What do you use to filter your tap water?

[ktraver97ss]

Why would you "question" it? Plenty of people can make delicious beer true-to-style without needing to add tons of minerals to their water. Maybe you've had bad experiences with town/tap water in the past, but that doesn't mean everyone does. I can make great beer using water right from the tap here in MA. I'd challenge you to taste the difference in a beer I make using my tap water v. a beer using filtered, treated water.

x2 I agree, doubtful you could tell the difference with most styles of beer.

 

[Xpertskir]

Why would you "question" it? Plenty of people can make delicious beer true-to-style without needing to add tons of minerals to their water. Maybe you've had bad experiences with town/tap water in the past, but that doesn't mean everyone does. I can make great beer using water right from the tap here in MA. I'd challenge you to taste the difference in a beer I make using my tap water v. a beer using filtered, treated water.

Because I have made beer, and tasted other peoples beers made without filtering the water, or even letting the water stand and/or boiling the water before brewing use.

The conclusion I have come to is that good beer cannot be made with water that contains chlorine and/or chloramine. Removing them from my brew water is far and away the most important thing I have done to make drinkable beer.

I am not even talking about minerals, just chlorine and chloramine.

 

[BBL_Brewer]

I recently got an RO unit. Love it.

 

[modernlifeisANDY]

Because I have made beer, and tasted other peoples beers made without filtering the water, or even letting the water stand and/or boiling the water before brewing use.

The conclusion I have come to is that good beer cannot be made with water that contains chlorine and/or chloramine. Removing them from my brew water is far and away the most important thing I have done to make drinkable beer.

I am not even talking about minerals, just chlorine and chloramine.

This is just flat-out wrong. My current town's water supply does not have either chlorine or chloramine, but my previous town's supply did. I made tons of great beer at that location - great beer, not just "drinkable" beer. I sincerely doubt your judgment.

 

[Monster Mash]

This is just flat-out wrong. My current town's water supply does not have either chlorine or chloramine, but my previous town's supply did. I made tons of great beer at that location - great beer, not just "drinkable" beer. I sincerely doubt your judgment.

Actually he is absolutely correct in most cases, you just got lucky. I've tasted many beers brewed with unfiltered water and very few didn't have an off flavor from the water. In some cases the brewer didn't even know it until it was pointed out to him.

To say you don't need to filter your water because you didn't have a problem does not help most brewers.

 

[Laurel]

To say you don't need to filter your water because you didn't have a problem does not help most brewers.

Conversely stating that just because someone doesn't filter their water they will not be making good beer doesn't necessarily help many brewers either.

 

[modernlifeisANDY]

Actually he is absolutely correct in most cases, you just got lucky. I've tasted many beers brewed with unfiltered water and very few didn't have an off flavor from the water. In some cases the brewer didn't even know it until it was pointed out to him.

To say you don't need to filter your water because you didn't have a problem does not help most brewers.

Similarly, saying that it is nigh-impossible to make decent beer without filtering doesn't help most brewers.

 

[dbrewski]

BTW, the McMaster-Car page only lists filters down to 5 microns (or up to 20 microns). IMO/IME, 5 micron is a decent first stage, but no where near good enough for the second, or final. IF you only have a single filter housing setup, then (IMO/IME) you're going to want a finer filter. .5 micron would be my minimum requirement. Obviously, my current system uses a .2 micron final stage, which I'm very happy with. Water tastes great coming from it, which is important.

Chicago water is pretty good anyway, I use the 5 micron and it seems to work great. No chlorine taste at all, and I get great throughput...I can get 5 gallons in 90 seconds.

 

[Golddiggie]

Chicago water is pretty good anyway, I use the 5 micron and it seems to work great. No chlorine taste at all, and I get great throughput...I can get 5 gallons in 90 seconds.

Personally, if that's the only filter I used, I'd either get the water report (from your source) or send some out for testing. I wouldn't trust the 5 micron filter to do all that much, besides getting the larger items out. I believe cysts and other nasties, are only caught when you go to tighter filters.

I'm not concerned about getting water out fast. I'm more interested in having a single system to filter all the water I use. Since I'm renting, a whole house filter is out of the question. I put about 5 gallons into a bucket at a time (graduated to 22qts) to get into the mash tun and HLT. Only need to carry the bucket maybe 20 feet (if that) to where I setup. So, it's not an issue, for me.

