What's your favorite honey for mead?

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NeverDie

NeverDie

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So far, I've tried 6 different types of honey:
orange blossom
clover
Texas wildflower
Mesquite
Buckwheat
and Generic Walmart "Simply Honey"

Tomorrow I'll be trying Palmetto honey. A couple of months from now a friend will be bringing me some authentic Linden Tree honey from Russia to try, and I hear it's exceptionally good, but that's about all I know at this point.

What else should I try?

Up to now I've been using the generic Walmart honey as a learning tool, primarily because it's the least expensive, but having now tried these different honeys, I can see that the choice of honey may have quite an impact on the final mead (provided the honey's distinctiveness isn't fermented into oblivion--still not sure about that part of it). Also, I'm not sure to what degree an orange blossom honey from one source is the same/different as the orange blossom honey from another? And if different how do you decide which source to try?

So, what's your favorite for mead? What type of mead? And which ones don't you like?
 
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Orange blossom will differ ever so slightly based on which trees are availble and how many other sources of nectar the bees find. Since oranges are not created equal it's reasonable to assume the honeys will reflect that.
 
I've used mesquite, orange blossom, and generic. Can't really say much about the mesquite, that was about 15 years ago, except that the prickly pear mead I made with it was good. It's been too long to compare, but I wouldn't mind getting some more to try.

Orange blossom is nice and floral, and the generic? Well, it's generic. You can tell it's honey, but it isn't anything special.

I usually go with the cheap generic in the primary on the assumption that the floral notes will blow off during fermentation, and then fall back on orange blossom in secondary and back sweetening. So far it's worked, but I've only really been back to making mead for a year or so.

I wouldn't mind running some small batches of straight mead, (I've been doing melomels.) with different honeys. Might be fun, to get a better idea what the honey is actually contributing.
 
Brett_Bellmore said:
I usually go with the cheap generic in the primary on the assumption that the floral notes will blow off during fermentation, and then fall back on orange blossom in secondary and back sweetening. So far it's worked, but I've only really been back to making mead for a year or so.
Click to expand...

That's a clever idea. I recently fermented a mead all the way down to 1.000 SG, and I can't taste even a trace of the honey that I put into it (OG 1.061). On the other hand, a mead that I halted at 1.030 SG I can taste the honey just fine. So, I don't want to overgeneralize, but it does make me wonder whether I'm merely supplying the yeast with expensive sugar, and maybe it's only what the yeast doesn't eat that I can taste? I'd be curious what others have to say about this. If so, then I'm tempted to front-load with glucose, which the yeast should eat first, and then merely top it off with honey with the intent of interrupting the fermentation once the yeast have finished with the glucose.
 
-Orange blossom- great mead but the tast varies significantly from different sources.
-Costco clover- good as a base for melomels etc
-Mesquite- only used 3 times. I thought it was a really delicate almost bland flavor.
-Raspberry- really good plain mead. When used in melomels or others, the flavor easily gets lost.

This spring I’ll be purchasing several new to me varieties to test. I’ll report back.
 
NeverDie said:
That's a clever idea. I recently fermented a mead all the way down to 1.000 SG, and I can't taste even a trace of the honey that I put into it (OG 1.061). On the other hand, a mead that I halted at 1.030 SG I can taste the honey just fine. So, I don't want to overgeneralize, but it does make me wonder whether I'm merely supplying the yeast with expensive sugar, and maybe it's only what the yeast doesn't eat that I can taste? I'd be curious what others have to say about this. If so, then I'm tempted to front-load with glucose, which the yeast should eat first, and then merely top it off with honey with the intent of interrupting the fermentation once the yeast have finished with the glucose.
Click to expand...


I wouldn't assume that the only things in honey are ferment-able sugars and volatiles that blow away with the CO2. The cheap honey absolutely leaves behind some flavor that straight sugar wouldn't, including some scents that aren't as quick to blow away.

But most people don't realize that the majority of what we think of as "taste" is actually smell. The tongue can only detect a few different flavors, maybe with differing onset and decay, and a few sensations like a burn.

The nose, OTOH, can distinguish thousands of different signals.

All the real complexity of flavor is coming from your sense of smell... That's why I figure the subtle aspect of your mead can be supplied in the secondary, when it's not going to just make your brewing room smell wonderful.

But I don't think I'd go so far as to just feed the yeast glucose. You'd miss the "base" notes that don't leave by way of your airlock.

