Quantcast

uh-oh Bottled at 1.030 - wyeast 3787

HomeBrewTalk.com - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Community.

Help Support Homebrew Talk:

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
Yes, I know, dumb move. I took my gravity reading after bottling ( gravity sample did not have priming sugar). Its a Belgian black stout. Mini mash, 6 lbs of light dme.

OG 1.074
FG 1.030

Wyeast 3787, 4 weeks in primary.

Didn't bother to check the gravity because I assumed it would be done after a month. 68 degrees during weeks 1 and 2. 62 weeks 3 and 4. I guess this was too cold

I used 3.5 oz dme for 5 gallons targeting 2.3 volumes co2.

So what do I do now? Should I worry about bombs? Or will they not carb? Should I dump all of the bottles into a bucket and hit it with some s05 to finish the job? Or would that oxygenate it?
 

Dynachrome

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
2,168
Reaction score
97
Location
Americas Hinterland
I think you're going to have Mt Vesuvious in your storage closet.

I'd pour it back into your fermentor. I'd personally also guess that oxygenation at this point would help the yeast.

I used too much bottling sugar once, similar to your predicament. Here is a recorded version of the saga for posterity. The beer turned out OK.

Crash Test Dummy Pale Ale-ish
 

eastoak

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2011
Messages
3,305
Reaction score
175
Location
oakland
don't pour it back into the fermentor, better to just dump it down the drain rather than do that. in fact i think i would just dump it and start over, i'm sure others will disagree with that but if you truly have a 1030 beer in the bottle i don't see a reasonable way around: bottle bombs, super sweet beer, oxidized beer (from pouring it out of the bottles then back in after fermentation) or a lot of time wasted on a beer that will be mediocre at best. you've learned a lesson, now apply it to the next beer.
 
OP
F

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
Hydrometer was pretty clear, but I'm going to open a bottle tomorrow to triple check.

If I'm dumping bottles I will at least give it another chance. I was thinking I could dump them into a Corney keg after purging with co2. Probably avoid most o2 that way and let it ferment in there? Then on tap, definitely wont be bottling after that!
 
Joined
Jul 24, 2006
Messages
14,278
Reaction score
775
Location
Southwest
don't pour it back into the fermentor, better to just dump it down the drain rather than do that. in fact i think i would just dump it and start over, i'm sure others will disagree with that but if you truly have a 1030 beer in the bottle i don't see a reasonable way around: bottle bombs, super sweet beer, oxidized beer (from pouring it out of the bottles then back in after fermentation) or a lot of time wasted on a beer that will be mediocre at best. you've learned a lesson, now apply it to the next beer.
This. It's ok to lose a batch. It's ok to dump beer.
 

jhoyda

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2011
Messages
255
Reaction score
37
Location
Tiffin
This. It's ok to lose a batch. It's ok to dump beer.
This is WAY off topic, but I never knew what your avatar was until I got one in the mail today. Well, actually, I got an UNO but it looks similar. Can't wait to play with it.
 
OP
F

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
I didn't follow the popular advice and made an attempt this morning to save this beer.

I tasted a bottle this morning. It was perfectly carbonated (in just 18 hrs!!) and sickeningly sweet. I guess the yeast is still working (whatever i did must have roused them), and I'm sure that all of the bottles would have exploded.

I sanitized a corney keg, and filled it with CO2. I dumped the bottles into the keg, I could see the cloudy CO2 stay in the keg as I did this. Once filled I hit it with a but more CO2 to flush out whatever O2 would have been sitting on top.

I know that the beer would have been oxygenated a bit from the bottling, and then from the dumping into the keg, but I had to give it a try. The yeast should use up some of it. Once I get to a better FG i'll just force carb and keep it on tap, if it tastes decent enough...
 

eastoak

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2011
Messages
3,305
Reaction score
175
Location
oakland
keep us posted, this is the only way to confirm what options there are in these types of cases.
 

Scotty_g

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Mar 26, 2007
Messages
359
Reaction score
14
Location
De Pere, WI
If the beer was carbed that fast the yeast are still active. You have a chance to get something drinkable out of it, even if it's been oxidized, re-poured, etc.

