Something went seriously wrong...

[Daver77]

I brewed a barleywine yesterday, my first. Mashed in a cooler for an hour, batched sparge etc. Boiled for an hour and after cooling the wort checked Pitched my yeast. I forgot to take a reading but did so only seconds after pitching yeast. The reading was supposed to be 1:105 and instead I got 1:040

I was really pissed. I was also working on a second beer around 3 gallons from the second runnings that frankly I gave up on until I got home today (it's been stting on my stove top covered for 24 hours. I took a reading on that and it came up at 1:050!!!!!

Needless to say I'm confused. I don't think that pitching yeast would make it read so low. Maybe my hydrometer is broken? there are a bunch of loose particles inside?

 

[TipsyDragon]

its possible all the grain lead to a surprisingly crappy efficiency. If the water doesn't drain evenly through ALL the grain you wont get all the sugars. its possible that the grain compacted and prevented good water flow.

 

[Daver77]

its possible all the grain lead to a surprisingly crappy efficiency. If the water doesn't drain evenly through ALL the grain you wont get all the sugars. its possible that the grain compacted and prevented good water flow.

How does that explain the second beer having a higher gravity?

I have never done 20lbs of grains before but I know now that is my max because my cooler was filled to the rim.

 

[TipsyDragon]

i assume you stirred the grain when you added the water for the second runnings. this would break up any "chunks" of grain improving water flow.

 

[Daver77]

i assume you stirred the grain when you added the water for the second runnings. this would break up any "chunks" of grain improving water flow.

Yep, I never had this particular problem before I wonder if it has to do with the amount of grain?

I wonder what my reading will look like once it's fermented?

I'm going to see it through but I'll tell you that will be one bitter beer if that 1:040 reading was right.

 

[TipsyDragon]

I'm going to see it through but I'll tell you that will be one bitter beer if that 1:040 reading was right.

ain't that the truth. good news is that after a point you cant taste any more bitterness.

 

[emetcalf]

1.040 seems way too low. If you stirred the mash at all you should have gotten higher than that. I would check your hydrometer.

 

[Daver77]

Yep, the biggest thing that leads me to believe my hydrometer is not working is the reading I got on my second runnings.

I'll post pictures of the hydrometer when I get back home from work.

 

[Jroy]

Sparge more, boil longer.

 

[luke2080]

Yep, the biggest thing that leads me to believe my hydrometer is not working is the reading I got on my second runnings.

I'll post pictures of the hydrometer when I get back home from work.

Just test your hydrometer using water. Should be 1.000

 

[mux]

What was the temp of the wort when you originally checked?

 

[Daver77]

What was the temp of the wort when you originally checked?

65 degrees

 

[RyanDe680]

There definitely shouldnt be chunks or pieces floating inside the hydrometer. That sounds messed up.

 

[iaefebs]

You did crush the grains?

 

[Daver77]

You did crush the grains?

yes

i have done 25 all grain batches never happened

 

[JasonToews]

whats the reading on the hydrometer in water? is it 1.000?

 

[iaefebs]

yes

i have done 25 all grain batches never happened

And you are sure that you read 1.040 and not 1.104? If you have done 25 batches you should have a great idea what went wrong and not have such a large error.

 

[Daver77]

And you are sure that you read 1.040 and not 1.104? If you have done 25 batches you should have a great idea what went wrong and not have such a large error.

The title is that something went seriously wrong. You can help me figure is out thats up to you. Your point out the fact that I made an error and I know that.

Just out of curiosity how long have you been brewing and how many batches have you done.

Did you really think I tried to mash grains uncrushed?

I have never mashed 20lbs of grist before perhaps there is a trick of the trade that is required for such large mashes, I don't know.

The thing that baffles me the most is that the second running had a higher gravity that both the 1st running and 2nd running combined.

That's why I thought maybe there is something wrong with the hyrdometer. And no it did not say 1:104. I wouldn't have been so disappointed if it did.

I'm here to try and contribute and learn off others.

 

[luke2080]

Daver - did you test your hydrometer?

 

[motobrewer]

The title is that something went seriously wrong. You can help me figure is out thats up to you. Your point out the fact that I made an error and I know that.

Just out of curiosity how long have you been brewing and how many batches have you done.

Did you really think I tried to mash grains uncrushed?

I have never mashed 20lbs of grist before perhaps there is a trick of the trade that is required for such large mashes, I don't know.

The thing that baffles me the most is that the second running had a higher gravity that both the 1st running and 2nd running combined.

That's why I thought maybe there is something wrong with the hyrdometer. And no it did not say 1:104. I wouldn't have been so disappointed if it did.

I'm here to try and contribute and learn off others.

this is one of those errors that the internet probably can't solve. there is a big mistake somewhere, and if you're confident you did everything you normally do there's not much we can do aside from speculate.

large mashes are no different from small mashes.

 

[gunner65]

Well dave I have done several more batches than you and I can say that I make mistakes all the time. Yes it is possible for someone of your grand experience to forget to crush your grain or misread a hydrometer. We are drinking while brewing no? I know I could easily see myself forgetting to crush and dumping the grain in.

