Warm Fermented Lager Thread

[ba-brewer]

@Tulsahomebrewer which yeast did you use?

 

[Tulsahomebrewer]

@Tulsahomebrewer which yeast did you use?

Wyeast 2001.......my instructions say this yeast works best between 45-50F. But it seems to have worked well at 67-70F.

BA.....is that Broken Arrow? If yes, I got my ingredients from High Gravity. Kit is called “Bohemian Rhapsody”.

 

[ba-brewer]

Slightly west of Broken Arrow, San Francisco Bay Area.

Most yeast will work/ferment up into the 60s and above but not all will produce a clean result. I searched this thread and you are the only one to post using Wy2001. It says it does produce some esters in it's ideal range so it will be interested to hear how it does at higher temps.

 

[koopatrain]

Wyeast 2001.......my instructions say this yeast works best between 45-50F. But it seems to have worked well at 67-70F.

BA.....is that Broken Arrow? If yes, I got my ingredients from High Gravity. Kit is called “Bohemian Rhapsody”.

Congrats on your first brew (if I read your earlier post right), one word of caution based on your implied bottling schedule. I’d make sure that the FG is holding steady and not continuing to drop (might mean an extra couple days of checking) before transferring to bottles and carbonating just to avoid any bottle bombs. Sounds like your fermentation went quick!

 

[Miraculix]

I couldn’t wait and checked right now and hydrometer shows 1.014......that is about 5.3%!!!! I am hoping by tomorrow afternoon, I should be able to prime and bottle!!!

Mate, you have the first brewer impatience. After pitching the yeast, close the lid and leave it for at least twelve days. Then start thinking of doing something. There would be also nothing wrong with just leaving it for two to three weeks and then bottle. Beer does not get better with action and speed but might get worse. Best results come with patience, let this being said to you by a guy who cannot keep the lid closed for two days in a row because he always wants to know what's happening in the bucket

 

[Tulsahomebrewer]

Day 9 - Bottling day (I just could not wait!!!)

I bottled mostly in brown flip tops, but also used 3 clear bottles just to keep an eye on what happens in there. These babies are now hanging out in a dark closet with a beach towel covering them from light.

 

[Miraculix]

Day 9 - Bottling day (I just could not wait!!!)

I bottled mostly in brown flip tops, but also used 3 clear bottles just to keep an eye on what happens in there. These babies are now hanging out in a dark closet with a beach towel covering them from light.

View attachment 588513View attachment 588514

You got way too much yeast in the bottles because you wouldn't wait. Next time, wait till the yeast has settled or cold crash, that helps the taste immensely.

 

[Tulsahomebrewer]

You got way too much yeast in the bottles because you wouldn't wait. Next time, wait till the yeast has settled or cold crash, that helps the taste immensely.

Other than taste, would this affect carbonation as in excessive pressure in bottles leading to bursts? I am hoping that at end of three weeks it will clear up. Would that leave lot of crud at the bottom of bottles?

I will definitely wait longer next time. But I saw some posts in this thread saying they bottled at 7 days, did I understand incorrectly?

 

[Bilsch]

Day 9 - Bottling day (I just could not wait!!!)
I bottled mostly in brown flip tops, but also used 3 clear bottles just to keep an eye on what happens in there. These babies are now hanging out in a dark closet with a beach towel covering them from light.

No worries about the sediment, it will settle and you can pour off clear beer. Having it in there will effect your storage stability but I suspect these will get drunk long before that is an issue. As for pressure, If you did bottle with too much fermentables at least with swing tops you can vent some CO2. Interesting color by the way, I'm curious about your wort production. Was this a malt extract beer by chance?

 

[Tulsahomebrewer]

If you did bottle with too much fermentables at least with swing tops you can vent some CO2. Interesting color by the way, I'm curious about your wort production. Was this a malt extract beer by chance?

Yep, malt extract (first kit I bought). Do you mean color is interesting in a good way or looks super strange?
I have been reading a lot about bottle bombs after previous user posted. I might check 1-2 bottles at the end of week-1. I have seventeen 16oz bottles, and three 32oz bottles....all flip tops.

 

[Bilsch]

I will definitely wait longer next time. But I saw some posts in this thread saying they bottled at 7 days, did I understand incorrectly?

You can't go by time as every beer is different and there are a lot of variables that determine when the beer is done. I've had some ready for bottling in as little as 3 days and as long as 2 weeks. The only way to know for sure is to take gravity measurements.

 

[Bilsch]

Yep, malt extract (first kit I bought). Do you mean color is interesting in a good way or looks super strange?
I have been reading a lot about bottle bombs after previous user posted. I might check 1-2 bottles at the end of week-1. I have seventeen 16oz bottles, and three 32oz bottles....all flip tops.

