Foam Issues and Liquid Post Spring?!?!

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Haf-A-mil

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Hi everyone! (Apologies in advance for the long post)

Since I have a great love for beer when I got my basement bar built I wanted to have cold brew on tap, which is where my kegerator came in. Even though I've only made 4 batches so far (which have all been good), as you all know bottling the beer was a PIA. Having beer on tab and not bottling killed two birds with one stone. To get to the point I bought two used kegs from AIH one was a corny and one was a Challenger/Firestone. For my first keg I decided to just go down to the local pub (get an IPA) and get them to fill the corny with one of their beer, as I knew the initial keg setup wasn't going to be plug and play (so I figure I might as well go through the motions with someone else beer instead of mine).

I've got two Perlick 650SS taps with the flow control and when I hooked up the regulator made sure there was no leaks I kept getting nothing but foam, and a lot of foam, unless I took the flow control down really low (which isn't ideal). I took all the corrective steps cleaned the keg thoroughly, replaced all o-rings, changed the beer line from the included 5ft to 10ft, etc. I don't have a tower cooler as the beer temps on my first and following pours are pretty consistent. But it was STILL foam. I let it sit for a good portion of time in between changes. Ended up just letting the beer sit in the glass after the foam messes and then drinking. Needless to say the beer wasn't as enjoyable as it could of been. Now the beer is gone and my 5lbs CO2 tank is empty as well (mostly my fault as I wasted a lot of CO2 bleeding the keg and refilling - I know I shouldn't have in hind sight).

Now when pouring I noticed that on the beer line closest to the beer disconnect I would see air bubbles and then after awhile a pocket would develop (maybe about 2 inches or so) if I let it sit for about 30min in between pours in the beer line. This would also cause the beer to sputter out on almost every pour. I figured that the valve was probably nicked or something and bought a new valve to replace. After the keg was empty last night I took off the beer disconnect and unscrewed the valve to notice that the poppet sprint was stuck inside the valve (pic below). I also noticed when comparing the spring that was originally on the keg and the new one I bought; the older one was really short (older valve and spring on the left in the pic below and newer on the right). I could see how it could get stuck inside the top of the valve because its so short with less tension on the little spring.



My questions are:

1. The older poppet with the shorter spring (on the left in the pic below); could this have been a reason why I seeing the gas bubbles getting into the beer line (because it was stuck at the top of the valve) and more than likely not opening/closing properly?

2. Could this have also been the reason why I was constantly seeing foam?

3. Is the spring for the valve supposed to be the shorter one (that was stuck) or the longer one that I received with the new one?

Just trying to isolate my problems, so with the next keg I get (before using my own beer) I can thoroughly enjoy it.

Thanks again everyone, I know it takes time to balance the system, and willing to put the time in, to learn but again I'm just trying to make sure its right.........at the end of the day this isn't rocket science.

post_small.jpg


stuck_small.jpg


both-valve_small.jpg
 
The poppet on the left in the picture could be the oem poppet for that post.
The poppet on the right is a "universal poppet" with a "christmas tree" spring.

Beer-side poppets aren't going to produce gas pockets at rest. That's usually due to either carbonation exceeding the current CO2 pressure, or a bad or missing Out dip tube o-ring (the one under the dip tube flange).

A funky poppet can conceivably cause foaming on pours - if it isn't opening all the way. That can happen if the poppet spring is too long or too stiff. On short posts it's not uncommon for those "christmas tree" springs to be too long and require the removal of a loop or two.

As those are both liquid posts, you might try using the one you didn't have in the last keg on your next one...

Cheers!
 
Day_trippr: you mentioned a possible problem could be the carbonation is exceeding the current co2 pressure. How can this be fixed??
 
The original OEM poppets that belong to the post should be the right size. But I've had kegs where the wrong poppets were used, and of course they didn't seal right. The Universal ones are only one size, and as @day_trippr said, can be too long for certain posts. In that case the spring will already compress too much, then when pushing on a QD (which also has a poppet and spring in it) it won't be able to get the keg's poppet down any further to open up the gateway. It's about the correct balance of force between the 2 springs. So trim to the right size, or find the correct OEM poppets.

On a side note, I'm almost afraid to ask how much they clipped you for filling a whole keg of IPA. 40 pints, yowsers!
 
IslandLizard: Thanks for the feedback, Ill trim a really small section of the spring to test.

In regards to the IPA it was "only" $55, so nothing crazy, but I can't plan on having this type of thing happen again. I see you're in MD, and I am too, I got it filled at a microbrewery restaurant here in Frederick, MD called Barley and Hops (F. Scott Key is the IPA).
 
Day_trippr: you mentioned a possible problem could be the carbonation is exceeding the current co2 pressure. How can this be fixed??

Sorry, missed this question.

If you carbonate beer at any specific temperature and pressure combination long enough to reach equilibrium, and then either lower the gas pressure or raise the beer temperature, CO2 will have no choice but to break out of solution to reach the "new" equilibrium.

This why tuning a dispensing system so at the preferred beer temperature the CO2 pressure can be set to maintain the desired carbonation level is important. If the beer line resistance is insufficient and you have to lower the dispensing pressure, CO2 will be popping out of the beer, guaranteed.

If for whatever reason the you decide the beer is carbed too high the simple fix is to shut off the CO2 to the keg and bleed the head space pressure - repeatedly over time - until it's calmed down...

Cheers!
 
Thanks @day_trippr and @IslandLizard for the help!!! I got the same IPA from my local brewpub and let it sit for a full 24hrs (something I didnt do last time). Cleaned all my equipment (taps and lines), I also changed out the gas poppet to the new one in the previous pics. I turned the PSI up to about 12-13 and opened up my tap and Ive got great flowing beer with no gas pockets in the beer line. This definitely made my day, and now I feel a little more comfortable about having my own beer on tap and not wasting it because of the foam issues I was having before. Thanks again guys!!!!
 
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