I had one belgian beer that never finished, even after 2 years, and was in the high 20's and sickly sweet. It started out over 1.100 so it packed a hell of a punch, too. But, we had a lot of yeast stalling out and dying.

The lesson I learned, and perhaps you too, is that big belgians need big starters, and that the hydrometer is your friend. And to watch that temperature...
 

Dynachrome

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
2,168
Reaction score
97
Location
Americas Hinterland
I didn't follow the popular advice and made an attempt this morning to save this beer.

I tasted a bottle this morning. It was perfectly carbonated (in just 18 hrs!!) and sickeningly sweet. I guess the yeast is still working (whatever i did must have roused them), and I'm sure that all of the bottles would have exploded.

I sanitized a corney keg, and filled it with CO2. I dumped the bottles into the keg, I could see the cloudy CO2 stay in the keg as I did this. Once filled I hit it with a but more CO2 to flush out whatever O2 would have been sitting on top.

I know that the beer would have been oxygenated a bit from the bottling, and then from the dumping into the keg, but I had to give it a try. The yeast should use up some of it. Once I get to a better FG i'll just force carb and keep it on tap, if it tastes decent enough...
Two questions:

Have you kept track of what you have in it cost-wise?

What is the craziest beer you've ever tasted?

Thanks for at least trying to save it.
 
OP
F

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
As far as costs go this wouldn't have been too bad. I had some hops lying around (some of which were home grown). I used harvested yeast which could have been part of my problem, but my starter was going pretty good before I pitched. I just had to buy the 5lbs of grains and 6 lbs of extract. So maybe around 30 bucks. Wasted about 40 caps, but no big loss there.

crazy beers? this was modelled after Allagash Black - not too crazy. But oh man, i've had sriracha beers (hot sauce!), oyster stouts, most every crazy dogfish, i'm sure the list goes on.... Brooklyn concoction - gross.
 

pdxal

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jul 19, 2010
Messages
1,830
Reaction score
257
Location
Portland, OR
I would suggest you warm up the (re)fermentation in the keg to the mid 70's to get 3787 to finish. Only gushers I've had have been with that yeast when I thought it was finished and bottled, only to have it finish in the bottles during conditioning at warmer temps.
Good luck.
 

Dynachrome

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
2,168
Reaction score
97
Location
Americas Hinterland
...crazy beers? this was modelled after Allagash Black - not too crazy. But oh man, i've had sriracha beers (hot sauce!), oyster stouts, most every crazy dogfish, i'm sure the list goes on.... Brooklyn concoction - gross.
I'm thinking what you are heading towards is way more beer-like than some of those.

What kind of beer is it?

My personal crziest was "Old English Porter" from New Glarus. Sour kraught mixed with coffee and unsweetened cranberries with a hint of mold.

I drank most of three of the four bottles after my buddy gave me the three he couldn't finish.
 
OP
F

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
Update: took a gravity reading and a taste today. 1.027 obviously still sweet but it didn't taste oxidized. the yeast are still working... slowly. Couldn't get above 70 degrees. Trying the light bulb technique now, hopefully that helps.
 
OP
F

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
Up to 80 degrees, keeping it in my new Ferm chamber with a desk lamp. Since it's still in a corney keg I decided to remove the blow-off tube and switch to a closed ferment for the final few points. It's definitely building pressure as pulling the release valve makes a satisfying pfffft!
 

MattHollingsworth

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 19, 2009
Messages
1,609
Reaction score
53
Location
Samobor, Croatia
If your beer is having a hard time fermenting, I don't know that adding pressure to it is a good idea. Yeast don't much like pressure. They can deal with it fine when they're healthy, but you're having a hard time getting these buggers to finish. I wouldn't add any stress to them, personally. It could also be giving you that PFFFFT as the gas goes out of solution from you warming it.
 

Dynachrome

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
2,168
Reaction score
97
Location
Americas Hinterland
..hotter isnt usually better either. I did that once, it was fizzy, thin, and not very satisfying to drink in the end.

Don't hurry, beer takes patience.

I'm bad at it myself...... a few days in the bottle I have to try one.
 
OP
F

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
After a few days the gravity didn't change. I added some fresh yeast from a DIPA that I was transferring. A week later and its still reading 1.027.

