The Big Three should die

[jjeffers09]

A few differences of opinion is obvious here, but just to engage in conversation with what your argument is...

Guess what? It's the public that chooses it. People vote for what they want by where they spend their money.

1.)How can they effectively choose in a free market when the 7'x5' shelf has ~10 selections 8 of which are owned by the big 2? They spend their money where they want to spend their money but the economy is smothered because the American people are not the ones making the money.

I always think it silly when people protest corporate greed and preach supporting small business. At what point of success do you turn your back on that small business because they became too successful in your eyes?

2.) you are assuming that I would turn my back on them. I stand by American companies, making American products, in America, from American vendors, in American communities. I happily will buy Sam Adams EVERY time before buying from AB Inbev. And I know how much more money they make per Hectoliter. In business that is as big as the beverage/food industry I truly do not appreciate big box, big business. It is not a culture I want to belong to. It is rarely a good product and far from a great one. It has been what Generation 'Y' was born into. A faded culture of proud Americans into a bitter obsessed consumerist media junkies. It just is not what I believe to be real. There is no connection between a can of Budweiser and the owner. That to me is real. I want to drink milk and know who cleaned the utters. I want to eat a salad and know it was grown in my neighboring county. I want to have exotic cuisine cooked by a guy who was born and raised on the same street as me. Someone who found passion that took him abroad, and he did the most inspiring thing I have found in modern day America. He took his passion back home and shared it with his neighbors, friends and family. Call me whatever you want, but you should atleast agree that there is real beauty in that concept.

Then why, once they grow, and Joe from down the street becomes a millionaire, do you then decide his business is evil? Because he's more successful than you? Because he managed to get off his ass and take control of his life and own it while you're still working for someone else?

3.) You assume I have a problem with Joe. I don't. You assume the issue with everyone who is against big business and big banks is that it is jealousy. It isn't. I think we can atleast agree that would be arrogant.

I don't understand how you don't contribute any of this to a marketing culture from big business flooding the market with a ridiculous impression compelling people to buy their product based on false pretense? You think that is responsible business practices? If you do that is fine. Believe what you want. I for one am tired of it. Walker-Smith reports the average person is exposed to 5,000 advertisements a day from ridiculous companies spending 1.6-1.9B a year in marketing. Remember when we were told McDonalds Chicken Nuggets were a healthy meal option for children? Yeah, its not even close to what a "healthy" meal should be. However my parents believed it was a great choice.

I don't know, that giant Budweiser plant an hour from my house in Ohio is pretty American

What is "American" about a bunch of slaves to a major corporation that throws its profits in another economy? That would be "pretty American" if it was an employee owned company in Ohio. It is not, and if it were I could support it.

 

[jigfisher]

I agree with you somewhat about the confusion these days about where products are made or how they are made. There are all kinds of companies that are advertising them one way, but their claims aren't always true. We could list those all day long. But consumers are getting smarter. Just look at all the claims out there of people doing their research and finding out for themselves. It comes up all the time. If you don't like it, call them out on it. Challenge them. That's what gets things moving. We know how these beers are owned and where the profits flow. It's nothing new and it probably won't change, but like I said, if advertising is truly misleading it possibly could be changed. Does it bother me? Sometimes. I check some of the products and sometimes it changes my decision, sometimes it doesn't. Really what I am looking for is a great product at a great price that is safe. As far as beer, if I don't like a beer, I don't drink it. At home, I just want to make a beer that I enjoy and I don't care what others think about it. Consider that my way of telling AB that I don't really care for their product and never have so I will just make my own, but at the same time I respect the Bud drinker because that is their choice.

 

[ThatVideoKid]

What is "American" about a bunch of slaves to a major corporation that throws its profits in another economy? That would be "pretty American" if it was an employee owned company in Ohio. It is not, and if it were I could support it.

Apparently you don't know much about business. The proportion of money going into the American economy in labor is HUGE compared to the amount in profit that goes overseas. HUGE. That doesn't even include the money going American farms growing barley and corn. And yes that's all coming from America.

 

[GrogNerd]

Jeesh... who cares where the profits go?

Profit is a very small percentage of revenue, compared to the cost of making the product. Most of the revenue from making BMC in the US stays in the US (pays workers' salaries, etc)

 

[bob1852]

What is "American" about a bunch of slaves to a major corporation that throws its profits in another economy?

I dunno, as a shareholder (and an American), I'm profiting by InBev's success...

 

[unionrdr]

In reality, from what I see at the stores around here, BMC's do not take most of the shelf space. Far from it. Craft gets 1/3 to 1/2 of the total space. Usually BMC's are separate from craft offerings. Like craft beers on the left half of the cooler isle, BMC's on the right half. Or in beer coolers, like Giant Eagle, BMC's on one half of the room & craft taking the other half to one third. Walmart has you seeing the craft offerings first, when coming down the main isle. I don't see too much of this " shove all the craft beers onto the bottom shelf" stuff around here at all...

 

[ThatVideoKid]

Jeesh... who cares where the profits go?

