this will be yr two of my cascade and tetnager hops which did not much last yr plus i'm planting a few more this yr so i can brew with my own hops. so maybe cheaper beer. i like a little variety in hops though so will still buy.
Why are homebrew people SO cheap??
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this will be yr two of my cascade and tetnager hops which did not much last yr plus i'm planting a few more this yr so i can brew with my own hops. so maybe cheaper beer. i like a little variety in hops though so will still buy.
So, after seventy-something posts, and next-to-no participation from the original poster, I think it's safe to say, TROLL.
Keep being thrifty, homebrewers, it helps keep us creative.
My thoughts when I first saw it.
but not too many people were up in arms over it or offended.
Austin Homebrew Supply only sells them by the ounce.
tiredofbuyingbeer
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It's true that, even if you can brew cheaply, you could probably get beer even more cheaply by buying American macrobrew.
But it's also true that, even if you can brew beer well, you can probably buy better beer than you can make. So on neither front are you at any absolute advantage homebrewing.
Here's why I'm cheap: I like the idea that I can produce any sort of beer I want, whenever I want, at a low marginal cost. It's the same reason people buy swimming pools for their backyard. Given how much most people actually swim, it's probably cheaper in absolute terms to get a membership at the local Y or use the municipal pool. Their pools are also probably better than whatever hole you're going to dig in your yard. But some people really like the idea of being able to go swimming whenever they feel like it for zero cost. Personally, I don't, but I get the idea.
Not everyone's cheap because they want to maximize their absolute consumption potential. Some people are cheap to maximize their freedom, i.e., minimize the cost for them to do what they feel like doing. If you think about the costs of owning tools, and the value of your time, learning how to fix things around your house probably also doesn't pay off. You wouldn't expect it to, because of the division of labor: a trained plumber is so much better than you are at fixing a leaky faucet that your time is probably better spent either enjoying yourself or working longer hours. But people do DIY fix-it stuff because they want to be self-sufficient. They don't want to wait around for someone else to fix it. They don't want to think of their relationship to their home as one of managing a bunch of contract repair persons. Not for everyone, obviously, but the ethos seems perfectly intelligible to me. Homo faber ain't homo economicus--they're different outlooks.
But it's also true that, even if you can brew beer well, you can probably buy better beer than you can make. So on neither front are you at any absolute advantage homebrewing.
Here's why I'm cheap: I like the idea that I can produce any sort of beer I want, whenever I want, at a low marginal cost. It's the same reason people buy swimming pools for their backyard. Given how much most people actually swim, it's probably cheaper in absolute terms to get a membership at the local Y or use the municipal pool. Their pools are also probably better than whatever hole you're going to dig in your yard. But some people really like the idea of being able to go swimming whenever they feel like it for zero cost. Personally, I don't, but I get the idea.
Not everyone's cheap because they want to maximize their absolute consumption potential. Some people are cheap to maximize their freedom, i.e., minimize the cost for them to do what they feel like doing. If you think about the costs of owning tools, and the value of your time, learning how to fix things around your house probably also doesn't pay off. You wouldn't expect it to, because of the division of labor: a trained plumber is so much better than you are at fixing a leaky faucet that your time is probably better spent either enjoying yourself or working longer hours. But people do DIY fix-it stuff because they want to be self-sufficient. They don't want to wait around for someone else to fix it. They don't want to think of their relationship to their home as one of managing a bunch of contract repair persons. Not for everyone, obviously, but the ethos seems perfectly intelligible to me. Homo faber ain't homo economicus--they're different outlooks.
I disagree with this.
Like I said before my friends cannot tell the difference between my home brew and a random microbrew if I put a glass of it in their hand.
NOW.
i've made some bad beers and some "ok" beers my first yr of brewing.
But, i pretty much drink my own beer when home or at a friends and try to keep a few different varieties on tap so I don't get bored.
I rarely buy beer and when I do it's usually a 6 pack of something new that came out at the beer store to try it out.