No not strange at all but just has the characteristic color of extract which is generally caused by the process of making it. As for bottle bombs, the swing top bottles are more durable then regular beer bottles and should take a lot more pressure. Your plan of checking in a week is a good one and if too carbonated you can crack the other bottles a couple times and vent off some CO2.

 

[Miraculix]

Other than taste, would this affect carbonation as in excessive pressure in bottles leading to bursts? I am hoping that at end of three weeks it will clear up. Would that leave lot of crud at the bottom of bottles?

I will definitely wait longer next time. But I saw some posts in this thread saying they bottled at 7 days, did I understand incorrectly?

Sorry for my rather short post which wasn't that much informative.

I generally have the following issues when too much yeast is in the bottle:

1. If the yeast does not stick well to the bottom (which lager yeast usually does not), the yeast can get agitated when opening the bottle. Then the yeast is thrown back into suspension, acting as nucleotides at which co2 can get out of solution quickly, which leads to gushers and yeast and maybe flat beer in the glass.
Keeping this in mind, gushers do not necessarily mean overcarbonation, if the yeast is swirling around in the bottle.

2. Taste, yeasty beer tastes.... Yeasty. What suits hefeweizen and some other styles does not necessarily fit lagers, most prefer those clear.

3. Look.... But honestly, I don't care about the look. If it tastes fine it could be looking like unicorn juice.


And generally speaking, trying to rush a beer is something you can do when you really know what you are doing. At the beginning, give it at least two weeks in the fermenter.

 

[Genuine]

Here's my Oktoberfest! Pretty happy with it! All I did for Water adjustments were 2ml of Lactic Acid and 50ppm of CalCl.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

As a scientist I know negative are as important as positive result - in fact probably more so.
So with that in mind MJ Bohemian lager M54 doesn’t like the heat....When cold it had a lovely sweet bubble gum aroma - something I actually associate with Bud funnily enough. But as it warmed up to room temp the beer was very solventy, hot alcohol

As you say, negative results are important, especially at this stage when we're trying to map out the terrain. Shame you had to toss it, but it does rather support the theory that M54 is a Saaz type of lager yeast, which are the low-temperature ones.

I hate the low floc aspect of 3470. I wonder if it would be possible to throw in half a pack of safale04 at the end of fermentation to give the flocculation a boost without the 04 ester production, as not much fermentables would be left at the point when it is introduced.

Or use a bottling yeast like F-2/CBC-1, or something like Notty.

Day 9 - Bottling day (I just could not wait!!!)
View attachment 588513

Just as a tip - if you're bottling in the kitchen, don't bottle on the floor. Domestic harmony is better preserved if you put the bottles on the door of the dishwasher, that way all the spills end up in the dishwasher rather than over the floor. Also I'd shorten that tube a bit, those loose loops have a knack of waving around and knocking bottles over etc when you least want it.

 

[Tulsahomebrewer]

4 days into bottle conditioning...it is clearing up nicely. I can see tiny bubbles rising from the bottom, mostly suspended.

View attachment 589014

 

[Tulsahomebrewer]

4 days into bottle conditioning...it is clearing up nicely. I can see tiny bubbles rising from the bottom, mostly suspended.

View attachment 589014

Not sure what happened to my post, I cannot see pic anymore. Let’s see if this works

 

[InspectorJon]

California Bliss -
I started this last weekend, a small batch recipe for anyone that wants to try that:
44 oz pale 2 row
7 oz crystal 40
3 oz crystal 60
2.8 gallons of water BIAB mash at 155F for 1 hour
1.036 preboil gravity

Northern Brewer hops 8.3%
8g for 60 min
7g for 10 min
6g for 5 min

I boiled a bit harder than I thought I guess and had to add 1/2 inch of water to the brew kettle to get it to finish at 1.050 post boil.
1.75 gallons into fermenter
Cool to 70 degrees pitch 1 pack of re-hydrated MJ M54
Fermenter is sitting in a water bath. Temps ranged from 66F at the start on up to 70F
I'll bottle next weekend then throw a doppelbock on the yeast.

Bottled the California Bliss yesterday. It finished at 1.013 using the MJ M54. That is 73% AA. It tasted clean and was very clear. Crashed it to 33 degrees then gelatin fining for two days before bottling. This beer was really just a big starter for the doppelbock I brewed today. Pitched the 20 oz of thick slurry into a three gallon batch of doppelbock. We will see how that goes.

Mashing the Doppelbock this morning.

 

[treacheroustexan]

Going to keg my Oktoberfest tonight and lager & carb up at 35 degrees for a few weeks.

