Will this cheap 3500 watt induction burner work?

[borealis]

I am hoping to use it on my electric range outlet which is supported by a 50 amp breaker in the panel. The induction burner has a NEMA 6-20P plug.

 

[FirstCause]

Here's how it SHOULD work in a correctly wired house...
Wires are installed in the house in a gauge that matches the expected load on the circuit, then a breaker is installed that matches the safe load cutoff for that circuit so that if more current than expected is drawn then the breaker trips to prevent fire.

So, if your setup was wired professionally and is on a 50A breaker, then up to 50A total can be pulled on that circuit before the breaker trips to stop the potential overheating.
The breaker is the safety device.

 

[AnOldUR]

I don't claim to know code, but agree with what's been said about the circuit breaker being rated to protect the wiring to the receptacle, not the device plugged into the receptacle. And that you can plug in anything drawing up to the breakers rated amperage. Here’s a company that sells the type of adapter that you’re looking for.

EVSEadapters.com

Note: If you require a NEMA L6-20 connection instead of the L6-30, simply mention it in the notes section when you order and we will make the change. It will be the same price.

 

[dyqik]

NO! An appliance should never be plugged into an outlet with a higher rating than the appliance. A table lamp may only use half an amp, but the lamps wiring is rated for 15 amps. Plugging the lamp (or your hotplate) into a 50 amp outlet could cause the wiring to catch fire before the fuse or breaker blows if there is some kind of malfunction.

Sorry, yes, I ignored the safety issue. This is an issue if the device doesn't have suitable built-in protection to protect itself. A plug-in 15 or 20A breaker or inline fuse would be sufficient if it doesn't. But there's no such thing as "too much current capacity" on a circuit for a correctly functioning appliance, and it can be made safe with minimal work, which was how I interpreted the original question.

 

[stevew]

personally, my policy has always been you can never be too safe. If something happens to the hotplate, say water gets in it, the difference between a 20 fuse and a 50 amp fuse may mean repairing (or just drying) and replacing the hotplate. If it was me I would make the adapter from the oven receptacle to the hotplate using a spa panel from the big box store. That would also provide ground fault protection.

 

[whoaru99]

I don't claim to know code, but agree with what's been said about the circuit breaker being rated to protect the wiring to the receptacle, not the device plugged into the receptacle. And that you can plug in anything drawing up to the breakers rated amperage. Here’s a company that sells the type of adapter that you’re looking for.

So you claim not to know Code, yet give information that seems to contradict Code?

Oh, I absolutely agree that the house breaker isn't there to protect the device. Ultimately, the breaker is there to protect you.

However, as mentioned previously, the wires connected to the branch circuit have to be of sufficient size to -

a. create a low enough resistance to trip the breaker in the event of a fault
b. survive the fault current long enough for the breaker to trip, without overheating/starting a fire

A good example of a thin wire on a large breaker is your toaster. That's the type of situation one tries to avoid by not connecting a thin wire (relatively speaking) to a big breaker.

 

[carlk47]

I went the spa panel route to be safe.. I plug the spa panel into the dryer outlet in the basement.

 

[whoaru99]

What's the gauge of wire in the 3500W induction plate cord? Often it says right on the cable jacket.

 

[borealis]

Thanks for the replies. Alternatively, after looking more in my panel, I have a line with a 20 amp breaker that used to be dedicated to the blower fan of an old garage heater. Could I just use that line and have someone wire it to the appropriate outlet? It would be easier to make the stove outlet work though.

 

[AnOldUR]

. . . After looking more in my panel, i have a line with a 20 amp breaker that used to be dedicated to the blower fan . . .

240v?

 

[borealis]

That's a great question...it is only one pole so that would make it 110, right? That would have been too convenient.

 

[whoaru99]

Thanks for the replies. Alternatively, after looking more in my panel, I have a line with a 20 amp breaker that used to be dedicated to the blower fan of an old garage heater. Could I just use that line and have someone wire it to the appropriate outlet? It would be easier to make the stove outlet work though.

If the garage heater was 240V you're probably already there with just the receptacle change.

If the garage heater was 120V, and it is truly a dedicated circuit wired with 12/2 w/ground, then it could be repurposed to a 240V-only (not 120/240V) circuit. Probably would have to do some juggling in the breaker panel to get it connected to a double pole breaker, and ensure the white wire is properly marked to indicate it's a hot wire, etc., etc.