The only thing that I can advise you to do at this point is to replace your hydro if you calibrate it and it does not read 1.000

 

[Daver77]

Daver - did you test your hydrometer?

Yeah sure did

Looks a little off but enough to wreak havok?

Here's what I was talking about there is debris in there.

here's the beer it doesn't look like a 1:040 beer but then again I pitched yeast for a 1:105 beer. I changed out the pitcher of water I had s much yeast in there.

 

[EllisTX]

I've only got a year under my belt but I can't imagine a 1.040 beer going off like that with any amount of yeast. Has to be an issue with the reading(said in disbelief not absolution). Best of luck.

 

[Daver77]

I have made tons of mistakes while brewing and that's sober. I can't imagine after a few beers. Usually when I make a mistake I can trace it back to something. This one baffles the heck out of me.

 

[iaefebs]

The title is that something went seriously wrong. You can help me figure is out thats up to you. Your point out the fact that I made an error and I know that.

Just out of curiosity how long have you been brewing and how many batches have you done.

Did you really think I tried to mash grains uncrushed?

I have never mashed 20lbs of grist before perhaps there is a trick of the trade that is required for such large mashes, I don't know.

The thing that baffles me the most is that the second running had a higher gravity that both the 1st running and 2nd running combined.

That's why I thought maybe there is something wrong with the hyrdometer. And no it did not say 1:104. I wouldn't have been so disappointed if it did.

I'm here to try and contribute and learn off others.

Well it is not the first time I have been accused of trying to help and completely f**ked up my response. But in all honesty my first thought was yeah you might have not used crushed grains. People order grains from the online suppliers and forget to check the box that say's crush grains. I don't know you and it is hard to determine what level of experience you have from reading a couple posts. Once you clarified that you are an experienced all grain brewer I switched to what could possibly have gone wrong. You stated that you went from a 1.040 to 1.050 on second running's. I thought maybe if you were reading the scale incorrectly you might actually be seeing 1.104 to 1.105 which is not surprising given different temps and different days. I mean you can get all the mash temp questions and water volume questions and recipe questions you want. I was just trying to figure out the big difference thing.

 

[Daver77]

Well it is not the first time I have been accused of trying to help and completely f**ked up my response. But in all honesty my first thought was yeah you might have not used crushed grains. People order grains from the online suppliers and forget to check the box that say's crush grains. I don't know you and it is hard to determine what level of experience you have from reading a couple posts. Once you clarified that you are an expierienced all grain brewer I switched to what could possibly have gone wrong. You stated that you went from a 1.040 to 1.050 on second runnings. I thought maybe if you were reading the scale incorectly you might actually be seeing 1.140 to 1.150 which is not surprissing given different temps and different days. I mean you can get all the mash temp questions and water volume questions and recipe questions you want. I was just trying to figure out the big difference thing.

I really got tired of buying my grains online because you never know what your getting. I always felt paranoid that I wasn't getting exactly what I ordered.

I use a Barley Crusher to crush my grains, I usually crush it and get it ready the night before.

Also I did an iodine check on the mash to see if it had converted.

Didn't mean to accuse you I'm just really disappointed because I might have wasted 20lbs of grain, didn't mean to take it out on you sorry.

 

[RM-MN]

You mashed the right amount of grains and you got conversion according to the iodine test. You drained the tun and then sparged. These steps all seem to lead up to three possibilities, you left a lot of sugars in the mash tun or you misread the hydrometer or you had a massive doughball in the tun which I doubt. When all the complex solutions run into dead ends the simplest is probably correct. If your second runnings was 1.040, then first runnings must have been higher, most likely much higher.

 

[luke2080]

Well, despite the hydrometer test working, I still wouldn't trust it with floating "debris" in it. Pull a sample now to set aside and cold crash in the fridge, pick up a new hydrometer, and take a reading. I don't believe your first runnings was 1040.

The only way I could think it is possible your first running was lower than your second, is if you did a no sparge and drained all of the wort for the first running and boiled - leaving sugars in dough balls and clinging to the grain. Then as you poured in sparge water to get a second running, you then washed with it all of the sugars that were left behind. But, even that is pushing it since I'm not sure that is possible. Just the only theory I have. Besides my main one...using a hydrometer with pieces of it floating around inside.

 

[Daver77]

Well, despite the hydrometer test working, I still wouldn't trust it with floating "debris" in it. Pull a sample now to set aside and cold crash in the fridge, pick up a new hydrometer, and take a reading. I don't believe your first runnings was 1040.

The only way I could think it is possible your first running was lower than your second, is if you did a no sparge and drained all of the wort for the first running and boiled - leaving sugars in dough balls and clinging to the grain. Then as you poured in sparge water to get a second running, you then washed with it all of the sugars that were left behind. But, even that is pushing it since I'm not sure that is possible. Just the only theory I have. Besides my main one...using a hydrometer with pieces of it floating around inside.

I'm careful about dough balls, you know what I'm going to do, I'm going to calibrate my thermometers too. I use a digital one with a wire. I did do the iodine test though. I'm going to pull a sample see what happens