Timing of transfer to secondary

[EastAtLeast]

Brewed my first extract kit (and extra IPA) last Tuesday, it has now been 6 full days since I started fermentation (my OG reading: 1.076 ; kit suggested 1.070 - 1.074). The airlock bubbles every 20 - 25 seconds. It seems like fermentation is winding down so I decided to take a SG reading today. It read 1.020 (recommended FG for kit range: 1.016 - 1.019). Since I started on the high end for my OG, should I expect that my FG will finish on the high end? If I take and SG reading tomorrow, and it doesn't change from today's reading, am I ready to rack to my secondary? I was searching for info on this, but it seems that some people only like to do the primary fermentation, but my local brew store guy and my kit say it's better to rack it to the secondary, the printed instructions just don't make sense (they say when you don't see bubbles in the airlock for 48 hours) I know they don't expect me to stare at the airlock for 2 days straight, so what do you recommend?

 

[DatsyukianDeke]

If the airlock is still bubbling that often I'd leave it. Once it pretty much quits bubbling would be a time to rack it.

Now enter everyone telling you how much of a waste secondary fermentation is.

 

[d3track]

are you dry hopping? If so, you can give it 10-12 days at that gravity, take a reading, give it 24-48 hours and take a second reading. If it's stable you can transfer and then dry hop.

Some dry hop in primary, I like to get it off the trub.

If not dry hopping, you can go right to bottling after the second stable reading.

 

[snow16]

Congratulations on your first brew!

Most extract kits tend to finish a little bit higher than the instructions would lead you to believe, but that doesn't mean that yours won't go down more. When you get the same reading 3 days in a row, it's safe to say it's finished. But be patient!

Regardless of whether or not you decide to move to secondary (I personally don't and I feel pretty strongly about it, but this is the wrong thread for that), don't move it to secondary until it's been sitting on the yeast in the primary for at least two weeks or so. Others may suggest even longer than that. This will allow the yeast to clean up any off flavors that it may have produced during fermentation and will result in a much, much better beer. Hope this helps and good luck!

 

[Gavin C]

Corrected link to John Palmer on secondary vessels

https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=15108.5;wap2

 

[C-Rider]

John Palmer on secondary vessels and their rationale

http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter8-4.html

View attachment 266012

I think that is his "old" book. New editions get away from secondary and not needed for most beers unless adding something like fruit. Dry hops can go right in the primary. Remember TIME IS YOUR FRIEND. Don't rush things 3-4 weeks in primary, 1 week dry hop if needed and if you can 4-5 days of cold crashing in the primary and you are readdy to bottle.

 

[Rotor_Head]

As I understand it, the purpose of the secondary is essentially to clean your beer and allow it to settle two separate times. Doing so will help clean the sediment from the beer and leave less of it to go into bottles or the keg you put it in. However, so long as you don't indiscriminately dump the yeast cake from the bottom of the primary or violently shake your bottle (or keg) before you poor the beer, the aforementioned cake should never make it to your glass in the first place. Hence, secondary fermentation is commonly seen as a waste of time standing on the assumption that it doesn't have a purpose such as adding fruit (which can also be added to the primary).

 

[Gavin C]

I think that is his "old" book. New editions get away from secondary and not needed for most beers unless adding something like fruit. Dry hops can go right in the primary. Remember TIME IS YOUR FRIEND. Don't rush things 3-4 weeks in primary, 1 week dry hop if needed and if you can 4-5 days of cold crashing in the primary and you are readdy to bottle.

You are absolutely correct. The new version was what I was looking to share essentially outlining the obselesence of a secondary vessel. I will correct the link. Thanks for pointing out my glaring error.

 

[C-Rider]

Proof that to "clear/clean" up a beer you don't need a secondary especially if you can cold crash.
I'll try to post 3 pictures of very clear beers I have brewed w/o secondary but did cold crash.
[url=https://www.homebrewtalk.com/photo/papas-ipa-61149.html] [/URL]

[url=https://www.homebrewtalk.com/p...dcrashohikilolosept2013-61150.jpg[/img][/url]

The last one is in the test tube before bottling.
[url=https://www.homebrewtalk.com/photo/clear-irish-red-64781.html] [/URL]

 

[jethro55]

Brewed my first extract kit (and extra IPA) last Tuesday, it has now been 6 full days since I started fermentation (my OG reading: 1.076 ; kit suggested 1.070 - 1.074). The airlock bubbles every 20 - 25 seconds. It seems like fermentation is winding down so I decided to take a SG reading today. It read 1.020 (recommended FG for kit range: 1.016 - 1.019). Since I started on the high end for my OG, should I expect that my FG will finish on the high end? If I take and SG reading tomorrow, and it doesn't change from today's reading, am I ready to rack to my secondary? I was searching for info on this, but it seems that some people only like to do the primary fermentation, but my local brew store guy and my kit say it's better to rack it to the secondary, the printed instructions just don't make sense (they say when you don't see bubbles in the airlock for 48 hours) I know they don't expect me to stare at the airlock for 2 days straight, so what do you recommend?