I'd also say that if you're happy with what you're getting out of fermenter, you're good. BUT, if you enter a competition and you get notes back about off flavors caused by the water, you'll probably want to address that. I've yet to enter any competitions, but I might soon.

 

[dbrewski]

Cyst-free beer. Bonus.

 

[Golddiggie]

"Suspended particles and materials of high molecular weight are unable to pass through the 0.2 micron UF membrane, leaving you with only fresh clean water and dissolved minerals."

WINNING!!

Minerals we like for brewing, the rest gets left behind. :rockin:

 

[ktraver97ss]

Meh, I know several master brewers from different micro-breweries in the chicagoland suburbs and none of them do anything to the water. They make some damn good beer too.

 

[dbrewski]

Maybe I'll move up to 10 microns, let in a few more cysts for flavor. I hear spores compliment IPA's quite well too. What size are those?

 

[Monster Mash]

Meh, I know several master brewers from different micro-breweries in the chicagoland suburbs and none of them do anything to the water. They make some damn good beer too.

All breweries in So Cal use industrial carbon filters for their water. Brewers that don't filter are trusting their supplier to keep the chlorine/chloramine levels low, with a filter it doesn't matter what the levels are because it will get removed.

ALL brewing books and brewing schools state you should remove chlorine/chloramine from your water, those who don't must be smarter than the experts.

 

[Golddiggie]

IMO, the risk (with my water source) of having a negative impact on my brews is higher than I'm comfortable with. For the little money it took to get the filter system, and have it installed, I have zero concerns about something getting into my water. Be that from a fluke incident, or by design.

Of course, people get lucky with different water all the time. I'm just not willing to roll the dice on this.

 

[Laurel]

Maybe I'll move up to 10 microns, let in a few more cysts for flavor. I hear spores compliment IPA's quite well too. What size are those?

Cysts and spores are definitely terribly dangerous, especially when the wort has spent an hour boiling.

 

[Laurel]

All breweries in So Cal use industrial carbon filters for their water. Brewers that don't filter are trusting their supplier to keep the chlorine/chloramine levels low, with a filter it doesn't matter what the levels are because it will get removed.

ALL brewing books and brewing schools state you should remove chlorine/chloramine from your water, those who don't must be smarter than the experts.

I'm willing to bet that the SoCal water quality is notably lower than water you'd find in somewhere like the PNW or Alaska.

 

[FTG-05]

I'm willing to bet that the SoCal water quality is notably lower than water you'd find in somewhere like the PNW or Alaska.

By FAR the worst tap water I've ever tasted came out of CA. There's a reason every street corner had drinking water stations to fill up drinking water containers.

This was in the Lompoc area in 2004.

 

[Cromwell]

All breweries in So Cal use industrial carbon filters for their water. Brewers that don't filter are trusting their supplier to keep the chlorine/chloramine levels low, with a filter it doesn't matter what the levels are because it will get removed.

ALL brewing books and brewing schools state you should remove chlorine/chloramine from your water, those who don't must be smarter than the experts.

After doing a little reading on the subject, it doesn't seem that carbon filters will remove chloramines. Am I wrong?

 

[Cromwell]

By FAR the worst tap water I've ever tasted came out of CA. There's a reason every street corner had drinking water stations to fill up drinking water containers.

This was in the Lompoc area in 2004.

Actually, water in most of So Cal, is awful, but water from the MWD (Los Angeles) is very good. It's because we steal... er... get it from the Sierra Nevadas.

 

[Monster Mash]

Some of the best beers come out of California so the water can't be that bad, and most breweries only filter for Chlorine...

 

[Monster Mash]

After doing a little reading on the subject, it doesn't seem that carbon filters will remove chloramines. Am I wrong?

There are some carbon filters that will remove chloramines but a regular GAC filter will remove most of it.

 

[dbrewski]

Cysts and spores are definitely terribly dangerous, especially when the wort has spent an hour boiling.