Numsquat
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As with any hobby, unless you have unlimited funds, you look for the best value in your purchases. If that's considered "cheap" so be it. I have fixed expenses and those get paid first, savings next, then hobbies. If I had less hobbies, I probably would spell more on home brewing. I do upgrade at times, usually to try something new or to make by brewing easier but for the most part I'm happy with my system, make pretty good beer, and I still look for best prices for ingredients. Luckily the closest HBS has very competitive ingredient prices so they do get much of that business from me, hardware is another thing though.
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dwhite60
Well-Known Member
My father passed away January 3, 2016. Dad had been an electrical technician for the Federal government. Didn't make a lot of money but, he was the cheapest man on the planet. Dollar bills used to squeak coming out of his wallet, when they came out. He had to sneak up on them sometimes. Once retired, at 53, he'd spend at least one day a week driving around from grocery store to grocery store to save $10. He had a wood stove and still split his own wood up until his death. Never had air conditioning in the house and this is central North Carolina.
Dad had invested in ENRON back when they were THE hot stock on the market, he lost his back side in it too like thousands of others.
Anyway, after Dad passed we started going through the financials. We were absolutely ASTOUNDED at the amount of wealth he had built. Dad kept up with the money and investments while Mom paid the bills so Mom never knew.
THAT is why people are cheap.
All the Best,
D. White
Dad had invested in ENRON back when they were THE hot stock on the market, he lost his back side in it too like thousands of others.
Anyway, after Dad passed we started going through the financials. We were absolutely ASTOUNDED at the amount of wealth he had built. Dad kept up with the money and investments while Mom paid the bills so Mom never knew.
THAT is why people are cheap.
All the Best,
D. White
Leapsandbounds
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Totally off topic but are you participating in the Robot Brewery Homebrewing competition in Boca?
More on topic,
I think worrying about cost makes financial sense. Naturally, the amount of expendable income an individual has will determine to what extent cost is considered.
Anyways, I typically search for the cheapest price for quality ingredients (most of the time). My goal is to always stretch my play money as far as I can. If I stop into a shop I’ll grab some stuff to support them but I won’t go out of my way to exclusively purchase from a brick and mortar store.
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Hhmmm, maybe I should enter that one. Right now, busy with the MASH Coconut Cup, learning how to judge. You entered in that one?
Leapsandbounds
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I did, it’s my first competition. The deadline is 3/08/19 for submissions. They have a link on their Facebook for the submissions. I’m going to try and submit one more beer before the deadline.
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Good luck!
AF1HomeBrew
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Over the years I've turned Homebrewing into a social experiment. I have an all-grain system that can handle up to 2 extra home brewers. When I find someone that is interested in home brewing or likes to drink beer, I'll ask them if they are interested in brewing their own beer. I'll charge them the cost of their batch and use my equipment to ferment their batch and even keg their batch if needed. Recently I've included my brother-in-law into the mix; and in this story he's all good (& it's a relationship I want to continue to foster). He ended up buying a CO2 tank to use with the 5 g. keg that I let him borrow and he's been part of 3 brew sessions.
Today I get a text from the other brewer that has been part of my brew sessions for almost 3 yrs. that he started fermenting another beer that I wasn't part of (he doesn't have any other equipment). My first thought was I've loaned this guy my beer gun, capper, several kegs, I'm fermenting a recent lager batch of his for nothing, and he's fermenting more beer? Kind of weird since I've been trying to help him out even though he can definitely afford the stuff I've loaned him.
Equipment wise this guy only has 2-3 kegs and 2 fermenters; no kettles or burners. Before each brew session I send out an email communicating to them what the brew session date is, what their costs for the ingredients are if they are interested in brewing. I don't mark anything up, and if they need to borrow equipment for fermenting/kegging/bottling I assist. I figure whether it's one batch or 3 the mess is about the same, but with double or triple batches there are cost savings in the ingredients.
I end up laughing about it, because I've let it happen before, and the social experiment exposes itself. In my experience in the last 11 years of home brewing 99% of the (wanna-be) home brewers that you will come into contact with are A-Holes and Cheap-A**'s that do not appreciate what others are helping them with.
