it out you wont get enough of a change to warrant expanding it. It mainly there to balance the pump out when people use smaller plumbing then they should on the inlet side of the pump.


Also, if I picked up an impeller for the 815 pump, will that work just as well as it does in my standard 809 pump? The new impeller in my older pump turned it into a BEAST of a pump. :D

Yes it will work the same way in the SS Head :)

Now I need to get a new toolbox to house the new pump. Since I no longer need to worry about the inlet pointing down, below the pump motor, it opens up the possibility of what I can use for a toolbox. :rockin:
Click to expand...


:mug:
 
I'm thinking of drilling out the 3/8" female threads of my 809 center inlet. I'm thinking it might help reduce cavitation, with a smooth inlet surface. I would think this was a common practice, but haven't found much mention of it.

Would this greatly reduced the structural integrity of the inlet? What would be the best size bit for this, or is it just not recommended?
 
The threads wont cause cavitation....they may cause turbulance but thats about it. If you were to actually measure them you will see the smooth part inside the pump past the threads is ever so slightly smaller then the threads. Drilling them out will only help if you had some clening issues and got "stuff" in the threads that wasnt cleaned out. If you wanted to drill them out, i would first start with a 5/8" drill bit and move up to the 11/16" if that doesnt clear them out completely.
 
Walter,

I am looking to mount my pump in a tool box and was wondering about exactly the best way to do this. I have seen people do it different ways:

1. the connecting bracket (part 11 on diagram below) is bolted to the toolbox wall between the bracket and motor,

2. The pump head is free floating in the hole and the base of the motor is mounted to the floor of the tool box.

3. The connecting bracket is mounted to the toolbox between the bracket and the pump head.

1 and 3 would require moving the drive magnet (14) further from the motor. Is this fine and what is the best way of doing it? Also if I choose 1 or 3 would it be fine to leave the motor not secured, or would the weight of the motor put strain on the system?

marchparts.jpg
 
Golddiggie said:
Walter, I scored a new 809 pump with the stainless head (center inlet, 3/4" in, 1/2" out)... I didn't see the same white 'washer' between the impeller and the plate that goes to the pump body. Does the stainless pump not use the washer? I also see that the bore of the outlet of the pump is smaller than I would have thought it would be. Would that create an issue down the road, or am I just worried about nothing? Also, if I picked up an impeller for the 815 pump, will that work just as well as it does in my standard 809 pump? The new impeller in my older pump turned it into a BEAST of a pump. :D

Now I need to get a new toolbox to house the new pump. Since I no longer need to worry about the inlet pointing down, below the pump motor, it opens up the possibility of what I can use for a toolbox. :rockin:
Click to expand...

damn, did you get one of the ones from Eric??

i was emailing him, then i left for the weekend. when i got back they were gone.

In the pics he sent me, it showed an EPDM o-ring. might be your issue.
 
Golddiggie said:
Walter, I scored a new 809 pump with the stainless head (center inlet, 3/4" in, 1/2" out)... I didn't see the same white 'washer' between the impeller and the plate that goes to the pump body. Does the stainless pump not use the washer? I also see that the bore of the outlet of the pump is smaller than I would have thought it would be. Would that create an issue down the road, or am I just worried about nothing? Also, if I picked up an impeller for the 815 pump, will that work just as well as it does in my standard 809 pump? The new impeller in my older pump turned it into a BEAST of a pump. :D

Now I need to get a new toolbox to house the new pump. Since I no longer need to worry about the inlet pointing down, below the pump motor, it opens up the possibility of what I can use for a toolbox. :rockin:
Click to expand...

I just re-read you posting and there is no washer between the impeller and the stainless plate...the washer is between the impeller and the main pump housing....it sits on the shaft...and its usually white...may be black if older unit..
 
ekjohns said:
Walter,

I am looking to mount my pump in a tool box and was wondering about exactly the best way to do this. I have seen people do it different ways:

1. the connecting bracket (part 11 on diagram below) is bolted to the toolbox wall between the bracket and motor,

2. The pump head is free floating in the hole and the base of the motor is mounted to the floor of the tool box.

3. The connecting bracket is mounted to the toolbox between the bracket and the pump head.

1 and 3 would require moving the drive magnet (14) further from the motor. Is this fine and what is the best way of doing it? Also if I choose 1 or 3 would it be fine to leave the motor not secured, or would the weight of the motor put strain on the system?

marchparts.jpg
Click to expand...