Did I really need to label this as sarcasm? [/sarcasm]

 

[C-Rider]

3000 feet of porous lava rock filter "before" my tap. LOL

 

[Cromwell]

I did some more research on chloramines, and found this: http://www.wqa.org/pdf/TechBulletins/TB-Chloramine.pdf
Which says: A) chloramine molecules are small, so it's "difficult" for carbon filters or RO filters to remove Chloramines.
B) The most effective method of chloramine removal is activated charcoal, which does not adsorb it, but rather acts as a catalyst to break it down. Some ammonia is created, but mostly it does this: 2NH2Cl + CO*= N2 + 2Cl(-) + 2H(+) + H2O + C*
C) A bed contact time of 10 minutes or greater is required for complete catalysis of chloramines.

Probably we're not aiming for 100% reduction in chloramines, so the bed contact time could be shortened, but any flow-through filter for home use doesn't have anywhere near 10 minutes of bed contact time. If you have a .5 GPM filter, and your filter volume is about a quart that implies a bed contact time of no more than 8-10 seconds.
What am I missing? Is the quoted 10 minutes incorrect?

 

[SpentGrains]

Cysts and spores are definitely terribly dangerous, especially when the wort has spent an hour boiling.

FYI botulism spores can survive boiling temperatures, that is why we pressure can low acid foods. Not an issue with beer but just sayin'.

 

[Rbeckett]

I use a 5 stage Reverse Osmosis set up with a de-ionizer too. The water that comes out is pure water only. No salts, chemicals or particulates at all. I found this RO system really cheap on Ebay and added a 7 gallon surge tank and a 65 PSI boost pump to improve the quantity of filtered water I was getting in a shorter amount of time. The boost pump is switched into the RO set up, so the system never sees any greater than 65 PSI when the pump is on and I am filtering water. The additional pressure definately helps the membrane be more efficient and produce enough water fast enough so there is no waiting.
Wheelchair Bob

 

[dbrewski]

I did some more research on chloramines, and found this: http://www.wqa.org/pdf/TechBulletins/TB-Chloramine.pdf
Which says: A) chloramine molecules are small, so it's "difficult" for carbon filters or RO filters to remove Chloramines.
B) The most effective method of chloramine removal is activated charcoal, which does not adsorb it, but rather acts as a catalyst to break it down. Some ammonia is created, but mostly it does this: 2NH2Cl + CO*= N2 + 2Cl(-) + 2H(+) + H2O + C*
C) A bed contact time of 10 minutes or greater is required for complete catalysis of chloramines.

Probably we're not aiming for 100% reduction in chloramines, so the bed contact time could be shortened, but any flow-through filter for home use doesn't have anywhere near 10 minutes of bed contact time. If you have a .5 GPM filter, and your filter volume is about a quart that implies a bed contact time of no more than 8-10 seconds.
What am I missing? Is the quoted 10 minutes incorrect?

I am not a water chemistry expert. I have heard that you can't really filter out chloramines. That's with a filter based system, not RO. RO takes everything out.

On the other hand, not every water district uses them [chloramines]. I don't think mine does and have never experienced the telltale symptoms. If you are concerned about it toss a campden tablet in there and you are golden, removes both chlorine and chloramines. I filter for taste and removal of chlorine flavor which is very evident in my water.

Cheers.

 

[FATC1TY]

Great links and ideas here..

He's one, who uses the water from their garden hoses? I can't use mine because of the "hose" taste... So better question is.. What do you guys use there, in conjunction with the RV filters and whatnot?

I get RO filtered water, that cost me 1.50 for 5 gallons. It's cheap, and easy to fill my 5 gal jugs, but I want the flexibility to use my tap water, filter it, and continue to treat it like I do now with my RO water.

Any idea on hoses that are good for drinking water, or have a reduced taste effect of it? I'd use it strictly for brewing.

Are the RV drinking water hoses good enough? If so, then for under 30-40 I could get a hose and filter and move to something easy. It would pay for it's self in just 10 brews.

 

[porcupine73]

Hard well water here, I use a KDF (now I forget whether it is 55 or 85) first in line, then a catalytic gac, and finish with uV. I specifically did not use RO because my well water is quite hard, and RO membranes will not tolerate that, plus, I believe there are specific health benefits to good hard water. However hydrogen sulfide smell is not nice, and the pair of filters mentioned above take care of it nicely.