One of the reasons for doing any of this is because I work from home, so it's my main way to socialize with "adults" if you can call them that.
applescrap
Be the ball!
My grandfather made enough money that he could amass wealth while being somewhat cheap. He had a decent balance though. Mom gave away his money in 5 years. Anyone I know with real money makes plenty of it too. Someone I love gave me a hard time for buying a beer while skiing, even implied that is why he has money. This same person buys 5000 dollar coffee tables and trades around 80k cars at his leisure. Owns a couple of houses with cable and electricity. Get my point. I would have all that if I didnt treat myself to a 7 dollar beer skiing. Grandpa was right its peoples money they will spend it in weird ways. I think some balance is key.
I am encountering unbelievable cheapness often though it seems. Worse, filchers, cheapskates who are always filching. I told a guy and Ill tell you all this. I hope whatever you do makes you happy. If you want to spend your whole life in search of the cheapest food, cheapest hotel rooms, cheapest after shave etc etc, I hope it brings you joy. I am now doing the opposite. Its not that I dont want to save, I do and am trying to more, its more so that I want to live. I like to travel and eat fine foods and stay nice places. People like my friend who never travels anywhere, wont splash out the extra 2 dollars to try a 4 pack, hasnt eaten a decent steak in years, doesnt seem all that happy to me. Raised poor as hell by a single mother I know how to live cheaply. Inexpensive better said, but one day and I credit this forum and a steak discussion I realized that in general, you do in fact get what you pay for. And what kind of mission is being cheap I decided. My life goal is to get through this world as cheaply as possible, there had to be some balance.
I am encountering unbelievable cheapness often though it seems. Worse, filchers, cheapskates who are always filching. I told a guy and Ill tell you all this. I hope whatever you do makes you happy. If you want to spend your whole life in search of the cheapest food, cheapest hotel rooms, cheapest after shave etc etc, I hope it brings you joy. I am now doing the opposite. Its not that I dont want to save, I do and am trying to more, its more so that I want to live. I like to travel and eat fine foods and stay nice places. People like my friend who never travels anywhere, wont splash out the extra 2 dollars to try a 4 pack, hasnt eaten a decent steak in years, doesnt seem all that happy to me. Raised poor as hell by a single mother I know how to live cheaply. Inexpensive better said, but one day and I credit this forum and a steak discussion I realized that in general, you do in fact get what you pay for. And what kind of mission is being cheap I decided. My life goal is to get through this world as cheaply as possible, there had to be some balance.
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applescrap
Be the ball!
This comment here is venturing into the land of my discussions with my friend. There was a time this was more true, I believe. Also thats how mom raised me, they are the same. This really isnt true anymore at ALL. The idea that someone gets to pay half and thinks its the same quality is starting to piss me off. This was my buddies stance and he has changed quite a bit. I have snuck him too many tastes over the years.
He could think this because he was so cheap he never ate anything that wasnt kroger brand. Sams club has been a real life saver because there you can get quality and mm brand. sadly it seems most buy only mm brand seeking only bottom line.
My mom gave me this vanilla the other day that she got some deal on $0.25 or something. I opened it up took one smell and threw it in the trash. I hope she doesn't ruin a dish with that vanilla. It's just not worth it. I dont care if anyone here wants to eat lucerne ice cream, but I dont want to hear its the same as ben and jerrys, they're not. Below I could go on and on. What are you paying half as much for that is so good?
5 dollar 6 pack keystone light
10 dollar six pack codename super fan
5 dollar ice cream breyers
10 dollar ice cream ben and Jerrys
5 dollar coffee ewww
10 dollar coffee still eww but better
5 dollar block of cheese kroger
10 dollar block of cheese bellavitano
5 dollar hotel room (no name, s8, m6)
10 dollar hotel room (marriot)
1 dollar chocolate bar Hershey
2.5 bar lindt belgian chocolate
Cantina De Jefe
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Anyone know where to get bulk corn syrup? Dilly dilly
OP
OP
you got me wrong.
i do not think you have to or even should spend a ton on equipment or ingredients.
i do not think you need super fancy fermenters.
i like looking at other people's setups and recipes from the simple to the insane overkill.
my gripe is about people who seem to be obsessed with "deals" over anything else in the hobby. it's pervasive in most sections of the forum and i, personally, find it tiring to read through.
no matter how much money one has, cost will always of course be at least a consideration. for some it's everything and it irks me.
