Why is there a consistent off taste in my brew?

[leghorn]

Noob help needed...

I just opened a bottle of my third brew; a LHBS Amber Ale kit. 2 weeks primary, 2 weeks secondary, 3 weeks bottle conditioned. I use Deer Park spring water because the tap water I used for the first brew contained an iron taste. I just haven't yet learned enough about water conditioning to add salts.

So the second brew (Honey brown ale) was generally pretty good. However, that one and the 3d ale have a taste, like a harsh bitter or metallic taste that is not what I would expect the hops to provide. I drank 2 commercial brews prior to popping the homebrew, so I can pick-up the off flavor pretty well. Any ideas?

The ale itself looks great; clear with good amber color and a 2-3 finger head on the pour. If it matters, I know I have screwed up the aeration of wort - I've been confused and been racking the wort after chilling from pot to primary.

Thanks in advance for the advice...I've read lots of threads so far that have broadened my understanding, looking forward to some specific help...

 

[brewt00l]

What were the recipes for those two brews? Anything added besides malt, hops, yeast and water? Extract, PM or AG?

 

[kenche]

Unfortunately this is a bit like asking "why do my girlfriends keep dumping me?". It could because you are an ass, but maybe you are a nice guy who keeps hooking up with b1tches.

Without knowing your step by step processes it is hard to guess. John Palmer's howtobrew site suggests the following causes for metallic tastes:

Metallic
Metallic flavors are usually caused by unprotected metals dissolving into the wort but can also be caused by the hydrolysis of lipids in poorly stored malts. Iron and aluminum can cause metallic flavors leaching into the wort during the boil. The small amount could be considered to be nutritional if it weren't for the bad taste. Nicks and cracks ceramic coated steel pots are a common cause as are high iron levels in well water. Stainless steel pots will not contribute any metallic flavors. Aluminum pots usually won't cause metallic flavors unless the brewing water is alkaline with a pH level greater than 9. Shiny new aluminum pots will sometimes turn black when boiling water due to chlorine and carbonates in the water.

The protective (grayish) oxides of aluminum can be enhanced by heating the clean pot in a dry oven at 250°F for about 6 hours.​

 

[leghorn]

The recipes are:

Honey Brown ale
5 lb Light LME
2 lb Amber LME
2lb Honey malt
1/2 lb Chocolate malt

1oz cascasde at 60 minutes
1 oz cascade at 30 minutes

WLP001 California Ale yeast

Amber Ale
5.5 lb Light LME
18 oz crystal malt
2 oz roasted barley

1oz Challenger at 45 minutes
.5 oz Styrian goldings at 15 minutes

WLP004 Irish Ale Yeast

The only item that seems consistent is the water (Deer Park). And my techniques, I guess, but I feel reasonably certain that I'm following the extract brewing process process with the exception of wort aeration. Thanks again for the help.

 

[brewt00l]

I would not expect oxidation to be your cause since the off flavors are not matching what you would anticipate. In your shoes, I would think about ordering a kit from Morebeer, Northern Brewer, Midwest Supply or AHS to eliminate the common source of your LME....unless, there is something obvious being overlooked..

 

[Yooper]

The only thing I see is the LME, too. You could try to put together a recipe with DME to see if that solves it.

 

[zoebisch01]

That water is fairly neutral iirc. I am with the tool and Yoops on this one. The one extract brew I did had an off flavor and it was from the LME (the container was a metal can). Although they say metal cans are fine, etc, etc. I have noticed when food products go too long in them they can indeed pick up the flavor from the metal.

 

[jmiracle]

COuld it maybe be the pot? (The one on the stove, not the stuff hidden in the back of your sock drawer). It was the same in all cases, i'd assume. Maybe you're using a ceramic coated pot with cracks or something?

 

[mrfocus]

Just trying to eliminate all possibilities.

Do you bottle in glass and use a capper? Are the caps made of metal? Are you drinking straight out of the bottle?

If you answered yes to all those questions, I would try drinking one from a glass (actually all beer should be drunk from a glass).

I don't mean to insult your intelligence, I just clearly remember a post on here where this was the problem.

 

[leghorn]

Thanks for the input from everyone. I bottle conditioned with metal caps and poured in a glass to drink. I am using a relatively new SS pot. My next effort will be the 8-8-8 RIS (already on order from Austin Homebrew), so I can compare those ingredients to my LHBS.

Assuming all else is correctly applied; my only other thought is that the carbonation from bottle conditioning has a different flavor than the commercial brews I am used to. Possibly it is just a difference in taste styles that I am getting used to. Or possibly I am kidding myself. Either way, since I will be bottle conditioning the RIS, I'll know pretty soon. Also, I have a Rogue Dead Guy clone in the secondary right now, and I did perform proper wort aeration on that one (thanks to the help from threads on this site). I will be able to compare that result to this amber ale. So I guess this topic is dead until I can compare future beers, unless someone has an idea that's not yet been brought up. I don't think I'd pay to drink it, but since it's there and free...

This overall forum is informative, enjoyable, and addictive. Looking forward to being a part of it. Thanks again for the quick help.

 

[Austinhomebrew]

Does the extract you are using come in a metal can?

 

[malkore]

extract 'twang'?
were you drinking lagers right before you downed this ale? a co-worker of mine bitched about 'not liking ales...I'll have none of that'...but then promptly drank 3 pints of my brew, which is ALL ale yeast.

does your brew pot have a drain spigot in it? is it 100% SS or could it have any brass in it? or could the welding be done 'wrong'?

spring water is fine, and shouldn't need brewing salts unless you're after a specific water chemistry.
but something like distilled water or RO water would be too stripped of nutrients, and you'd want to add a little something back to it.

 

[TheJadedDog]

I'd be willing to bet the LME is the culprit.

 

[Austinhomebrew]

I'd be willing to bet the LME is the culprit.

Liquid malt extract from a can tastes tends to leave a metalic taste. Use fresh malt extract made in North America.

Just think of fresh pineapple versus pineapple from a can. Same metalic taste.

 

[leghorn]

If I recall correctly, I had a Fullers ESB and Doghead fish 90 minute IPA before the Amber Ale (doing a little taste-testing). The pot is 100% SS, no spigot.

My pallete may not be refined enough, but for all the flavor and aroma in the Fullers and Dogfish, along with many other ales I've been enjoying, all I taste from the homebrew is an overwhelming harsh bitterness, and almost a metallic taste. It's so overwhelming, I can't really taste anything flavorful.

The LME was dispensed from what looked to be a large plastic barrel at the LHBS into another plastic container that I took home. Hopefully the ingredients for the 8-8-8 RIS I ordered from Austin Homebrew Supply will give me something to compare against.

Glad to know spring water isn't the issue. I'm going to give the amber ale more time in the bottle, and see what it's like in a couple weeks. Thanks again.

 

[Schlenkerla]

How old are your brews?

If you can find the root cause like the LME hold onto those beers and start another batch maybe w/ DME or another LME source. The metallic taste will fade with time. I had a bad batch that I almost tossed, however at about 4-5 months the metallic taste was gone.

 

[leghorn]

Schlenkerla -

The honey brown I brewed is gone. But the Amber Ale just finished it's 3 weeks in bottle conditioning. I'm with you; I'm going to shelve it and taste it periodically to see if age improves it.