At this point im sure its not a yeast problem. Im guessing too many unfermentable sugars (partial mashed at 155/156, dme). Still seems awfully high.

At this point I know I should probably dump it, but this has become my science project. So next step? Im going to hit this guy with some sour bugs and give it a few months. I've got free carboys, why not? Ill harvest the yeast from some commercial bottle dregs.

Sour Belgian stout? Who knows...
 

MattHollingsworth

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 19, 2009
Messages
1,609
Reaction score
53
Location
Samobor, Croatia
You could also try making a starter of Wyeast 3711. For me, that yeast almost always goes below 1.000. Last two beers ended at .997 and .998. If there's anything there to ferment, this yeast will ferment it!
 

Dynachrome

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
2,168
Reaction score
97
Location
Americas Hinterland
You could also try making a starter of Wyeast 3711. For me, that yeast almost always goes below 1.000. Last two beers ended at .997 and .998. If there's anything there to ferment, this yeast will ferment it!
This. Don't sour it unless you know you like ssourss.

Ihave a wheat beer that I do that goes grapefruity, I can drink most of them. Occasionally there is one that is just over the top.
 
OP
F

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
Despite the popular advice (that I agree with) to use Wyeast 3711 to get past a stuck fermentation I went the sour route. I did this because I was too lazy to take the 45 min drive the LHBS and spend another 6 bucks on this most likely doomed beer.

I transferred this 1.027 gravity beer out of the corney keg and into a glass carboy. I dumped in the dregs from a Cisco Lady of the Woods (American Wild) and the dregs from a Green Flash Rayon Vert (Brett Finished IPA). 2 weeks at 75 degrees and this beer now has a white film on top and tastes quite sour! I didn't take a gravity reading, but trust me, these sour bugs did their thing, even after sitting in my fridge for a few months!

Now, the most important thing - taste. I can't decide if I actually like it. I really don't have a base to compare it to since I've never had a sour/wild stout. Up front it tastes sour, similar characteristics to the Lady of the Woods, not too complex yet but it's young. I don't taste too much of the Brett, but I expect that will increase with time. On the back end I taste the roastiness and some of the other typical stout flavors, but they feel much different without the supporting sweetness and heavy mouthfeel.

Yes, it sounds strange, but I can't say that I dislike it. Definitely better than a sickly sweet stout, and I think it will become very interesting with some more time.



Here is a brief summary of what happened to this beer.

Brewed on 12/17/2012. Partial Mash @ 153. 1.074 OG

Bottled after 4 weeks primary

I realized the gravity was 1.030 AFTER bottling

The next morning flushed a Corney Keg with CO2 and carefully opened and dumped all of the bottles into the keg.

Over the next 4 weeks I tried adding London Ale yeast (from a beer that just finished fermenting) and tried raising the temperature to the low 80s for a week, but the gravity would not drop below 1.027

Transferred from keg with CO2 pressure to Carboy on 2/16/2013 (8 weeks after brew date, 4 weeks after keg). Pitched brett dregs, and other wild bugs from 2 commercial beers.

3/2/2013 (2 weeks after bugs) - noticeable white film, strong sour taste.​



The important thing to note is that I don't taste any oxidation yet, despite bottling, dumping and transferring a few times. So it is possible to save a bottled beer if you're very careful and use a CO2 flushed keg.

Will keep this thread posted on how it goes.
 
OP
F

foodplusbeer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2011
Messages
167
Reaction score
12
Location
stamford
I bottled this on 4/10. It now tastes a little oxidized, but I can't attribute that to all of the other transfers. When grabbed the carboy the airlock fell right off so I don't think it was airtight - bummer!

Anyway, I guess i'll find out if its drinkable in a few months...
 

MattHollingsworth

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 19, 2009
Messages
1,609
Reaction score
53
Location
Samobor, Croatia
I bottled this on 4/10. It now tastes a little oxidized, but I can't attribute that to all of the other transfers. When grabbed the carboy the airlock fell right off so I don't think it was airtight - bummer!

Anyway, I guess i'll find out if its drinkable in a few months...
That shouldn't matter much if you've got a blanket of CO2 over the beer. I don't even use an airlock all the time. I've used just loose foil or a foam plug a bunch of times, neither of which are airtight.
 
Top