Profit is a very small percentage of revenue, compared to the cost of making the product. Most of the revenue from making BMC in the US stays in the US (pays workers' salaries, etc)

Exactly what I'm saying. So it's a 1 billion revenue company. And it's owned overseas. At a MAXIMUM, 10% of that is going overseas. The problem is with AMERICAN companies moving labor overseas, not the other way around like it is with InBev

 

[GrogNerd]

Exactly what I'm saying. So it's a 1 billion revenue company. And it's owned overseas. At a MAXIMUM, 10% of that is going overseas. The problem is with AMERICAN companies moving labor overseas, not the other way around like it is with InBev

Yep... it was my 2nd post in this thread, the joke about Rage v Machine was in response to this myopic view concerning PROFIT!!!1!! Like the big 1% fatcats are taking ALL the money made from selling a bottle of Bud and hoarding it, while the poor, lowly, beset-upon workers have to fight over meager scraps

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

I'm guessing @jjeffers09 doesn't do vacations overseas. Wouldn't want his profits going to foreign economies.

 

[GrogNerd]

I'm fairly certain most of the money I pay my cleaning ladies gets dumped into the Guatemalan economy

 

[ThatVideoKid]

I'm guessing @jjeffers09 doesn't do vacations overseas. Wouldn't want his profits going to foreign economies.

Nah he vacations in Missouri

 

[ThatVideoKid]

I'm fairly certain most of the money I pay my cleaning ladies gets dumped into the Guatemalan economy

It's okay, they probably need it. Plus then you don't have to clean

 

[GrogNerd]

It's okay, they probably need it. Plus then you don't have to clean

My point, exactly... everybody happy .

 

[mmb]

In threads like this I am continually impressed at the research depths those that dislike American Light Lager will go to know how piss tastes so they can have an accurate comparison to the beer they revile.

I salute you, BMC hating watersports fanatics.

*I will never look at that emjoi the same again....

 

[IrregularPulse]

A few differences of opinion is obvious here, but just to engage in conversation with what your argument is...

]

1.)How can they effectively choose in a free market when the 7'x5' shelf has ~10 selections 8 of which are owned by the big 2? They spend their money where they want to spend their money but the economy is smothered because the American people are not the ones making the money.
Well, in your example, they have 2 choices. In teh real world, even in my tiny podunk town, I have no problem finding local craft beer.



2.) you are assuming that I would turn my back on them. I stand by American companies, making American products, in America, from American vendors, in American communities. I happily will buy Sam Adams EVERY time before buying from AB Inbev. And I know how much more money they make per Hectoliter. In business that is as big as the beverage/food industry I truly do not appreciate big box, big business. It is not a culture I want to belong to. It is rarely a good product and far from a great one. It has been what Generation 'Y' was born into. A faded culture of proud Americans into a bitter obsessed consumerist media junkies. It just is not what I believe to be real. There is no connection between a can of Budweiser and the owner. That to me is real. I want to drink milk and know who cleaned the utters. I want to eat a salad and know it was grown in my neighboring county. I want to have exotic cuisine cooked by a guy who was born and raised on the same street as me. Someone who found passion that took him abroad, and he did the most inspiring thing I have found in modern day America. He took his passion back home and shared it with his neighbors, friends and family. Call me whatever you want, but you should atleast agree that there is real beauty in that concept.
Oh, I get it now. Do you also prefer your black rimmed glasses be hand crafted out of organic ABS and your organic beard cream made from the local llama farmer? Don't even get me started on trying to find a flannel shirt around here made with locally grown cotton. I feel you bro.


3.) You assume I have a problem with Joe. I don't. You assume the issue with everyone who is against big business and big banks is that it is jealousy. It isn't. I think we can atleast agree that would be arrogant.

I don't understand how you don't contribute any of this to a marketing culture from big business flooding the market with a ridiculous impression compelling people to buy their product based on false pretense? You think that is responsible business practices? If you do that is fine. Believe what you want. I for one am tired of it. Walker-Smith reports the average person is exposed to 5,000 advertisements a day from ridiculous companies spending 1.6-1.9B a year in marketing. Remember when we were told McDonalds Chicken Nuggets were a healthy meal option for children? Yeah, its not even close to what a "healthy" meal should be. However my parents believed it was a great choice.
So stop blindly following marketing ads and think for yourself. Just because others are doing it, doesn't mean you have to.

What is "American" about a bunch of slaves to a major corporation that throws its profits in another economy? That would be "pretty American" if it was an employee owned company in Ohio. It is not, and if it were I could support it.

I consider it American because it is in America. It provided and provides incomes for several Americans. Not everyone can be a local craft entrepreneur. Those large business, when they come to town, provide a lot of income to the surrounding areas via jobs which in turns boosts the local economy providing the citizen with extra income. The kind required to be able to afford locally sourced products from the little guy.

 

[CJ-3]

I'm guessing @jjeffers09 doesn't do vacations overseas. Wouldn't want his profits going to foreign economies.