 

[tbelczak]

I have been active on this thread promoting this induction cooktop, posting photos and videos and answering questions when I can. Though I still love the performance of the unit, I did experience a problem that prevents me from giving it my highest recommendation. I feel I have to share it since my opinion has changed slightly.

I've owned the cooktop just under a year and have made 20 5-gallon batches of beer with it. During my last batch, the unit suddenly shut off just as I reached boiling. I suspected a blown fuse.

The warranty is only 6-months, but I figured since I am not a daily commercial user, they may take this into consideration and provide a replacement or refer me to a local service company and pick up the repair cost. I wrote to the manufacturer (Avantco) and carbon copied WEBstraunt Store, form whom I purchased the product. Avantco could not do anything - they manufacture exclusively for WEBstraunt Store and the warranty is handled through WEBstraunt Store. Bummer.

Though both companies were quick to respond and offered some basic tips, they would not budge on the warranty period. Figuring I was stuck with a dead unit, I ignored the warning not to open the cover (no user-serviceable parts inside) to check things out and see if there is a fuse I could replace myself. There is a 15A 250V fuse soldered to the circuit board with short leads (as shown in photo). Once I tested this with my multimeter and figured it was blown, I peeled the protective coating off to verify.

Hoping the fuse was the only issue and not wanting to go through tedious future replacements, I clipped the fuse leaving the leads as long as possible and soldered some 14 AWG stranded wire onto them - then to a 30A 250V fuse holder. I bought a pack of 15A 250V fuses to have on hand in case this happens again. I will give the maximum setting of 3500W another shot, but 3500W / 240V = 14.58A - very close to the 15A fuse limit. If it blows again, I will just run the cooktop at the 3100W setting in the future. It will still boil, but will take just a bit longer. I did suggest to them that they manufacturer this with a user-replaceable fuse.

So take this for what it's worth. I do like the performance and going induction was the best upgrade I've made to my home brewery. I'm glad the problem was not more serious and I had some very basic electronics experience (and professionals to brain-pick) to fix this myself. The short lifespan and unwillingness to budge on the warranty did sour my impression of the manufacturer and retailer, but I'm glad I'm at least not left with a brick.

Hope this helps, but I suspect if you're like me, it will make the purchase decision even harder. I tend to ignore isolated bad reviews and chance it! All the reviews I could find on this are at WEBstrauntstore.com (basically the private label owner/exclusive distributor), who may just remove the negative ones. I know I have not read anything bad about this unit in my previous research.

 

[augiedoggy]

You could have gone with a "slow blo" fuse if they make them that big which I think they do...

 

[tbelczak]

You could have gone with a "slow blo" fuse if they make them that big which I think they do...

Thanks for the tip. I believe what I bought are slow-blow:

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2102754

 

[brettwasbtd]

Thanks tbelczak! This is unfortunate. I have being saving up for this and other items to get my basement electric setup done. I unfortunately have already spent out the money for the electrical and specifically for this induction cooktop . I guess I will still end up going with this and just be careful on the power setting/usage. I think in my electrical(very limited) research, the 240v can vary on your location +/- a few volts. Is it possible your house may have a lower voltage coming in (or did for that short period of time) causing it to blow? I guess any voltage below 233.33 would put you over 15 amps at the 3500watt setting.

Since you did open it up...did you potentially see anyway to provide an external control for the power? Something that could be useful for temp controlling?

 

[whoaru99]

As a general rule, one should not replace a fast blow fuse with a slow blow fuse. The reverse isn't usually a problem other than you're pretty likely to blow a fast blow fuse of the same rating where a slow blow was originally spec'ed.

 

[whoaru99]

I guess any voltage below 233.33 would put you over 15 amps at the 3500watt setting.

Don't know the electrical load nature of this thing but decreasing voltage doesn't necessarily mean increasing current. For some devices that's true, for others it's not.

 

[dyqik]

Don't know the electrical load nature of this thing but decreasing voltage doesn't necessarily mean increasing current. For some devices that's true, for others it's not.

For purely resistive devices, like a normal heating elements, it's the opposite - high voltage = high current and low voltage = low current.

 

[AnOldUR]

For purely resistive devices, like a normal heating elements, it's the opposite - high voltage = high current and low voltage = low current.

