Stop using kits?

[bk0]

I've done 3 extract kits so far. At some point I will move to AG, but at this point I'm looking at new kits and it seems like they all have basically the same ingredients. The main differences seem to be steeping grains.

If I wanted to make a 5 gallon batch of session ale, would it be a bad idea to just go down to the LHBS and buy 6 lbs of amber DME and 3 oz of cascade hops (I already have yeast)? Why bother with a kit?

 

[rhamilton]

Depends on how your LHBS is setup and how their kits are priced. My local shop is AHS, and I've run the numbers for their kits and it's always cheaper to buy the kit instead of the raw ingredients so the idea of buy the kit once for the recipe then buy the ingredients à la carte doesn't work. Also, I bought hops in bulk from another source and removing the hops from the kit price was easily done and I still got the kit discount on the other items I needed.

Kits are nice because someone put thought into the recipe and has it all outlined for you. Now there is nothing wrong with using your own recipe, but kits usually take all of the thought out of creating a recipe.

 

[ncbrewer]

With kits, you use all the ingredients at once and don't have leftovers to store. Hops and the ingredients can be sensitive to storage conditions. Sealed packages help.

 

[H-ost]

I've done 3 extract kits so far. At some point I will move to AG, but at this point I'm looking at new kits and it seems like they all have basically the same ingredients. The main differences seem to be steeping grains.

If I wanted to make a 5 gallon batch of session ale, would it be a bad idea to just go down to the LHBS and buy 6 lbs of amber DME and 3 oz of cascade hops (I already have yeast)? Why bother with a kit?

Start experimenting! Have fun!

 

[TomSD]

Bulk buys, yeast harvesting/slanting and growing hops are all good reasons to stop using kits but in general the price is comparable on an individual basis. Of course experimenting with your own recipes is a whole different story but with the options out there it isn't like you ever have to stop making kits.

 

[wilserbrewer]

If I wanted to make a 5 gallon batch of session ale, would it be a bad idea to just go down to the LHBS and buy 6 lbs of amber DME and 3 oz of cascade hops (I already have yeast)? Why bother with a kit?

Sounds like you are on your way!

 

[Yooper]

I would get away from kits- but I wouldn't just go buy amber DME and some hops and call it good either!

Amber DME has base malt in it, but it also has other "stuff" in it as well like crystal and possibly Munich malt.

Instead, look at some of our recipes and make one that looks good to you! I have several extract recipes posted that are really good, as do many others, and you can get great results with following a recipe. You get flavor and color from those steeping grains, and using light or extra light DME will be the "base" just like with an all-grain batch.

Think of light DME as the tomato sauce when making spaghetti sauce. The majority of spaghetti sauce is the tomato sauce. Think of the specialty grains as the seasonings- that's where the flavor comes from. By adding garlic, basil, onions, and oregano, you actually have spaghetti sauce instead of tomato sauce.

In brewing, you've got the "tomato sauce" in the light DME. By changing the "seasonings (specialty grains)", you get beer. For example, using light DME, and adding steeping grains of roasted barley and crystal malt, you make a stout. Using light DME and some crystal malt, you make a pale ale. Using light DME and some flaked corn, you could make a cream ale. In other words, the sky is the limit with beer styles by utilizing the specialty grains appropriately.

We have a TON of easy and good recipes on our site: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f82/ Many of them can be extract beers. So if you see one that looks good, we can help with instructions or ingredients if you need some assistance.

 

[MikeWI]

Step outside the box and have fun. I'd recommend checking out the online recipes on this website and others for some ideas (Google search "Beer Recipes"). Also BeerSmith is a great tool to tinker with recipes and see what that extra lb of DME will do to your ABV or what an extra oz of Cascade will do to your IBU. You may make the occasional batch of swamp water, but it'll be YOUR swamp water.

Mike

 

[bk0]

Thanks guys, that's exactly the info I was looking for.

Can anybody point me to a newbie's overview of the various malts? Flavor characteristics, etc?

 

[Yooper]

I like this one: http://hbd.org/brewery/library/Malt101.html but it doesn't specify which are base malts (and must be mashed or replaced with extract) and which are specialty grains. I guess a good way to guess is that if you see the word "pale malt" in the title, it is not a specialty grain.

