Why does our Pale Ale mash taste nutty?

[magnj]

Last week we brewed an Amber, had quite a bit of nutty taste during mash but I figured it was because of all the crystal we used.

However this week we are brewing a pale ale. 20% vienna, 78% Briess 2-row, 2% C-60L.

Again the mash has a distinct nutty taste and it's less sweet than I'm typically used to tasting. Our mash temps were 156 both weeks, which is slightly high but I've mashed that high before and never ran into this.

For the record we are running an e-rims 10g setup, we are not melting the element or anything, no malt looks to be caramelized on the element after brew day.

The malt isn't super old but it has been open a few months, could it have gotten moisture or something in it?

Help

 

[magnj]

Any input guys? Very frustrating, we have our brew day going smoothly for the first time in a long time and we are producing some sub par wort.

I'm assuming if we were caramelizing the wort we would see some indication of burning on the element?

 

[Yooper]

Any input guys? Very frustrating, we have our brew day going smoothly for the first time in a long time and we are producing some sub par wort.

I'm assuming if we were caramelizing the wort we would see some indication of burning on the element?

Caramelizing the wort wouldn't taste "nutty", it would taste more like caramel or even burnt/scorched sugar.

I think Vienna malt does have a distinct nutty taste to it. Not as much as Victory malt, but there is a real "bready nut" smell and taste to it for me.

Grab a bite of the grains. If they don't taste stale, they are fine!

 

[magnj]

Hmm, it's tough to describe the flavor, it could be caramel. I suspect with the amber that it was the high % of Crystal 60, but this batch we used hardly any, same effect. Never tasted anything like this, I wonder if my grain got moist at some point and did something weird. Unfortunately I don't have my hands on what's left of the bag at the moment. But we are almost out so we'll be buying a new bag, then I guess I'll have to compare.

 

[mabrungard]

A hint of tannin can create a nutty perception. Maybe this wort was oversparged or the sparge water had too high a pH or alkalinity?

 

[magnj]

We are looking to water next. We did note in the pale that the sparge was running really clear at the end, was kind of hard to tell with the amber. Not really sure how to fix that... should I increase the water/grain ratio on the mash? We require a relatively high preboil volume because our boil off rate is something like 25%

 

[mabrungard]

When I finally bought a refractometer, it really improved my ability to cut off the sparging and runoff in comparison to taking hydrometer samples. They aren't that expensive. Put it on your wish list if you don't already have one.

 

[magnj]

Yea it's on there too lol. So if I get you correctly your talking about stopping the sparge if your gravity drops below a certain % during runoff? What if you haven't hit your preboil volume?

 

[jonmohno]

You taste your mash? I usually taste my cooled wort hydrometer sample.Never thought of trying a mash sample. Have you ever used vienna?

 

[magnj]

Yea I taste my mash fairly regularly. I have used vienna many times, I typically expect biscuit, bread, etc.

 

[eastoak]

what does the beer taste like? isn't that the important part? beer has funky colors, tastes and smells throughout the process but what really matters is the end result.

 

[3PegBrew]

How distinct is the nutty flavor? Does it pop "NUTTY" or is it a hint?

 

[eastoak]

How distinct is the nutty flavor? Does it pop "NUTTY" or is it a hint?

yeah, did you crack a nut?

 

[magnj]

This batch it was noticeable, previous batch it was overwhelming. It's possible I'm describing the flavor poorly, it may in fact have been a strong caramel flavor. Neither of these flavors are something I expect to find during mash or in the final product.

We're going to try a few things including new grain, maybe some new rice hulls, work on water chemistry, crush finer, increase sparge length.

The thing that really popped out at me was just that I typically find the mash sweet, and I have people taste it when we brew as i'm explaining the process of sugar conversion. this time it tasted off, and our efficiency was poor. Clearly there is a link somewhere, just not sure what yet. Thanks for the help so far.

 

[eastoak]

have you tasted any of the finished beer, or is it all too green to drink?

 

[magnj]

tasted some of the amber, it's a bit young but it's definitely got the same strangeness to it. The more I think about it the more obvious it becomes that since our efficiency was bad our sugar conversion must have been bad. It just really lacked sweetness. Try your mash on your next brew day along the way. At first it wont taste like much, but as it starts to convert it should taste sweet.

 

[3PegBrew]

If it makes you bust a nut, then you KNOW something is wrong.

 

[eastoak]

tasted some of the amber, it's a bit young but it's definitely got the same strangeness to it. The more I think about it the more obvious it becomes that since our efficiency was bad our sugar conversion must have been bad. It just really lacked sweetness. Try your mash on your next brew day along the way. At first it wont taste like much, but as it starts to convert it should taste sweet.

what was your efficiency and do you mill your own grain?