Anyone know if an induction heater works as a "resistive device" or is somehow different?

 

[tbelczak]

Thanks tbelczak! This is unfortunate. I have being saving up for this and other items to get my basement electric setup done. I unfortunately have already spent out the money for the electrical and specifically for this induction cooktop . I guess I will still end up going with this and just be careful on the power setting/usage. I think in my electrical(very limited) research, the 240v can vary on your location +/- a few volts. Is it possible your house may have a lower voltage coming in (or did for that short period of time) causing it to blow? I guess any voltage below 233.33 would put you over 15 amps at the 3500watt setting.

Since you did open it up...did you potentially see anyway to provide an external control for the power? Something that could be useful for temp controlling?

I don't know enough about electronics to answer your question about controlling external power, but I've included a photo of the insides that may tell you something. Seems like everything associated with the external power is a screw terminal and easily accessible.

 

[Wynne-R]

I think the issue is heat inside the case. In a hot environment you have to de-rate the fuse. Fortunately, by putting the fuse outside the case you have effectively solved the problem

Even without the heat, 15 amps seems a little light. The line voltage can vary by 5%, so if the load is constant, the actual current could be 14 - 16 amps.

Boiling a big pot is making the thing work pretty hard. I would have used a 20.

 

[tbelczak]

I think the issue is heat inside the case. In a hot environment you have to de-rate the fuse. Fortunately, by putting the fuse outside the case you have effectively solved the problem

Even without the heat, 15 amps seems a little light. The line voltage can vary by 5%, so if the load is constant, the actual current could be 14 - 16 amps.

Boiling a big pot is making the thing work pretty hard. I would have used a 20.

The fuse holder I bought is rated for 30A, so I can always upgrade the fuse if needed without replacing any parts. I plan to give the 15A 250V another shot since I got a 4-pack of them at RadioShack. There is a huge heat sink and big fan on the unit, so I think the insides do stay relatively cool.

 

[whoaru99]

For purely resistive devices, like a normal heating elements, it's the opposite - high voltage = high current and low voltage = low current.

Yes.

I didn't specify any particular way because the nature of the device is unknown. Some increase draw as voltage drops, SMPS is a good example, some decrease draw as voltage drops, like your example of a resistive heater.

The pictures of the induction plate guts tend to make me think it's akin to a SMPS and thus probably draws more current to maintain the output if supply voltage drops. Again, this is unknown for sure, but it's what I speculate.

 

[AnOldUR]

If it blows again, I will just run the cooktop at the 3100W setting in the future.

Hard to say what caused your problem, but as a comparison, over the last two years I've brewed 28 batches with the same induction hob. Most were 11 gallon boils that lasted at least 75 minutes (not counting the time it takes to get to a boil) and the unit was run mostly at the full 3500 watt setting. The power coming into my house is in the 235 to 240 volts range.

Not to mention that two years ago, I ran an extension to the back yard and used it to fry a turkey for Thanksgiving. Thought for sure I'd destroyed it. The oil boiled over and covered everything. :cross:

Just saying, from my experience, it's a pretty solid unit.

 

[carlk47]

Up and running!

 

[Aerobrew]

Exactly what I was thinking of doing, induction and the megapot. What size pot is that? How well has it been working for you, any issues with boils or anything? I am trying to plan out my brewery right now and if this is working good for you, I think I will go that way. I have been impressed with the megapots for the price.

 

[carlk47]

Exactly what I was thinking of doing, induction and the megapot. What size pot is that? How well has it been working for you, any issues with boils or anything? I am trying to plan out my brewery right now and if this is working good for you, I think I will go that way. I have been impressed with the megapots for the price.

I just got my Megapot so I haven't had the chance to brew on it yet... will let you know after I brew up a Dunkelweizen this weekend! I boiled 4.5 gal of water in it last night just to test it out and it went from 60 degrees to boiling in 45 minutes. I will probably put 7-8 gal in it tonight and see how long that takes to boil.

It's a 10 gal pot

 

[carlk47]

Boiled up 8 gals of water in about 65-70 minutes starting from 60 degrees. Took around 45 minutes to get to 160(approx. strike temp). Pretty happy with these results for kitchen brewing!

 

[Aerobrew]

That is great news. I have been putting off purchasing the MegaPot just because I didn't know if it would work with induction. Thank you for the details it helps me out tremendously.