....

One of these days I'd really like to put a cold trap on that airlock!
 
I find that clover suits me best for melomels as it's cheap where I live and the fruit shines over the honey.
I absolutely love orange blossom as a trad.
I have a mesquite honey that's almost finished and could report back later.
Blueberry blossom was also nice as a trad as was raspberry blossom.
I've been reading a lot in the Scott lab handbook about yeasts and their characteristics and now I'm focusing on matching honey and yeast to how they would compliment each other.

I have been recently been fermenting completely dry with wildflower or clover and back sweetening with special honeys so they shine.

Also working with acids and tannins for complexity and mouthfeel.
Shoot, the possibilities are endless!)
 
That one is on my list soon, I'll most likely make a bochey and also backsweeten with meadowfoam.
 
https://flyingbeeranch.net/honeys/

This place has a tasting room in Salem OR. I plan on making a trip there in the spring. There are so many varieties on the website.
A few that I want to try; carrot, coriander, meadowfoam, fireweed and white sage. I have a feeling I won’t leave there til I drop some serious coin.
 
AzOr said:
https://flyingbeeranch.net/honeys/

This place has a tasting room in Salem OR. I plan on making a trip there in the spring. There are so many varieties on the website.
A few that I want to try; carrot, coriander, meadowfoam, fireweed and white sage. I have a feeling I won’t leave there til I drop some serious coin.
Click to expand...

I'll have to remember that place, if I ever get out that way. A pity they don't have a sample collection.
 
Shine0n said:
I have a mesquite honey that's almost finished and could report back later.

I've been reading a lot in the Scott lab handbook about yeasts and their characteristics and now I'm focusing on matching honey and yeast to how they would compliment each other.

Also working with acids and tannins for complexity and mouthfeel.
Click to expand...

Are you participating in Squatchy's mead make-along at GotMead?
I am.
 
NeverDie said:
So far, I've tried 6 different types of honey:
orange blossom
clover
Texas wildflower
Mesquite
Buckwheat
and Generic Walmart "Simply Honey"

Tomorrow I'll be trying Palmetto honey. A couple of months from now a friend will be bringing me some authentic Linden Tree honey from Russia to try, and I hear it's exceptionally good, but that's about all I know at this point.

What else should I try?

Up to now I've been using the generic Walmart honey as a learning tool, primarily because it's the least expensive, but having now tried these different honeys, I can see that the choice of honey may have quite an impact on the final mead (provided the honey's distinctiveness isn't fermented into oblivion--still not sure about that part of it). Also, I'm not sure to what degree an orange blossom honey from one source is the same/different as the orange blossom honey from another? And if different how do you decide which source to try?

So, what's your favorite for mead? What type of mead? And which ones don't you like?
Click to expand...
I'm not a Meader but I do know that a LOT of honey sold is not in fact honey. Most of what is sold as honey is cut with high fructose corn syrup because it is cheaper . I would not trust Walmart honey especially for this very reason . Do you have Netflix? look up a 5 part series called "Rotten" one of the documentaries in it is all about the honey market. There was a part that covered honey coming from china that was in fact blended with ...you guessed it...HFCS . It was discovered and the importation of honey from China was halted . China tried to pull a fast one and ran their product through other countries that we (the US) would still buy from.
I was in a local Tractor Supply store 2 weeks ago and had a mead and cider book in my hand , not sure why I didn't buy it ,but it had specific chapters on what recipes used specific source honey.
I would buy local honey from known bee keepers.
 
Blacksmith1 said:
Orange blossom will differ ever so slightly based on which trees are availble and how many other sources of nectar the bees find. Since oranges are not created equal it's reasonable to assume the honeys will reflect that.
Click to expand...

Not only that, but California and Florida orange blossom honeys are different too. Californian oranges tend to be smaller and sweeter, and the orange groves are more isolated which means the bees don't wander into other fields as much as they do in Florida. I have a 12 lb gallon of California orange blossom honey that I'm trying to figure out what kind of mead to make from... when I stop eating it on toasted English muffins. Yum.
 
I picked up some more honey today and gave it a try. Tupelo, acacia, killer bee, and ling heather. The tupelo really stands out as by far the best I have had to date. The acacia was pleasant. The ling nicely aromatic. The killer bee was definitely "different".
 