 

[seatazzz]

Waiting for #6 to get carbed up. Brought some for my brewpub boss to try today, he said "underattenuated" because it's kinda sweet, but it dropped from 1.065 to 1.012 so I don't think it's underattenuated. Might have had a bit of a heavy hand with the Crystal hops I used. Tastes great to me, hope to have it fully carbed by tomorrow to drink while I watch my Seahawks kick the poopy out of the Cowgirls.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Shame you had to toss it, but it does rather support the theory that M54 is a Saaz type of lager yeast, which are the low-temperature ones.

Gah - I've just noticed this, I assume @RoyalGallon was talking about M84 Bohemian rather than M54 Californian here.

 

[Tulsahomebrewer]

Like someone commented here, I have gushers!!! I opened one flip top bottle and half the contents gushed out, this is after 6 days of carbonation. So I opened all of them just enough to release pressure and sealed it back up. Hope this doesn’t ruin the beer. It kicked up all of the caked yeast at the bottom. I have moved all bottles into the fridge now.

 

[InspectorJon]

So, regarding MJ M54 being a slow starter . . . I pitched 1 pack of re-hydrated yeast into 1.75 gallons of wort for my California Bliss and it took around 24 hours to show activity in the air lock. Temperature was 66-67 degrees. I took 20 oz of yeast slurry from that brew and pitched it into 3 gallons of Doppelbock wort at 68 degrees and the airlock started bubbling in 3 hours. Going strong 18 hours later. Lots of airlock activity but no krausen.

That is funny, HomeBrew Talk message board says krausen is spelled wrong.

 

[Miraculix]

Like someone commented here, I have gushers!!! I opened one flip top bottle and half the contents gushed out, this is after 6 days of carbonation. So I opened all of them just enough to release pressure and sealed it back up. Hope this doesn’t ruin the beer. It kicked up all of the caked yeast at the bottom. I have moved all bottles into the fridge now.

Yes mate, l told you this because I experienced the same. You should not have opened the bottles as there is not too much co2 in the bottles, it just gets out of solution way too quickly because of the excessive amount of yeast in the bottle.

Read my previous post again to understand why this happens. You can chill the bottles and wait it out. The yeast will compact further on the bottom and will not get agitated so easily afterwards, then you won't see gushers.

It also helps to open the bottle and really really quickly start the pouring process. Don't pour quickly, but start as quickly as possible with the pouring after opening the bottle.

Anyway, hope you learned something and that you will wait another week till botteling next time. The beer is not ruined.

 

[Dimax]

Started a Munich Hellas this weekend:
BIAB
5 Gal Batch size
OG: 1.048 Actual 1.058 not sure if this was because I ended up steeping the grains
90 mins
FG: 1.011 Actual
IBU: 18
Color: 4 SRM
5.0% ABV Actual
Mash: 150 degrees 60 min Actual 90 min, wort dropped to 146 degrees.
Boil: 60 min Actual 90 min
Pre-Boil Vol: 7 gal could have used 8 gallons I had a very hard boil going & needed to add at end of boil.
Pre-Boil grav: 1.041 Actual unknown as I don't measure

All Grain:
10 lbs. Pilsener
0.75 lb. Munich

Hops:
Hallertau 4.0% Actual 3.6%

Yeast:
W-34/70 Should have checked the exp date sheez 7/2018, but Tossed the yeast in dry @ 3:45 PM , checked it at 0830 and the yeast was working away.

Fermenting at 65 degrees.

Transferred to secondary 9-23-18
Gravity 1.010
I would like to add gelatin to help clear, but I'v never added gelatin?

 

[InspectorJon]

Transferred to secondary 9-23-18
Gravity 1.010
I would like to add gelatin to help clear, but I'v never added gelatin?

I have used this method with success. http://www.bertusbrewery.com/2012/06/how-to-clear-your-beer-with-gelatin.html

There is a lot of information in this forum if you search (use the quote marks) "Gelatin Fining". This is not the place to discuss this topic.

 

[Dimax]

I have used this method with success. http://www.bertusbrewery.com/2012/06/how-to-clear-your-beer-with-gelatin.html

There is a lot of information in this forum if you search (use the quote marks) "Gelatin Fining". This is not the place to discuss this topic.

Got it

 

[@RoyalGallon]

Gah - I've just noticed this, I assume @RoyalGallon was talking about M84 Bohemian rather than M54 Californian here.

Just to clarify - you're right. It was a typo.
I used the Bohemian and it didn't work well.

 

[Beer666]

I don't know if 15c counts as warm but i am cold crashing a SMASH Bohemian pilsner and saaz fermented with MJ Bohemian. Sample tasted promising, should be drinkable in a week. Looked clear so fingers crossed. Will up the temperature next time around.

 

[treacheroustexan]

I brewed my Oktoberfest on 9/6 with a pack of 34/70 and held it at 65 ish during fermentation. Kegged it on Sunday and it's been carbing and sitting at 35 degrees. Do I essentially need to "lager" it any longer or do you guys think it will be drinkable on Sunday?