OP
OP
listen, i had to work. i am not a troll and don't appreciate you continually calling me one. stop it.So, after seventy-something posts, and next-to-no participation from the original poster, I think it's safe to say, TROLL.
Keep being thrifty, homebrewers, it helps keep us creative.
After reading through all of these its seems to me that all have something in common, we all are getting tires of trolls, and like to save money on a hobby that is expensive, but what I have learned is that if i do the work and save some money on a piece of equipment, then I can buy another piece of equipment, dont get me wrong Im not out here buying the cheepest **** I can find, i buy good quality stainless brewing products, from homebrew websites, but if I can get my false bottom $10 cheeper somewhere else, then I can buy WLP090 or another hyrometer (down 1 this year already) or whatever, what I think the biggest misconception here is that if we were "cheep" we would use cheep inferior crap to build our breweries, but rather finding a better price for that piece of equipment that has eluded us for years because as we all know, there are always parts one wants to get to make little upgrades.
Numsquat
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I think the original thought was paying for the same thing, not like items. If I need 1 lb of Briess carapils, I could go to my LHB store and get it for $2. If I order online, I may pay $1.79 for 1 lb but also pay $8.99 S/H, total cost of $10.78 for that pound. If the 20 gal Blichmann boil pot is $50 more at the LHB store than online, I will buy it online. Finding the best price for the same thing is not being cheap.
I do agree with paying more for a better like item though, if the difference is worth it to me.
lump42
The Lajestic Vantrashell of Lob
Everyone has their own motivations. Some want shiney, automated toys and great beer, others want a great beer as cheap as possible. It's similar to marathon runners obsessing over their time, doesn't matter to anyone but them. I recommend next time you see those posts take a deep breath, count to 10, and move on. No sense letting them bother you. RDWHAHB
applescrap
Be the ball!
I agree. Good points. I can get 50 pound sacks of 2 row for 35. Recently switched to simpsons golden promise. La croix at sams gets as low as 5.50 a case but is 12 a case at the supermarket. Different things.
Interestingly enough one of the most expensive parts of homebrewing, the kettle, main value is the emptiness inside it. Yet, I would like a ball valve and markings inside the kettle. Those two things would be nice to have and can be done diy or pay a little and have someone else do it. Just like anything.
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People complain about the price of beer because it isn't that good. Why would I spend $5 on a pint when I have better at home? $10 on a subpar 6 pack?
When it comes to equipment I'll spend more if it will last.
If I had the extra money I would build a complete indoor setup.
I looked at a stout I just brewed. Cost me around 40 cents a bottle. So at least 75% cheaper than buying from a brewery.
Brewing cheaply is easy once you are buying in bulk and saving yeast.
When it comes to equipment I'll spend more if it will last.
If I had the extra money I would build a complete indoor setup.
I looked at a stout I just brewed. Cost me around 40 cents a bottle. So at least 75% cheaper than buying from a brewery.
Brewing cheaply is easy once you are buying in bulk and saving yeast.
ApolloSimcoe
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We aren't.
Still Brewn
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Amen Brother! Definitely no laziness involved here. Tending a garden, making gallons of different sauces and canning is hard work! And when the dead rise up, the Russians invade, or the earthquakes come you and a few others of us will be the ones that have the knowledge to get our next meal.
46 is not old!
And you come up with some damn good recipes!
OP
OP
i grow a garden as well and NOT to save money
I'll be 55 soon- old enough to be what was the speed limit in my youth!
I just love great beer, and making my own means making exactly what my preferences are, or those of my husband. I still love trying new commercial beers, but drink mostly my own beer when I"m home.
Still Brewn
Well-Known Member
You are so wrong!
Wrong!