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Soulshine2 said:
I'm not a Meader but I do know that a LOT of honey sold is not in fact honey. Most of what is sold as honey is cut with high fructose corn syrup because it is cheaper . I would not trust Walmart honey especially for this very reason . Do you have Netflix? look up a 5 part series called "Rotten" one of the documentaries in it is all about the honey market. There was a part that covered honey coming from china that was in fact blended with ...you guessed it...HFCS . It was discovered and the importation of honey from China was halted . China tried to pull a fast one and ran their product through other countries that we (the US) would still buy from.
I was in a local Tractor Supply store 2 weeks ago and had a mead and cider book in my hand , not sure why I didn't buy it ,but it had specific chapters on what recipes used specific source honey.
I would buy local honey from known bee keepers.
Click to expand...
Anything from China is automatically suspect. You would, for example, have to be insane to eat any fish from there, given their heavy pollution. Yet Walmart does sell a lot of fish from china, if you read the labels.
 
NeverDie said:
I picked up some more honey today and gave it a try. Tupelo, acacia, killer bee, and ling heather. The tupelo really stands out as by far the best I have had to date. The acacia was pleasant. The ling nicely aromatic. The killer bee was definitely different.
Click to expand...
songs have been written about Tupelo Honey...so it must be good.
 
Soulshine2 said:
I'm not a Meader but I do know that a LOT of honey sold is not in fact honey. Most of what is sold as honey is cut with high fructose corn syrup because it is cheaper . I would not trust Walmart honey especially for this very reason . Do you have Netflix? look up a 5 part series called "Rotten" one of the documentaries in it is all about the honey market. There was a part that covered honey coming from china that was in fact blended with ...you guessed it...HFCS . It was discovered and the importation of honey from China was halted . China tried to pull a fast one and ran their product through other countries that we (the US) would still buy from.
I was in a local Tractor Supply store 2 weeks ago and had a mead and cider book in my hand , not sure why I didn't buy it ,but it had specific chapters on what recipes used specific source honey.
I would buy local honey from known bee keepers.
Click to expand...
How does one establish what a "known" local bee keeper is? Visit them?
 
All honey I use, mostly for honey-wheat beers and braggots, I get from a local beekeeper that has a stand at the local weekly market.

I won't trust any honey that isn't specified as local, Finnish honey, not even the "made in the EU" ones, too many are cut with sugar, as for chinese honey, you might as well eat batteries for what they've found inside that stuff.
 
Pappers_ said:
You need to keep a much more open mind. Meadowfoam mead is delicious, and its not just me saying that - at a recent competition I judged beer at, a Meadowfoam mead took the gold medal in the Traditional Mead category.
Click to expand...
It could take the gold in the olympic games, if it tastes like marshmallows then I personally am not interested. I've hated them my whole life. Most people at least like them. My own kids think I'm weird because I don't.
 
NeverDie said:
I picked up some more honey today and gave it a try. Tupelo, acacia, killer bee, and ling heather. The tupelo really stands out as by far the best I have had to date. The acacia was pleasant. The ling nicely aromatic. The killer bee was definitely "different".
Click to expand...

Where'd you get Tupelo? It's outrageously expensive. Rumor is that this year's crop was poor because of hurricane Michael.
 
Soulshine2 said:
I'm not a Meader but I do know that a LOT of honey sold is not in fact honey.
Click to expand...

As a Certified Master Beekeeper, I can attest to this.

Soulshine2 said:
Most of what is sold as honey is cut with high fructose corn syrup because it is cheaper .
Click to expand...

HFCS if you're lucky. Sugar water if you aren't. But the adulteration isn't the bigger issue to me. It's the latent minerals and chemicals that exist in the honey that comes from these regions.

Soulshine2 said:
It was discovered and the importation of honey from China was halted . China tried to pull a fast one and ran their product through other countries that we (the US) would still buy from.
Click to expand...

Not tried. Did. And are still doing.

Look up the statistics on Vietnam imported honey. Once the Chinese anti-dumping laws were passed in the US, Vietnam's honey exportation grew something like 1,000x, way more than the country could ever produce. Where do you think that's actually coming from? Same holds true with Cambodia, Laos, Thailand, even some South American countries. The USDA caught some people, and they went to jail over it. But it's still rampant in the industry.

NeverDie said:
How does one establish what a "known" local bee keeper is? Visit them?
Click to expand...

