Why not fruit into primary? (After fermentation)

[Javaslinger]

90% of people seem to suggest adding fruit after primary fermentation in a secondary container. If I'm not planning on harvesting the yeast - why not just add it to the primary vessel after fermentation is complete? What is the downside?

Some specifics. I'm making a Belgian Saison with PawPaw fruit (sort of tropical flavored) and I not going to harvest the yeast or back sweeten. I'm thinking of adding the fruit in a mesh bag to keep is out of the keg when I rack over. I do plan to cold crash and possibly fine with gelatin.

Thanks for your input!

 

[Andrew Hodgson]

I add fruit/additional fermentables right into the primary. I use a technique I think some people around here use which is I usually will add some sugar (4-8oz) boiled briefly in about a cup of water, when I add the fruit or whatever you want to add for "secondary". People say this helps scrub the 02 you add by opening the bucket, I don't know but a couple more points of abv and maybe getting rid of some 02 seems like a fine process to me.

 

[Javaslinger]

hmmm, I had completely missed that the fruit my start the fermentation back up. I guess I don't want that to happen...

Maybe rack to a keg with the fruit in a bag in the keg? Try to not secondary....

 

[TwistedGray]

hmmm, I had completely missed that the fruit my start the fermentation back up. I guess I don't want that to happen...

Maybe rack to a keg with the fruit in a bag in the keg? Try to not secondary....

Well, it depends on what you're going for.

Adding to the keg will add a much sweeter and fruitier beer (depending on quantity obviously). If you want a pawpaw umph, adding to the keg is the way to go.

Adding to the fermentation process (in the primary) will mellow the fruit flavors quite a bit because the sugars will be converted to alcohol over another 1-2 weeks. If you go this route, use the "standard" 1lb of fruit to 1gal of beer.

 

[RM-MN]

hmmm, I had completely missed that the fruit my start the fermentation back up. I guess I don't want that to happen...

Maybe rack to a keg with the fruit in a bag in the keg? Try to not secondary....

Unless you completely filter out the yeast or heat kill it, you will get more fermentation any time you add fruit because it always has some sugars that the yeast like. If you add the fruit to the keg without removing or killing the yeast you will get fermentation in the keg which then becomes the secondary and serving vessel.

 

[myndflyte]

hmmm, I had completely missed that the fruit my start the fermentation back up. I guess I don't want that to happen...

No way of really stopping that unless your fruit has very little sugar in it or you kill/filter out the yeast.

 

[mongoose33]

I don't do fruit in beers, so no experience here, but won't fermentation start up again in secondary? That is, unless you filter the beer going into the secondary, or pasteurize it--and who at the homebrew level does that?

When we bottle or keg condition, we add sugar and while most of the yeast is gone, there is still enough in suspension to consume the sugar and carbonate the beer. Why would that not happen in secondary with the fruit sugars?

What am I missing?

 

[Javaslinger]

Well, when I talk about adding fruit to a keg we're looking at temps around 40F. You're going to get a lot less fermentation both because there is much less yeast and the temps are quite low for the yeast.

 

[00Seven]

1/4 T potassium sorbate
1/2 T potassium metabisulfate

This will sterilize any extra critters from your fruit and then kill the yeast. Just make 100% you have reached the end of fermentation and then add everything into your primary bucket. I prefer to primary in a bucket and secondary in a carboy simply because I have more room to settle stuff out and it's easier to get my siphon in the right spot without me having to stand and hold it forever.

Anyway once you double check your done fermenting, add the stuff, wait 3 days to make sure fermentation doesn't start back up, then cold crash and keg. Kegging and force carbonating is best with fruit as you will get the full impact of the flavors. You've also killed your yeast so you may not be able to sugar prime (I force carb everything so I don't know if it would work or not)

 

[TwistedGray]

As was noted, you will continue to ferment in the keg; however, at those low temps I would not be all that concerned.

 

[Metalchef1]

Where are you getting your pawpaw from and how are you going to prepare it? I used to work with them quite often and if you are planning a puree, the mix will turn almost dull gun metal grey before you finish pureeing it.... They oxidize very rapidly...made the most hideous Panna cotta I've ever created.

I'm dying to know the flavor of the beer as they have a very mellow subdued flavor.

 

[Javaslinger]

Where are you getting your pawpaw from and how are you going to prepare it?

I'm dying to know the flavor of the beer as they have a very mellow subdued flavor.

We harvest them locally each year. We've made wine a few times with that. Basically we peel them and pit them by hand. The result is basically a mush. I froze that until ready. The very top layer did oxidize to a dark brown but the rest was a luscious golden PawPaw color. Still smelled and tasted great.

I too am curious about the flavor. The wine we have made it subdued indeed. But we used a bit over 5lbs for a 5 gallon batch which is way more than over for the wine.. I'm hopeful! We'll know if a few weeks!

 

[Metalchef1]

We harvest them locally each year. We've made wine a few times with that. Basically we peel them and pit them by hand. The result is basically a mush. I froze that until ready. The very top layer did oxidize to a dark brown but the rest was a luscious golden PawPaw color. Still smelled and tasted great.

I too am curious about the flavor. The wine we have made it subdued indeed. But we used a bit over 5lbs for a 5 gallon batch which is way more than over for the wine.. I'm hopeful! We'll know if a few weeks!

Going to need you to keep me posted on this one..
What are you planning on for the base beer?

 

[Javaslinger]

Going to need you to keep me posted on this one..
What are you planning on for the base beer?

Already made it. A pretty mild saison. I fermented at 72 to keep it from getting too funky. I think it's going to be a great base for this. We cold crashed it w/ gelatin overnight and racked it over the fruit today. I'm going to keep it in the keezer in secondary at 42 for maybe a week to soak up as much fruit character as possible without the yeast chewing it all up. We shall see.