I think the easiest way would be to take the pump head off the motor bracket (the 4 philips screws) and place the motor/bracket inside the box and line it up against the box side and mark where it hits. From that point i would cut a 3" hole and you should be able to get the first half of the motor bracket in and through that hole. The bracket is actually 3-9/32" in dia but the main bracket body is closer to 2-3/4".....so you should be able to get the mounting ears through.......you will have a gap around it but that would be cosmetic at that point.
If you wanted to make it look perfect, as i'm sure some people do, you would need to take the motor bracket off and remove the drive magnet. Just note how it sits on the shaft of the motor. Place the motor into the box and mark there the shaft hit the side. At that point you drill a hole 1/4" pilot hole....then print out the attachment below and drill the restof the holes.....you need a 2-1/8" hole saw and then 4 9/64" holes for the screws. When you have it all done you put the magnet back on the shaft and offset it by how thick your plastic box is. Then assemble the bracket back on the motor and eyeball the magnet as close to center as possible. Put the pump head back on and plumb it up with some water. Turn it on ans see if you get any rubbing. If you do then loosen the flat haed screws and tap the bracket around till its nice and quiet again. And you should be in business.

I made this template for you guys...it should be full size so you should be able just to tape it on the box and drill away :D

View attachment 809 Box Template Model (1).pdf
 
THANKS WALTER! So you would recommend attaching the pump between the bracket and motor, and not between the head and the bracket? I will more than likely just drill a hole and stick the pump through it without any mounting. It will not be fully water proof but it would take quite a stream to get all the way into the motor. still something to think about
 
its up to you as to how much you want to mess with it. Here at the factory we use a jig to center up the motor bracket and set the depth of the drive magnet. You would need to just play with it a little bit to center it back up again....and you can set the magnet dept 1/16" below the face of the motor bracket before the pump housing goes back on....it would take some time of back fourth but you can do if you have the paitence. If your not concerned about the looks of it then i would just drill the 3" hole and stuff the motor bracket through the hole and out...yes you will a gap around it but unless you go and spill the entire batch on the floor an it hits the box i dont think there will be enough splashing to get to the motor and affect it.
 
WalterAtMarchPump said:
If you wanted to make it look perfect, as i'm sure some people do, you would need to take the motor bracket off and remove the drive magnet. Just note how it sits on the shaft of the motor. Place the motor into the box and mark there the shaft hit the side. At that point you drill a hole 1/4" pilot hole....then print out the attachment below and drill the restof the holes.....you need a 2-1/8" hole saw and then 4 9/64" holes for the screws. When you have it all done you put the magnet back on the shaft and offset it by how thick your plastic box is. Then assemble the bracket back on the motor and eyeball the magnet as close to center as possible. Put the pump head back on and plumb it up with some water. Turn it on ans see if you get any rubbing. If you do then loosen the flat haed screws and tap the bracket around till its nice and quiet again. And you should be in business.

I made this template for you guys...it should be full size so you should be able just to tape it on the box and drill away :D
Click to expand...

Walter, could this be done with the AC-5B-MD? I like the new mounting plates I've seen that go between the drive magnet and the motor on some 809's out there. With the AC5B the mount on the motor is a little flimsy, and I'm always worried that something's going to break on it.
 
Hey Walter - I've got a quick question. I'd like to convert my 809-HS from side to center input. Do I need anything but the housing (0809-0179-0100)?

Cheers!
 
WalterAtMarchPump said:
I just re-read you posting and there is no washer between the impeller and the stainless plate...the washer is between the impeller and the main pump housing....it sits on the shaft...and its usually white...may be black if older unit..
Click to expand...

I found that out between when I posted that and your reply... I now have two 'spare' washers on hand, in case I need them. Cheap enough to not worry about that.

Looking at the template, if we do a 3" hole, ~2" from the bottom of the toolbox (offsetting for the bottom thickness) there won't be all that much of a gap around the pump. Talking about just over 1/16" here... Personally, I can live with that small of a gap.
 
Golddiggie said:
Personally, I can live with that small of a gap.
Click to expand...

Me too! That seems like it would allow less playing around with the pump and would allow be to slide the pump further inside the box so there is less sticking out (overall smaller footprint)
 
Walter, I need to get a new connecting bracket. Can I order one directly from March? I found a few stores online that sell them but they are asking more in shipping than the cost of the bracket!
 
ekjohns said:
Walter, I need to get a new connecting bracket. Can I order one directly from March? I found a few stores online that sell them but they are asking more in shipping than the cost of the bracket!
Click to expand...