Basically. Go to a local, smaller farmer's market. Find the beekeeper and talk to them. Ask them where their hives are, and if they resell anyone else's honey. Some do, but not all. I don't, for example. I produce my own honey, and when I sell out I sell out. Most consumers don't understand, and ask for honey in February. I tell them I sold out last October, and it was harvested last June. They seem confused, as the super market has honey year round, why can't I just go back to my hives and get more? The disconnect between farmers and consumers is shocking.

If you can't find a beekeeper at the local farmer's market, contact the local beekeeper's association. Most counties, or regions of counties, have one. Talk to them about where their honey comes from. They can usually tell you the trees and the sources, and it all varies based on year and location. One year's honey will taste entirely different than another year's honey. Large producers blend honey to get consistent flavors. But to me the joy is getting that variety every year.

NeverDie said:
The killer bee was definitely "different".
Click to expand...

There is no such thing as killer bee honey. It all depends on the nectar source, not the bees that make it (provided they are all apis mellifera).
 
Maylar said:
Where'd you get Tupelo? It's outrageously expensive. Rumor is that this year's crop was poor because of hurricane Michael.
Click to expand...
The brand I tried was from Savannah bee company. Yeah, it is expensive.
 
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As for what honey is "best", I'm preferable to Tulip Poplar and blackberry. But mainly because it's my local main honey flow, I'm familiar with it, and its flavor brings back good memories.

If I want something lighter and more basic, I go with an acacia or alfalfa. I avoid clover, as what you buy is often super blended and not really true clover.

If I want something with a little more flavor, I'll go with a fireweed or a "wildflower". I avoid orange blossom for the same reasons I avoid clover.

I avoid dark honey, like buckwheat, for meads. I also avoid the really good stuff, like Tupelo and Sourwood, for honey. It's really great stuff, but a little too special for mead in my opinion.
 
"Look up the statistics on Vietnam imported honey. Once the Chinese anti-dumping laws were passed in the US, Vietnam's honey exportation grew something like 1,000x, way more than the country could ever produce. Where do you think that's actually coming from? Same holds true with Cambodia, Laos, Thailand, even some South American countries. The USDA caught some people, and they went to jail over it. But it's still rampant in the industry."
the show I referenced actually covered this . Yes, there was a case with a very specific invoice "966" I think it was. It had trace amounts of an antibiotic in it ,unfit for sale,unfit fr USDA standards for human consumption and was told to "get rid of it" as it was passed down the brokerage line . It was sold as told "cheap" and it got caught in a lab ,traced it back to the original seller in China. One of the selling brokers escaped jail over this by returning to Germany and he is basically a prisoner of the confines of his own country.
I'm sure if you look on YouTube the show might be found .
 
specialkayme said:
As a Certified Master Beekeeper, I can attest to this.



HFCS if you're lucky. Sugar water if you aren't. But the adulteration isn't the bigger issue to me. It's the latent minerals and chemicals that exist in the honey that comes from these regions. It was the wildcard.




Not tried. Did. And are still doing.

Look up the statistics on Vietnam imported honey. Once the Chinese anti-dumping laws were passed in the US, Vietnam's honey exportation grew something like 1,000x, way more than the country could ever produce. Where do you think that's actually coming from? Same holds true with Cambodia, Laos, Thailand, even some South American countries. The USDA caught some people, and they went to jail over it. But it's still rampant in the industry.



Basically. Go to a local, smaller farmer's market. Find the beekeeper and talk to them. Ask them where their hives are, and if they resell anyone else's honey. Some do, but not all. I don't, for example. I produce my own honey, and when I sell out I sell out. Most consumers don't understand, and ask for honey in February. I tell them I sold out last October, and it was harvested last June. They seem confused, as the super market has honey year round, why can't I just go back to my hives and get more? The disconnect between farmers and consumers is shocking.

If you can't find a beekeeper at the local farmer's market, contact the local beekeeper's association. Most counties, or regions of counties, have one. Talk to them about where their honey comes from. They can usually tell you the trees and the sources, and it all varies based on year and location. One year's honey will taste entirely different than another year's honey. Large producers blend honey to get consistent flavors. But to me the joy is getting that variety every year.



There is no such thing as killer bee honey. It all depends on the nectar source, not the bees that make it (provided they are all apis mellifera).
Click to expand...
Well, maybe I was duped. I can post a photo of the jar if it helps. Says it is from killer bees in brazil.
 
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Oh I have no doubt that's what the label said. It's just not a thing.