Conditions are ideal to transfer to secondary at this point. It actually clears the messy krausen leftovers much quicker. Just remember to use normal sanitation and avoid splashing the beer.

But leaving it primary for 3 or 4 weeks works well for some. And those that do are passionate to the point of broken record negativity about this being somehow superior, as you can see.

There are lots of attempts to prove something one way or the other. These show that both ways work and the beer quality is the same. It comes down to your own preferences. Try it both ways and see what you prefer.

 

[EastAtLeast]

First off, I would like to thank everyone for taking their time to help me out. I really appreciate it and already feel like I'm accepted into the home brew community.

You all had great input, and there seems to be a bit of tension between the "primary only's" and the ones who rack to secondary. I find it amusing that after so many years of the existence of brewing beer, there is no definitive way of doing it other than the necessary steps of adding up the 4 main ingredients. This level of variance seems to put the "craft" in craft beer.

That being said, I am sticking to a long primary. My reasoning being that I don't want to risk the contamination and ruin my first batch, as it would probably turn me off from this hobby if after all that time and money invested to end up with a bad product. I'll try secondary fermentation next time around to see if there really is a difference.

On to today's results: Still sitting at 1.020, which is the same reading I had 2 days ago, which gives me 3 days of consistent readings. Bubbles out every 90 seconds. I will be dry hopping. My instructions once again are screwed up as they tell you to rack to secondary, then add hops, then wait two weeks. BUT they say if you only do primary fermentation you add hops 5-7 days before bottling. So my question is, do I dry hop for one or two weeks? Also, a side note, I drank the hydrometer sample. I know its flat, warm, etc, but it was also very bitter and had that strong alcohol taste. I know, I know, time and patience... just wanted to make sure I was on the right track!

 

[saeroner]

I had a 3% abv IPA cold crash for 5 weeks on top of yeast (after a 2 week fermentation). Kegged it and it tasted perfect. Don't use a secondary

 

[McGarnigle]

A biggish beer like this may taste of alcohol for a bit. They tend to mellow with age. So don't worry about the hydro taste.

I'd dry hop for one week, not two. Not sure about your instructions giving two different durations. Maybe they just think it's easier to add the hops on the same day you rack to secondary (and want you to secondary for two full weeks)?

Side note: I don't think there's any reason to take samples three straight days. If you have time, you can spread the readings out more, and only really need two of them. If you're worried about contamination of racking to secondary, then you might also be concerned about the risk every time you open 'er up to take a sample. If nothing else, you don't want to lose beer to excessive samples.

 

[Gavin C]

A few points

there is no definitive way of doing it other than the necessary steps of adding up the 4 main ingredients.

Ingedients and equipment changes over time impact on the process. The quality of the yeast is paramount in this regard.


On to today's results: Still sitting at 1.020, which is the same reading I had 2 days ago, which gives me 3 days of consistent readings. Bubbles out every 90 seconds.

If it's still bubbling that's an indicaion of ongoing fermentation. Do nothing and let it finish. When it's done all activity will cease.

do I dry hop for one or two weeks? 3-7 days is often advocated as a good dry hop time. Lots of differing opinions on that one though

Also, a side note, I drank the hydrometer sample. I know its flat, warm, etc, but it was also very bitter and had that strong alcohol taste. I know, I know, time and patience... just wanted to make sure I was on the right track!
No worries there

 

[jethro55]

Note that slow bubbling can come and go with weather and temp changes, even after fermentation is complete. Not to worry about that.

The hop addition timing has to do with your taste sampling and clarity preference at this point. The harsh taste is expected at this point since it is a higher ABV recipe. That will fade and when it does and the beer is clear - it is a good time to start the dry hop. I would expect the harshness to fade quickly, a matter of several days.

 

[jethro55]

Oh I forgot - there is a crisp 'bite' to beers left on the trub that we read about. Again, this is good or not depending taster preference. Based on that, I'll guess that harshness may not fade as quickly as one that was taken off the trub.

 

[Gavin C]

The beer is in the primary for 8 days now. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Bubbling from an FV 8 days after pitching yeast is in all likelihood the result of ongoing fermentation. I would not consider doing anything to it at the moment. Don't mess with it at all even to take samples. (repeated samples so early is not really best practice IMHO).
The facts

• 8 days post pitch
• OG 1.076
• Current SG 1.020
• FV showing signs of ongoing active fermentation

Just let things finish. The bubbling will stop when it stops. This is a BIG beer and will take time to finish. If there are any unwanted fermentation products time can help these diminish.

Just an opinion of course and you must do to it what you feel you must. If it were me I'd get cracking on my next brew; a smaller beer with faster turnaround. Focus my attentions on it and let the big fella develop over time.

 

[jethro55]

Gavin,
I would call this a big beer too. And at FG, attenuation is complete and it is in the conditioning stage. That will happen in a bucket, in a clearing vessel, or a bottle. Far far to the right is one way to go.

Like I said, bubbling is not your indicator at this point. Hydrometer is.

It sure looks like a success!