Something is not right with first brew

Ok my first brew has conditioned for 3 weeks in bottles well 3 weeks minus 2 days. I put a sixpack in the fridge for 2 days to make it a full 3 weeks. A week ago it had a raw hop flavor. It tasted like the hops smelled when you open the bag. This week it is almost a sour flavor but familiar of the older flavor. It's still drinkable but not as good as it was last week. It seems it is gaining a more sour flavor over time instead of tasting better as it conditions. Could it have been the fermentation temps that did this? I've been working on building a fermentation chamber today so if it is I should have the problem fixed.

If it's "sour", it sounds more like an infection but it could be fermentation temperatures as well if they were out of control. Usually, high fermentation temperatures are fruity, especially bananas, but also can have clove flavor and "hot" flavors as well as some solventy flavors.

I don't have anything to indicate an infection. It is slightly cloudy when poured. Good carbonation. No floaties or anything. I know I did not have much control at all on temp and house temp could have gone anywhere from 70-76F during the ferment and bottling. I would not call it fruity or banana but hot or solventy could be used to describe it.

Cimerian said:

I don't have anything to indicate an infection.

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Other than the sour taste.

Ok, smartass mode off. If it continues to get more sour, you might have to come to terms with the fact that its quite possibly an infection. Most of your off flavors are created during fermentation, and therefore aren't going to get significantly worse with time. Infection and oxidation are two exceptions.

Ah ok so the slight sour flavor getting worse over time means more likely an infection than if it was to stay the same which would indicate fermentation temps? I thought getting an infection in your very first brew was nearly impossible

Ok it has got to be the temps. I just opened an IPA that is only 1 week into conditioning and it has the exact same taste. The more I think about it the more I am convinced it is a solvent taste rather than a sour taste.

Hope so... But this is exactly what happened with my first infection... The sour started off small... tried to convince myself that it was the fermentation... but the sourness def increased...to the point of undrinkability.

Pretend its a Berlinerweisse... with hops

I'm in the exact same boat with my first brew. First one was great, but they seem to be getting worse. At first I thought I might have just been so excited about my first one that I convinced myself it was good, but others have assured me it was good. So now I'm thinking it picked up a lacto infection during bottling or something. So it hadn't taken hold for the first one, but was getting worse and worse as conditioning went along. Its going to be sad to dump.

Note that sour beer is perfectly usable for cooking! There are all kinds of possibilities with beer bread, braised short ribs, marinades, stews, rarebits, polish sausage, and so on.

You can also go all the way and try making malt vinegar which - as you may have discovered - is really easy to do.

Dumping a batch of undrinkable beer is a last resort. You've already spent the money on it - find a way to use it.

cullen said:

Note that sour beer is perfectly usable for cooking! There are all kinds of possibilities with beer bread, braised short ribs, marinades, stews, rarebits, polish sausage, and so on.

You can also go all the way and try making malt vinegar which - as you may have discovered - is really easy to do.

Dumping a batch of undrinkable beer is a last resort. You've already spent the money on it - find a way to use it.

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I have to agree with this. Lots of cooking to be done with it

I think I may have figured out where I went wrong. I was very careful to clean and sanitize everything but I do remember on each of these brews I opened the bag containing the bottle caps and just capped the bottles right from the bag. This has got to be where I screwed up. I was so worried about the bottles being clean I completely overlooked the caps because they were in a nice sealed bag.

Cimerian said:

I think I may have figured out where I went wrong. I was very careful to clean and sanitize everything but I do remember on each of these brews I opened the bag containing the bottle caps and just capped the bottles right from the bag. This has got to be where I screwed up. I was so worried about the bottles being clean I completely overlooked the caps because they were in a nice sealed bag.

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Ideally, you'd sanitize the caps. But I don't think that's where the infection is coming from, if it IS an infection.

I tried another one a few minutes ago. Poured out well nice head on it looked good. Tasted it and yuck. It was way more drinkable 2 weeks ago and last week. I took 2 drinks and poured it out. I'm torn if it is an infection or temperature related but it is definitely getting worse as it ages. It went from wow that tastes good but needs a bit more to ugh this is getting nasty. Either way I have built a fermentation chamber so my next batch will ferment at exactly 64F and I will ensure everything that touches the beer gets sterilized.