We dont sell direct...what happened to yours? Email me direct:
wwojcik@ marchpump.com
 
beardedirishman said:
Walter, could this be done with the AC-5B-MD? I like the new mounting plates I've seen that go between the drive magnet and the motor on some 809's out there. With the AC5B the mount on the motor is a little flimsy, and I'm always worried that something's going to break on it.
Click to expand...

If you take the time, you can do it with just about any pump out there...what do you mean the mount is flimsy? the mounting base is metal just loke the 809 bases....are you talking about the motor bracket?? that is made from a polypro plastic. Its alot stronger then you think. That bracket will usually bend before breaking....and its more forgiving as far as alignment goes. You just need to set the depth of the magnet and you dont need any jigs to center it up.
 
jkarp said:
Hey Walter - I've got a quick question. I'd like to convert my 809-HS from side to center input. Do I need anything but the housing (0809-0179-0100)?

Cheers!
Click to expand...

As long as you stay with the same material then all you need is the housing....if you currently have a plastic pump head and want to convert to stainless or brass then you would also need the o-ring as they are different on the metal pumps.
 
I have been using the 315HF from Morebeer with a plate chiller for 2 batches so far. The system leaves behind ~1/2 gallon of wort in the lines after the dip tube siphon has broken in the brew kettle.

Is there a good way to clear these lines and not leave so much wort behind?
 
vinylicious said:
I have been using the 315HF from Morebeer with a plate chiller for 2 batches so far. The system leaves behind ~1/2 gallon of wort in the lines after the dip tube siphon has broken in the brew kettle.

Is there a good way to clear these lines and not leave so much wort behind?
Click to expand...

you can:
1 - throttle back the outlet with a valve to reduce the sucking of air via the tendency to whirlpool near the suction at the end of pumping
2 - use shorter line
3 - use smaller line (especially on the outlet of the pump) to get higher flow rate and overcome air bubbles.
4 - manually drain (design you system to allow you to either remove and lift the suction line and pump several feet above the receiving container, or allow you to lower the output line into a container.

-mike
 
clearwaterbrewer prety much summed it up i think...only thing i can think of would be to disconnect the line from the kettle and lift the line up and then the pump and continue on till you get all the liquid out of it all....if the pump is mounted on the stand then you can install a "T" fitting at teh lowest point and have a valve there you can open and drain and remaing liquid into a bucket or glass etc..
 
WalterAtMarchPump said:
If you take the time, you can do it with just about any pump out there...what do you mean the mount is flimsy? the mounting base is metal just loke the 809 bases....are you talking about the motor bracket?? that is made from a polypro plastic. Its alot stronger then you think. That bracket will usually bend before breaking....and its more forgiving as far as alignment goes. You just need to set the depth of the magnet and you dont need any jigs to center it up.
Click to expand...

I was talking about a mount like this one from tesco pumps:

http://www.tescopumps.com/servlet/the-489/MAR-*MOTOR-MOUNTING-BRACKET/Detail

Is such a thing made for the AC series pumps? Yes, the mounting base certainly looks strong, but where it attaches to the pump doesn't provide much support to the pump head. I have some tri-clamp adapters and fittings on the end of my pump head and I measure a full 12 inches from the motor mount screws to the center of my triclamp fitting. It just puts a lot of force on the place where the motor attaches to the base and I would just prefer a stronger mounting method.
 
beardedirishman said:
I was talking about a mount like this one from tesco pumps:

http://www.tescopumps.com/servlet/the-489/MAR-*MOTOR-MOUNTING-BRACKET/Detail

Is such a thing made for the AC series pumps? Yes, the mounting base certainly looks strong, but where it attaches to the pump doesn't provide much support to the pump head. I have some tri-clamp adapters and fittings on the end of my pump head and I measure a full 12 inches from the motor mount screws to the center of my triclamp fitting. It just puts a lot of force on the place where the motor attaches to the base and I would just prefer a stronger mounting method.
Click to expand...

Ah! that link from Tesco shows the mounting bracket we use for the 809 DC versions. You can use it for the AC versions that dont come with mounting bases but its rare. The motor bracket and that mounting base you liked to are both made from the same Polysulfil plastic as the pump head. And that is some strong stuff. If you break the base or the bracket i'd be more worried about busting the pump head unless you have a metal version.
 
Walter, I started a new thread asking the below. I didn't realize that you had this thread going. Anyway, here goes!

Just integrated a brand new march pump into my brewery and it seems to squeal every once in a while, but mainly when pumping hot liquids. Cold seems ok and I haven't heard it yet.
I'm not, and haven't run it dry, where I'd expect it to squeal. Also, I'm only restricting the output side. No restrictions on the input.

