Super Malty Flavor... Not in a good way.

[jwalk4]

Hey all,

First two brews this year have been super malty tasting, like turning the bread and cereal flavor up so high the knob falls off.

1st brew was the Tiny Bottom Pale Ale, https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=311477 fermented with 05

2nd brew was a Vienna Smash fermented with 04, 10 lbs of vienna, 4 Oz of Saaz. Og: 1.042 fg:1.011

I've used Vienna before, and I tasted this flavor a little bit, but right now it's super prevalent.

I use RO water treated with lactic acid, calcium chloride, and gypsum.


Right now, I consider this to be an off flavor. So I have 2 quextions:

1: Can oxidation give flavors like bread and cereal? Maybe it tastes a little bit like stale/old sh***y beer. Could it be stale malt? Mostly the flavor is bread.

2: What type of malt doesn't give off those flavors, so I can see if it really is my process.


I thought I tasted this off flavor nailed last time as DMS because my burner conked out. So this time I bought a new burner (sp10) and had a great boil.

I think maybe this time the flavor might be oxidation because I forgot to purge my head space in the keg after transferring. Oops.

Any other ideas that might help me identify or solve my problem? Let me know!

 

[Kent88]

Oxidation is usually a cardboardy flavor.

I'm no expert, but I've made a couple SMaSH beers, some with Munich, one with Vienna, the Vienna SMaSH was the maltiest I've tasted. I'm pretty sure its supposed to be bready.

Was it sweet, like maybe it didn't convert as well as you wanted it to? 1.011 seems like about the right finishing gravity, but you probably could do some stuff to dry it out, like add sugar, or have a longer beta rest during the mash.

How big was your batch and at what point did you add the hops? Saaz have a pretty low AA content, if I'm not mistaken. You might not have many IBUs to balance the maltiness from the Vienna.

I rarely give thought to what differences there are in beer that use stale vs fresh malt, usually I buy my malt pretty close to brew day and if I know I wont be brewing for a week or so I put it in the freezer. I guess I can't help you here.

A less malty malt? Just some plain 2-row maybe? Less malty than Vienna is pretty much any other base malt, possibly excluding Munich.

DMS is supposed to be a corny or cooked veggie flavor, I believe.

Were you just trying to get an idea of what Vienna malt is like in the finished beer, or were you trying to make a beer like a style you've had before?

 

[Bilbo1usa]

Mash PH may be another option.

I encountered a similar, 'sudden' malty/grainy flavor change and wrongly suspected the malts as well.
After doing some reading I decided to try the no sparge method of mashing to try to control the mash environment, and it resolved the issue.

I brew with this method exclusively now and the quality of my beer is much better.

 

[ChelisHubby]

The flavor you taste is probable the vienna. See if you find it more appealing in say 3 weeks. I thru out a batch because I used to much Crystal 40 but I did bottle a few for reference, well 6 weeks later the damned beer that I bottled tasted Good. Veinna is Bready and Malty in flavor.

 

[lolcats]

I imagine that 100% vienna with 04 would be very bready/malty. I wouldn't look anywhere else

Just try any pale malt with a clean neutral yeast strain. Maybe you are not using enough hops to balance your brews

I made a blonde ale recently with pislner/wheat/vienna and came out very bready (but in a good way) with Notty yeast

 

[daksin]

Vienna is defintily a bready malt, but in the first recipe you may also be getting it from the Victory malt (AKA biscuit malt).

 

[jwalk4]

Thanks to all for the responses.

The flavor you taste is probable the vienna. See if you find it more appealing in say 3 weeks.

I think I will give it some more time, carbed up in the fridge. I'll purge it a few times since I have read that can help release some undesirable compounds at the sacrifice of hop flavor.

If it is oxidized, it will just deteriorate faster than normal, but at least I'll know the (off) flavor.

Here's hoping it is the Vienna malt.