Others can disagree with me, but I doubt the caps did it, especially if they came right out of a sealed bag. I have read and listened to various sources that say it isn't needed. Also, if your beer is sour across all bottles opened, then the infection probably happened before bottling. If it did happen from the caps or bottles, then the sour would be inconsistent across the bottles because the chances of every cap and every bottle causing the infection is pretty low.

I never sanitize my caps, because the oxygen scouring caps I use are activated by liquid and I assume that if I sanitize before capping they won't be able to scour.

An aluminum brew kettle would not give this problem would it? I've been using one and did not think it would make that much difference but some have said they would never use aluminum because of the taste? Maybe metals leeching from the pot? I'm just drawing at straws here. I thought I had it nailed to the caps as everything else was sanitized to the inth.

I think an Al pot would not be a good thing. Any amount of acidity would surely react with the Al.. Been a ton of years since HS and College chemistry tho.. Others are likely to have more experience.

Aluminum is fine, as long as it has the oxidized layer on it. That's easy to do- just boil some water in the pot so it's not so shiny.

The sour flavor is NOT from aluminum!

I would bet it's the caps. They are machined and bagged up on a factory floor. All sorts of stuff would be there and it would be consistent across the board because it was used across the board.

The oxy caps cost more and may because of their makeup be a cleaner cap, but I wouldn't skip making sure they are cleaned.

I am a newby here, but decades of canning experience. I would never can something with out a hot water bath for the lid caps. Even though they look clean out of the box, they aren't produced in a super clean environment.

Well I'm now going to make 3 specific changes to my process. 1- I ordered a ss brew kettle. 2- caps are added to sterilize process and 3- fermentation chamber is up so no temp problems. I really can't think of any other place I may have messed up. Any other common areas newbs miss when brewing that cause bad flavors?

Cimerian said:

Well I'm now going to make 3 specific changes to my process. 1- I ordered a ss brew kettle. 2- caps are added to sterilize process and 3- fermentation chamber is up so no temp problems. I really can't think of any other place I may have messed up. Any other common areas newbs miss when brewing that cause bad flavors?

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The big ones would be fermentation temperatures and underpitching of yeast.

Cimerian said:

Well I'm now going to make 3 specific changes to my process. 1- I ordered a ss brew kettle. 2- caps are added to sterilize process and 3- fermentation chamber is up so no temp problems. I really can't think of any other place I may have messed up. Any other common areas newbs miss when brewing that cause bad flavors?

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I use an aluminum kettle for all my boils. Never had a problem. If you have the $$$$ than SS is very nice. I like your other ideas though. I used to put my caps in a Tupperware container filled with starsan. Took them out as I capped. What do you sanitize with??

I'm still new to this.. so, can't speak with any authority. One thing I am incorporating into my process is to fill a good spray bottle with Star-San. After submerging everything I can in the solution and drip drying, I'll, as a precaution, spray some things before actually using or dropping into the wort.. such as the inside of the valve before I insert the bottling wand.. as well as the wand itself prior to inserting into the first bottle. An oz of precaution will hopefully be a good reward. Maybe overkill.. but, until I get the process down.. I'm going to continue this.

HbgBill said:

I'm still new to this.. so, can't speak with any authority. One thing I am incorporating into my process is to fill a good spray bottle with Star-San. After submerging everything I can in the solution and drip drying, I'll, as a precaution, spray some things before actually using or dropping into the wort.. such as the inside of the valve before I insert the bottling wand.. as well as the wand itself prior to inserting into the first bottle. An oz of precaution will hopefully be a good reward. Maybe overkill.. but, until I get the process down.. I'm going to continue this.

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This is good sound sanitizing practice. I second the spray bottle. Works awesome

I boil my crown caps to sanitize, and that works well.

I guess I didn't ruin them all! There were two left in the fridge out of that six pack and I was going to dump them out but decided to take a taste to just to see. Both of those tasted like the others did before the sour flavor. So I drank those 2 and put another six pack from the closet in to chill for the weekend. I'm guessing my bottling practices need some work and I must have contaminated some of the bottles or something somehow. What a relief I didn't ruin the whole batch.

Sounds like something gross in some of your bottles. I like to wash mine twice before sanitizing them. I do the first wash after emptying each bottle into my belly. The second happens the day before bottling just in case. (The emptying process makes me suspect the reliability of the first wash.) Then I sanitize just before bottling. It's probably overkill but I haven't had a bad bottle yet.