Morebeer 40 plate chiller clogging

[MGamber]

I bought a morebeer.com 40 plate chiller (https://www.morebeer.com/products/wort-chiller-40-plate.html) and I can't use it for a few reasons. First, I understand you should pump boiling wort through it to sanitize it but I can just barely do it. If I set the pump output to anything but the minimum amount of flow, the pump is dry in a couple seconds from lack of flow through the chiller. Second, almost every beer I do has a whirlpool addition which requires me to chill to 180 degrees or cooler. That's an almost impossible task for the same reason...there's just not enough flow through the chiller to cool the wort in a reasonable amount of time. Finally, a whirlpool, trub dam and pick up fitting reduce trub to almost nothing and the chiller works ok until I turn on the cold water at which point it stops completely. So...am I missing something on how to use a plate chiller or is this item defective and needs to be returned? If plate chillers are supposed to be a pain the ass ok, I'll try to get better at using one but I've never read about them being this difficult, hence the post. Thanks!

 

[day_trippr]

It isn't clear where your pump is located relative to your kettle and your chiller.
The pump should draw from the kettle and push to the chiller, and a control valve should be located on the output side of the pump (don't throttle the flow using the kettle valve).

I can't imagine how the water flow affects the wort flow. That's a new one. Unless it's a wort viscosity thing, which would indicate there's a horrible problem with pumping efficiency...

Cheers!

 

[IslandLizard]

+1 to what @day_trippr said! ^

Can you post a picture of your setup?

I use a plate chiller and bag all my hops. Works like a charm (since I started bagging them).
You could use a hop spider, hop basket, large fine mesh hop bags, homemade bags from voile material, etc. to contain them.

 

[seatazzz]

+1 to the above. Pump should be on the BK side of the chiller. You also CAN throttle your flow from the kettle (I do and don't have a problem) but you should let it get started at full flow before turning it down. Also start the chilling water going through it before opening the valve to the kettle to pre-chill the chiller.

As to why it stops once the water is turned on; that's a poser. I would try backflushing the chiller with super hot water before using it, you may have a clog somewhere. Also double check how your hoses are attached starting from the kettle, to the pump, all the way to the fermenter; yes it seems to be a no-brainer, but most of us have at one time or another attached the hoses wrong. I know I have!

 

[MGamber]

That's the set up exactly with a valve on the output of the pump. I can't imagine how water flow affects wort flow, too, so I'm wondering if it's not defective. The pump works fine, all the camlocks and hoses are 1/2 inch. It all works great until I put the chiller inline.

 

[MGamber]

I don't have a picture, unfortunately, but I run from the bottom port of a 10 gallon SS Brewtech kettle to the pump, to the chiller and to the port right above the bottom port when whirlpooling. I've also tried it with the bottom port to the chiller to the pump to the upper port. Either way it just barely works. I have flushed and backflushed the chiller and nothing changes. The hoses and camlocks are all clear. One other thing...I used to be able circulate boiling wort through it to sanitize it but I can't do that anymore, too. If I push anything more than minimal flow through it, the pump runs dry.

 

[Rodent]

Q: you bought this new, or used?

Q: what's your flow like if you use your setup and cycle clean water thru it?

Q: what are you using for a pump?

Q: can you post an image of your system set up and ready to run?

 

[Rodent]

One other thing...I used to be able circulate boiling wort through it to sanitize it but I can't do that anymore, too.

Since this used to work, it sounds like you may have plugged up you chiller with kettle debris (hops, cold/hot break, etc ...) at some point in the past

 

[MGamber]

Since this used to work, it sounds like you may have plugged up you chiller with kettle debris (hops, cold/hot break, etc ...) at some point in the past

I bought it new.

Clean water flow is fine. Comes out as fast as I put it in.

Chugger pump with a stainless head.

No pix, sorry. Just didn't think of it.