Let me start off by saying , I get the equipment thing and mine just doesn't carry much of anything so I don't have a choice.
But saying your home brew store doesn't care about your business.... wrong! Unless your brew store is run by a moron or a large corporation they very much care about you and your business! And the fundamentals behind owning a small business dictate that It be that way.
Small business runs the economy in this country and are the only thing not not f'ing it up.
I've worked for myself for most of my life, as a business owner you support yourself obviously but that it is not only me I was supporting. I was supporting the lives of every one of my employees. I was supporting the lives of every one of their spouses. I was supporting the lives of every one of their children. What happens when you buy some thing from Amazon?
The mailman gets paid. And that money you spend permanently leaves your local economy. It won't be invested in your roads, schools, it won't generate local tax revenue so your taxes have to go up. It won't go to a small business that invests in your local economy and gives people jobs meaning that a job will go away. It will not be spent at your local grocery store meaning that eventually there will be one less employee there. And on and on and on.
If you don't patronize your local businesses they will go away. They pay the majority of the taxes in your community when they go away you will be stuck holding the bag. But it won't end there, you will also have to support your now unemployed neighbor and his 3 starving kids and his wife and it will all come out of your pocket one way or another weather he goes out and starts stealing to support his family or he gets the welfare it is going to come out of your pocket. And now on top of all of that the money you saved by not buying local is being paid back 10 fold because that online store or that Wal-Mart raised there prices or to get that $1 can of Pringles costs you $5 because your "local store" is now 20 miles away.
You can see the effect perfectly when you see what wallgeen's did to your local pharmacy did its massive expansion in the late 1900's and it is 2 fold.... First your local pharmacy closed then a small bottle of medicine went from $1 or so to over $7 for the exact same thing. A bottle of cold medicine from my local pharmacy was around 2 bucks when my kids were little, after most of the local places closed Walgreens jacked up their price to over $7 when I went to get some for my grandaughter. Eventually I was able to find it at my local grocery store for around $2.50, a very reasonable cost of inflation over 12 year period.
End of rant. But you can see the same thing when you look at what Wal-Mart has done to your local grocery store. And the quality of their other product is garbage. fortunately I live in a place that is loyal to local and we have a thriving local grocer with better prices and better quality meats and produce. Not that it didn't effect some when they came in but the strong have survived and have prospered. Dozens of others did not make it through.
tntpilsner
Well-Known Member
I'm less than a year in but I've brewed a bunch of BIAB batches and a sizeable handful of wine kits. I know I don't save a whole ton of money, but drinking a $3 bottle of wine that tastes like a $15-20 bottle, and drinking a cold one that would otherwise cost $10-15/six pack just makes me feel warm inside.
Or it could be the actual alcohol doing that, but whatever.
Or it could be the actual alcohol doing that, but whatever.
tntpilsner
Well-Known Member
I'll be 55 soon- old enough to be what was the speed limit in my youth!
I just love great beer, and making my own means making exactly what my preferences are, or those of my husband. I still love trying new commercial beers, but drink mostly my own beer when I"m home.
^^And this! My wife loves this Raspberry Tangerine ale I made for our homebrew club contest, and of course it's the messiest beer I've made, but it's a staple in our rotation now. We'd have never had anything like it otherwise.
I haven't read all the posts on here but I'll add my thoughts on the original post... you really don't save money by homebrewing no matter what anyone says... but it's not about that... it's about the fun of being creative; designing and building a brew rig, building recipes... experimenting and yes... cooking.
I'm looking at growing some hops in my garden, not to save money on a batch of IPA but because I want to know if I can!
If you factor in the cost of the time spent brewing, then the cost of the beer is absolutely huge! But I absolutely love all the hours I put into it, even when things go wrong... plus I get to enjoy my creations and share them with people who also shares theirs with me. I still buy beer too. In fact, since starting to brew, I probably spend just as much on shop bought beer... I just drink more overall!
In terms of shopping around for deals, we all do it... but generally, you kinda get what you pay for and I for one have been burned by going for a cheaper option... crappy quick keg disconnects is one I remember vividly that cost me a tank of CO2! You tend to just end up going back and buying what you should have bought in the first place, but sometimes you genuinely get something good for a good price.