Or drives an import
Or ownes a cell phone
Or a tv
Or a computer
And only buys clothes made in the USA.

 

[ThatVideoKid]

Or drives an import

Or ownes a cell phone

Or a tv

Or a computer

And only buys clothes made in the USA.

Is he more likely to buy an American owned car made overseas? Or an import made in the US. At least the profit is going to the US, right?

 

[jjeffers09]

I get it, some of you don't quite understand what I am about or even who I am. I do vacation out of the country. If you think I don't know anything about business you really should get to know me. If you are under the assumption that business is about anything other than profit you are like a kid at the adults table trying to talk about politics. I don't wear glasses. I don't buy into the term "organic" at all, or "artisan". I have never used beard cream, I don't even know what that is to be honest. I don't own a flannel shirt, and the best cotton is grown in the south, not the Midwest. Clearly we are not bro's....

I applaud you guys engaging in a conversation and at least having the brass to voice an argument. (at this point you should smell a big harry but in the conversation) You are really good at coming up with false judgements, and I am not looking to make you agree with me. I can only state what I see as wrong. If you don't agree with me, great. If you have the gumption to come up with a rebuttal try to do better than petty judgements. In summary controversialist please take a seat on the bench, its waiting for you at Applebees

Automotive forums are a better platform for what I drive. A Chrysler Aspen... yes it is hemi, yes I do love it.

 

[ThatVideoKid]

I mean, obviously it's all about profit, and in that way, they are a bad company. But the claims of the American people's money going overseas(in this topic) is just utterly false. More of our money goes overseas when we buy from American owned companies.

 

[bob1852]

What % of InBev revenue/profit stays the U.S. vs. leaves the U.S.?

 

[jjeffers09]

By that do you mean Multinational companies? Like Apple, Microsoft? Cause we were talking about AB InBev and SABMiller both are headquartered oversees. Which if you don't understand why, look into corporate inversion.

 

[ThatVideoKid]

I can't tell you exactly on the US market, but as a whole, AB InBevs revenue is 44B, and their profit is only 8B. I imagine the ratio is fairly similar for just the US market

 

[jjeffers09]

I dunno, as a shareholder (and an American), I'm profiting by InBev's success...

What % of InBev revenue/profit stays the U.S. vs. leaves the U.S.?

Did you really just ask what % of net profit your invested company has? You are the shareholder. If I go pull info from AB Inbev or SABMiller at best I could see operational %'s not actual bottom line, net profit that stays in the US economy. That would be information you are privileged to... not me.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

By that do you mean Multinational companies? Like Apple, Microsoft? Cause we were talking about AB InBev and SABMiller both are headquartered oversees. Which if you don't understand why, look into corporate inversion.

Funny you mention THIS specifically because even your beloved Jim Koch recognizes that corporate inversion makes perfect business sense.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/busines...boston-beer/VC5PlNiBaVeEFlG5o2AHyK/story.html

 

[jjeffers09]

I can't tell you exactly on the US market, but as a whole, AB InBevs revenue is 44B, and their profit is only 8B. I imagine the ratio is fairly similar for just the US market

Normalized profit attributable to equity holders (aka bottom line profits) vs actual earnings after corporate tax inversion is a bit different.

 

[jjeffers09]

Funny you mention THIS specifically because even your beloved Jim Koch recognizes that corporate inversion makes perfect business sense.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/busines...boston-beer/VC5PlNiBaVeEFlG5o2AHyK/story.html

“We don’t mind paying our taxes here in the US in gratitude for the opportunities that exist in this country and that I certainly have enjoyed — but don’t mistake that for good financial decision-making,” Koch said to the Senate Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations. “Because of our broken corporate tax system, I can honestly predict that I will likely be the last American owner of Boston Beer Company.”

Did you even read your own link before you came up the argument that he said it makes perfect business sense. No, that's not what he said, educate yourself. "Our broken corporate tax system, I can honestly predict that I will likely be the last American owner of Boston Beer Company." Not that it makes perfect business sense... Applebee's is waiting - bro!

 

[ThatVideoKid]

Normalized profit attributable to equity holders (aka bottom line profits) vs actual earnings after corporate tax inversion is a bit different.

Just using the info I am privileged to

 

[mmb]

Funny you mention THIS specifically because even your beloved Jim Koch recognizes that corporate inversion makes perfect business sense.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/busines...boston-beer/VC5PlNiBaVeEFlG5o2AHyK/story.html

Great, now jjeffers09 won't let us drink Boston Beer Co. beer. Thanks a lot, Gila!

 

[jjeffers09]

Great, now jjeffers09 won't let us drink Boston Beer Co. beer. Thanks a lot, Gila!

l enjoy Sam Adams... I have no problems with Sam Adams, well unless they sell to SABMiller or AB InBev

and lets also be clear, drink whatever you want. I won't slap it out of your hand by any means. I will just give you **** for it

 

[ThatVideoKid]

I agree with that. He does allude that he understands why it's going overseas, and that's it's the more financially sound decision. But I don't think he's saying it makes "perfect" business sense.