I used it about 6 weeks ago and it plugged up so I applied 70 psi water to the wort side, blew out some trub and then the flow was fine. Ok, so it's trub. Since then I worked on reducing trub to the point where what comes out of the kettle is crystal clear and then tried it again with the same result. My thinking is that it just can't be this much of a pain in the ass to use a plate chiller or no one would have one. Also, you're supposed to pump boiling wort through it to sanitize and, practically, I can't do that, too. I do use a lot of hops, mostly in the whirlpool, but I can't use it to chill to whirlpool temps, also.

 

[Keith81]

Instead of boiling wort try circulating immediately after flame out to sanitize, 2-5 minutes or until temp drops to 200 F then start chilling water. No problems with cavitation that way.

 

[MGamber]

Instead of boiling wort try circulating immediately after flame out to sanitize, 2-5 minutes or until temp drops to 200 F then start chilling water. No problems with cavitation that way.

I've done that, too, to try to get the wort to whirlpool temps. Last week I tried: Circulating boiling wort to sanitize. Didn't work. Circulating wort post boil to get it to 170 degrees. Didn't work. Chilling clear kettle output to (as close as groundwater temp allows) pitching temp. Didn't work. The only time the flow is good is when I push groundwater temp water through the wort side. And then it's great.

 

[schematix]

Good ol plate clogger.

Best performance for cooling hands down. Takes 5 times as long to clean and clogs easily though. Makes it a net loser.

Get a CFC or hydra immersion IC.

 

[gwinn758]

Take a look at these, I was looking into this a couple of weeks ago and came across several good discussions. I think this first one sounds more like the problem you're having.

https://discussions.probrewer.com/archive/index.php/t-52479.html
https://discussions.probrewer.com/archive/index.php/t-48022.html

 

[IslandLizard]

When you had a bad clog, did you connect a piece of hose that has full domestic water pressure (like a garden spigot) to the 1/2" (wort) side? How high was the water spouting up from the output? Have you flushed through back and forth a few times like that? Observed any particles/flakes coming out with it?

Since all the plates/channels are parallel, clogs get bypassed easily instead of blown out.

Baking in the oven for a few hours at 450-500F will dry and even burn that hop/trub matter and will make it easier flushing them out.

Maybe you can return it?

 

[Dland]

My guess is there is still some debris in unit from before you limited trub intake, or some is still getting though. Besides clogging the cooler, any build up of debris can easily host an infection.

If you hook both your pumps in series and conterflow blast through plate cooler with high concentrate, hot PBW or some such, in series with other sanitation, run it long enough for it to digest some, may solve your problem.

 

[IslandLizard]

The wort flow stopping when turning the cold water side on is a total mystery. Wort and water are in 2 separate channels. In your case, wort on the 1/2" NPT side, water on the 3/4" NPT side.

 

[ITV]

I use a false bottom on my brew kettle which traps the sediment (hot break) from using irish moss as well as a SS hop basket. Immediately after using my plate chiller, I pump hot PBW thru it for 15 minutes and follow up with a warm water flush and starstan before storing it away.

I never had a plugged plate chiller following the above method.

 

[khannon]

+1 on the oven idea.. most plate chillers can be sanitized in the oven, and it should dry any materials inside or reduce them to Ash allowing you to backflush more easily. The wort and the water should never restrict each other as they are running in separate channels separated by metal plates.. what happens if you hook a garden hose up to both the wort and water sides? Can you get full flow in both?

 

[schematix]

if you have to bake your plate chiller, or recirculate hot cleaner through it for 15 minutes, shouldn't you question why you use a piece of equipment that requires as much cleaning as all other brewery pieces combined?

 

[IslandLizard]

Since then I worked on reducing trub to the point where what comes out of the kettle is crystal clear and then tried it again with the same result.

How are you containing your trub/hops, preventing them to go into the pump/chiller chain? Is this restricting wort flow as well, it sounds like it.