Homebrewing is expensive and it can be ridiculously expensive if you are not careful. I know people who have unnecessarily spent thousands on kit that I have been able to build myself. So it works both ways.
I'm looking at growing some hops in my garden, not to save money on a batch of IPA but because I want to know if I can!
If you factor in the cost of the time spent brewing, then the cost of the beer is absolutely huge! But I absolutely love all the hours I put into it, even when things go wrong... plus I get to enjoy my creations and share them with people who also shares theirs with me. I still buy beer too. In fact, since starting to brew, I probably spend just as much on shop bought beer... I just drink more overall!
In terms of shopping around for deals, we all do it... but generally, you kinda get what you pay for and I for one have been burned by going for a cheaper option... crappy quick keg disconnects is one I remember vividly that cost me a tank of CO2! You tend to just end up going back and buying what you should have bought in the first place, but sometimes you genuinely get something good for a good price.
Homebrewing is expensive and it can be ridiculously expensive if you are not careful. I know people who have unnecessarily spent thousands on kit that I have been able to build myself. So it works both ways.
Blazinlow86
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You personally may not save money homebrewing but think outside the box for a minute. Do you live somewhere were BMC costs 5 dollars a 6pack or somewhere BMC costs 18 dollars a 6pack. I can tell you were I live (BMC is 18 dollars) its nearly impossible not to save 50-70% brewing. Obviously if you have 10grand worth of equipment it may take a few years to break even but that's a different discussion. Cheers
Fair point
Yeah, I can go to the shop down the road and get BMC for under a buck a bottle... I can get a 6 pack of a decent craft beer for under $10.
Once I factor in my 10 hours minimum per batch of shopping for ingredients, cleaning, cooking, racking, bottling etc I definitely don't save money at those prices... but I guess my point was, it's not about saving money, it's about the love of the hobby.
But oh man... 18 bucks!!
Still Brewn
Well-Known Member
First off sorry for your loss.
Second unfortunately he is not around to enjoy all his well earned wealth and thank goodness he didn't have to blow it all on some end of life disability/sickness. That being said, did he actually enjoy his life? I use to be the same way, always looking for the deal and never spent money I didn't have to. Then I had an accident that pretty much wiped out a year of my life, I pretty much don't remember a thing from that first year. I couldn't walk more than a few minutes without being in pain for the first 6 months. I had to use a cane to keep my balance. I had to have someone with me most of the time because I didn't get hunger pangs so I didn't eat and went from 190 lbs to 160. Couldn't remember to take my medication. I got lost a number of times when trying to go for walks. It took 4 years but they finally started letting me drive last year a couple of times a week. My point is all that money dosn't do you a damn bit of good just sitting around if you are unable to enjoy life. Life is too damn short to not spend your time enjoying your family and your life and most importantly RAHAHB!
I still look for deals and refuse to overpay for things but I no longer spend a day doing the grocery shopping. I still buy my prime rib in bulk and cut it myself because I can get it for 7 bucks a pound instead of $12 or more.
Still Brewn
Well-Known Member
I have pretty much always grown tomatoes etc. But it wasn't until I was home bound that I started canning anything. The quality of the sauces you can get with fresh home grown tomatoes beats anything you can get in the store hands down. The sun dried tomatoes come out sweet instead of bitter, pizza sauce always tastes like you made it that day even a year later.
catdaddy66
Well-Known Member
I was told by my frugal sister, "Never pay retail for ANYTHING!"
I look back in my life and can never recall ever saying "I am glad I payed top dollar for" whatever...
I look back in my life and can never recall ever saying "I am glad I payed top dollar for" whatever...
If you find it tiring to read about peoples "deals", don't read them!!!
I read those deals to get ideas for saving money in one area so I can spend it on ingredients (at the best deal I can find) so that I can brew MORE BEER!!!!
And to the one talking of haggling. I sure would hate to have to haggle for everything that I buy!!!!!!
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