Grains you CAN steep without issue have the words cara/crystal/caramel in them, like caramunich or crystal malt; roasted malts; malts with words like "chocolate" or "dark" or "black"; and Special B.

 

[unionrdr]

There's also a quick overview of specialty grains,etc in the stickies at the top of the forum. Take a look at our recipes by clicking on the link under an avatar.

 

[cm02WS6]

I've gotten good results by tweaking kit recipes. I pretty much only shop at NB so it helps because they publish the recipe. I've done two versions of their amber ale and will do a version of their Chinook IPA next. Seems like a good stepping point for more custom recipes.

 

[bk0]

Another question: rather than doing steeping grains (and worrying if a particular grain is 'steepable' or not), is it OK to partial mash them instead? Does that change the flavor profile in a bad way?

It seems like partial mashes are only a little more difficult than steeping, so I might as well do that.

 

[dietz]

I did 2 kits and figured it would be fun to creat my own recipes. I bought 3# of pellet hops for a GREAT price from one of the site sponsors (IPA style hops) and vacuum sealed them in 2oz packs. I ended up paying $1.25/oz for bulk hops including vacuum bags where my LHBS is $2.50/oz for average hops. I was able to make 5 gallons of a very good IPA for ~$20 for everything except for the hops.

It's a lot more fun too IMO to walk around and see what the store has, talk to some people, and tweak recipes rather than walking in, picking up a box and walking out.

 

[Jamminjoenapo]

I started with kits about a year ago and the past 4 months I just have bought a bunch of pilsen dme, like yooper said, and a ton of different hops and a few different specialties grains. I've found if you want to buy in bulk farmhouse brewing usually has the best prices and a huge selection. Also if you are not sure on a recipe take one that is on here or a previous kit recipe and change the hops or grains and see what happens.

 

[cheezydemon3]

I strongly suggest using only pale DME, and getting flavor from steeping specialty grains.

That puts the grains on a blank palet, allowing you to learn what they do.

 

[Yooper]

Another question: rather than doing steeping grains (and worrying if a particular grain is 'steepable' or not), is it OK to partial mash them instead? Does that change the flavor profile in a bad way?

It seems like partial mashes are only a little more difficult than steeping, so I might as well do that.

That's actually what I think is the best idea! If you treat EVERY batch as a PM, you can't go wrong and don't have to guess if the grains are for mashing or not.

If you use 2 quarts of water per pound of grain, hold it at 45 minutes, then lift out the grain and put it in a colander over your brewpot and pour 170 degree water over it, up to your boil volume- that's all there is to it. Then you're safe, as some grains (like Munich) can self convert that way, and you can treat all grains exactly the same for each and every batch.

 

[skullface1818]

What I like about picking the ingredients yourself, is that you know exactly what is in it and how to improve it later.

Ive only made 3 brews, but two of them where from a kit. I feel as if I didn't learn anything from my first two experience that could lead to me making a stronger brew. from my last non-kit recipe, I know how to make it a better beer and what to add or take away from it.

Id suggest going for a kit if you want, but I prefer making my own recopies with beer smith and rolling with that

 

[31FIFTY]

With kits, you use all the ingredients at once and don't have leftovers to store. Hops and the ingredients can be sensitive to storage conditions. Sealed packages help.

The guys here in San Leandro, CA at Brewmasters said that hops are very resilient as long as kept below a certain temp. So basically they said freeze them and they're good for a very very long time?

I'm a newb but I just learned that yesterday. Oh and I think this refers to the pellets but I think this thread does too.

 

[ncbrewer]

The guys here in San Leandro, CA at Brewmasters said that hops are very resilient as long as kept below a certain temp. So basically they said freeze them and they're good for a very very long time?

I'm a newb but I just learned that yesterday. Oh and I think this refers to the pellets but I think this thread does too.

Oxygen also degrades hops. Even zip lock bags aren't perfect oxygen barriers, but that's what I use. Some folks are using vacuum sealers. I think it depends on how fussy you are.