I've read to try some keg lube on the impeller, but part of me wonders if I should, or if I should just exchange it for another since it shouldn't be doing this when it's a brand new pump.

By the way, I was testing this with the pump about 4ft below the HLT that I was pumping from, so plenty of headspace and no noticeable cavitation from what I could tell.


Ideas?


Also, what is the normal operating temp of the 809-HS that I have? I built it into a toolbox, but would like to keep an eye on it's temps in order to decided whether I should add a cooling fan in there as well.

Thanks!
 
krazydave said:
Walter, I started a new thread asking the below. I didn't realize that you had this thread going. Anyway, here goes!

Just integrated a brand new march pump into my brewery and it seems to squeal every once in a while, but mainly when pumping hot liquids. Cold seems ok and I haven't heard it yet.
I'm not, and haven't run it dry, where I'd expect it to squeal. Also, I'm only restricting the output side. No restrictions on the input.

I've read to try some keg lube on the impeller, but part of me wonders if I should, or if I should just exchange it for another since it shouldn't be doing this when it's a brand new pump.

By the way, I was testing this with the pump about 4ft below the HLT that I was pumping from, so plenty of headspace and no noticeable cavitation from what I could tell.


Ideas?


Also, what is the normal operating temp of the 809-HS that I have? I built it into a toolbox, but would like to keep an eye on it's temps in order to decided whether I should add a cooling fan in there as well.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

krazydave, usually when the pumps make that noise, its from the impeller bouncing/vibrating on the shaft due to lack of lubrication. When brewers run them at boiling temps it could be sucking air into the system and then cavitating. Either way one thing you can try is drilling out the opening of the impeller with a 17/64" drill bit to open the clearence between the shaft and the impeller. If you dont want to mess with it or dont have confidence in drilling it out, you can send it to me and I will do it for you no problem.
As for normal operating temps....that has been an on going debate with us and the motor mfg....we state that for continuous duty there ambient temps for the motor should be limited to about 104*F (the motor will see surface temps in the 150*F range)
The motor itself has a thermal overload built in that will shut the motor off if it reaches about 210*F internally.....the motor mfg has told us that the motors are ok to run anywhere in that range up to shutoff as long as they are not constantly hitting that thermal overload switch...each time it hits the thermal overload it weakens it....so if its triggered enough times it may fail all together and not give power tot he motor.
For most people that have these mounted in a tool box, i dont think it will run long enough to heat up and trigger the thermal on it....so you should be ok....if you are concerned about them temps....drill some holes on the lid of the box opposite the motor side and the hot air will ris out of the box...
 
Walter,

To follow up on the previous question, my pump does not squeal but has a bit of a rattle that I only hear every now and then. I have not opened it up to look at the o-ring condition but it has only been used for about 30 min total. Is the slight rattle here and there normal?
 
Eh...depends. They CAN have a slight rattle to them depending on the conditions. If you have a valve on the discharge side and close it off and the rattle goes away then you just balanced out the pump and you will probably never hear the rattle again......most times when they make noise its due to the teflon thrust washer getting worn away....or the shaft coming loose and allowing the impeller to rub against its housing. Open it up and check out the insides. The o-rings dont go bad unless they get ripped or pinched and you will see it leaking at that point..
 
Hey Walter. I just started having a problem tonight with my 809HS. I was doing a water boil in a kettle with a bottom drain. I upgraded the impeller to the 815. I've since made a batch a brew without problems. Tonight, with the water boil, at 205 degrees I heard the impeller seize. I quickly turned it off, mostly thinking it was dry pumping. As soon as I turned it off I heard the impeller loosen up and start spinning again while to motor was winding down. I turned the it on again and it seized again when it got to full speed and turned while winding down.

I was boiling 10 gallons of water, bottom drain fed to the input port of the pump which is facing down. I recirc during boil to keep water flowing around my electric element. I did not see the appearance of air in the silicone hoses so I don't think it's an air pocket, but I could be wrong. I have never heard the impeller seize up like that in the last year. This is a new pump, about 2 months old.

Help me Obe Wan!

Is something wrong with my pump?
20120417_171837.jpg
 
Here's a quick video showing the problem happening today. I took apart the head and looked for anything that might cause this.

Click on video to play.
 
Was the pump still turning after that click? It almost sounded like the thermal shut off...
Read up a few posts to Walter's response to my question about operating temps.

Possibility?
 

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