Honey bees are Apis mellifera. Most managed honey bees in the US and Europe are a few subspecies of that, with the predomenant versions being Apis mellifera linguistica (the "Italian" honey bee), Apis mellifera mellifera (the "German" honey bee), and Apis mellifera carnica (the Carni honey bee). In actuality, ever since the honey bee importation ban in the 1920's in the US, all honey bees are a mix of these, and a few other lesser subspecies (including caucasian and russian).

What's the difference between Apis mellifera mellifera honey and Apis mellifera carnica honey? Not a darn thing. Same chemical process, same end result. Analysis of the honey can't even tell what subspecies the honey comes from.

In the 1950's a scientist imported africanized honey bees to Brazil, Apis mellifera scutellata (although it is now believed the true subspecies was misidentified). The western honey bee does well in temperate regions, but not great in the tropics. The scientist was trying to get the tropic adapted africanized honey bee to mate with the western honey bee, to create a more prolific tropic forager. Unfortunately the africanized honey bees were more aggressive, but otherwise biologically the same as the western honey bee. Due to an error, the africanized honey bee escaped, and started spreading rapidly. It was well equipped to live in a tropic region, and quickly out bred the western honey bee. It spread up to Texas in the US, but slowed progression once it hit southern CA. Due to it's more aggressive nature as a result of hundreds of years of selection for more aggression in Africa, the media labeled it the "killer bee." Even though only one person died from africanized honey bees in the first 3 years it made it into the US. Their venom isn't more dangerous, or stronger, than the western honey bee. Instead they just sting under less provoked situations, and continue their aggression longer than western honey bees.

So what's the difference between Apis mellifera carnica honey and Apis mellifera scutellata honey? Not a darn thing. It was a marketing ploy.

The true question is what was the nectar source. Western honey bees and africanized honey bees collecting nectar in Brazil will taste the same.
 
Even if it is the same, some... intellectually challenged individuals are collecting "killer bee" honey from wild colonies. The wife and I watched a video of one of these persons doing so. Based on the bees reaction I'm betting they were africanized bees.
I keep telling my step son he should obtain some and then label his mead as Killer Bee Mead. Made with killer bee honey. One oz per gallon, and it's not a lie.
 
By the way, the buckwheat honey I tried.... it smelled--I kid you not--very strongly and very much like horse manure. Is that a typical buckwheat honey smell? Or did I simply get a weird bottle of it? If it's normal, I'm just amazed it has any following at all. Out of the different honey's that I've tried, it has possibly the strongest flavor, but it also tastes the least like honey, and it obviously smells the least like honey too. Very definitely a barnyard or horse stable smell, if you know what I mean.
 
specialkayme said:
As for what honey is "best", I'm preferable to Tulip Poplar and blackberry. But mainly because it's my local main honey flow, I'm familiar with it, and its flavor brings back good memories.

If I want something lighter and more basic, I go with an acacia or alfalfa. I avoid clover, as what you buy is often super blended and not really true clover.

If I want something with a little more flavor, I'll go with a fireweed or a "wildflower". I avoid orange blossom for the same reasons I avoid clover.

I avoid dark honey, like buckwheat, for meads. I also avoid the really good stuff, like Tupelo and Sourwood, for honey. It's really great stuff, but a little too special for mead in my opinion.
Click to expand...
Since you're in that industry, maybe you can comment: is "True Source Certified" meaningful, and can it be trusted? For example, if I were to purchase, say, an Orange Blossom honey that was "True Source Certified," could I be confident I was getting the real thing, or not?
 
Pappers_ said:
In December, I had some mead made with Meadowfoam honey - oh heavens, it was delicious. Tasted remarkably like marshmallows. https://ashevillebeecharmer.com/shop/honey/meadowfoam-honey/
Click to expand...
Thanks for the tip! Never heard of it before, but now that I have I just now ordered some from amazon so I can give it a try: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007MD76Z0/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
A few of the reviewers commented that the company is in Colorado, which is far from where the meadowfoam would be in the northwest, so it may be dodgy. Still, the reviews on it were pretty good anyway.
 
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I just today received this Florida Palmetto Honey:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07HP8LC49/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
because it is specifically called for by the 3 day Mead recipe that's posted on this forum. Anyhow, it's good honey, but--just trying to be as objective as I can-- I wouldn't say it tastes sufficiently different from "generic" honey that its worth the price premium I paid for it. i.e. I'm pretty confident I could substitute generic honey for it without jeopardizing the mead recipe.
 

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