 

[IslandLizard]

if you have to bake your plate chiller, or recirculate hot cleaner through it for 15 minutes, shouldn't you question why you use a piece of equipment that requires as much cleaning as all other brewery pieces combined?

Although this doesn't help the OP at the moment, I do agree with you @schematix, operating plate chillers can be more trouble than they're worth, given viable alternatives. Ideally, potential buyers should be made aware of the clogging potential in plate chillers, especially on brewing oriented sites, like MoreBeer. But it really hinges on lack of research by the buyer.

Plate chillers are heat exchangers for fluids, they were never designed for pumping suspended (hop) sludge through. The ones breweries operate are specifically engineered for that use. Even a mini/micro homebrew version with somewhat wider channels than our generics would be expensive and yup, still a chore to periodically disassemble/reassemble, or when needed.

Once pointed out, the solution to clogging is fairly simple: containing hops is key to successful operation when using plate chillers. This results in easier maintenance of those systems, similar to counterflow chillers. In-kettle filtering is generally not a viable option as it tends to progressively limit wort flow out, causing pump starvation/cavitation.

Good whirlpooling (bypassing the chiller) with a well designed side pick up and possibly the use of a decent trub dam should work well too, at least in theory. Haven't had or seen much proof with that yet. Had a major plate chiller clog last year doing a 20 gallon batch of NEIPA with 2+ pounds of hops in the whirlpool. That chiller is about 4x as large (2x the length and 2x the width) as the one the OP has.

 

[khannon]

if you have to bake your plate chiller, or recirculate hot cleaner through it for 15 minutes, shouldn't you question why you use a piece of equipment that requires as much cleaning as all other brewery pieces combined?

I think that aside from my pump(s), and I guess fermentation temp control, the plate chiller was one of my best investments. I use a hop spider and have never had any issues with my chiller. It makes it amazingly easy and quick to knock the temps to 180 for whirl-pooling those hops at the end of a NE IPA, and by re-circulating ice water and just adding more ice, I chill 10 gals from boiling to pitching temps in no time. I also get warm/hot water for cleanup. I also don't have to worry about a kid storing something on to of my chiller and crushing it, and it takes up a lot less space than a counter flow or immersion chiller.

As for the cleaning, all my gear needs cleanup, maybe I could knock off a few minutes, but I might be adding them back on the chilling side. And I need to circulate cleaner through the hoses, valves, and pumps anyway, so adding the chiller into the mix seems trivial. Everything gets a good cleaning at the end of the brew and everything gets a deep clean every 8 or 9 brews outside of brew time.

As with all beer, from making to drinking, it comes down to personal preference. Brew how you like, drink what you like.

Kevin

 

[GPP33]

I don't have a picture, unfortunately, but I run from the bottom port of a 10 gallon SS Brewtech kettle to the pump, to the chiller and to the port right above the bottom port when whirlpooling. I've also tried it with the bottom port to the chiller to the pump to the upper port. Either way it just barely works. I have flushed and backflushed the chiller and nothing changes. The hoses and camlocks are all clear. One other thing...I used to be able circulate boiling wort through it to sanitize it but I can't do that anymore, too. If I push anything more than minimal flow through it, the pump runs dry.

You have mentioned a couple of times that the pump is running dry. If you mean there’s no wort for the pump to pump then it sounds like the problem is upstream of the pump, the plate chiller is down stream. Unless you actually have the pump down stream of the chiller in which case switch them. The valve where the wort leaves the kettle should be wide open, use a valve after the plate chiller to control the flow rate. If the valve from the kettle is open and clear the pump shouldn’t run dry, especially if the plate chiller is the constraint.

 

[Natebrewer303]

Just a thought but how do you know the pump is running dry? Do you have enough head pressure to keep the pump running how it should? I agree with gpp33 If you know there is no clog in the chiller then it seems like a supply to the pump issue or maybe the pump is the one getting a clog to it.