Saison Fermentation Question

[NavyChief]

I brewed a Saison style beer last weekend (1-12-2014) and pulled a sample today (1-18-2014) to check attrition as activity has slowed way down.
O.G. 1.076. Today's S.G. 1.014. It had rapid fermentation as I used a yeast starter. Everything I have read about Saison is it should be active for 3 to 4 weeks and take a long time to reach F.G.

Mash temp: 154°F.
Sparge water: 170°F
Fermentation temps: started at 70°F for the first two days. Raised temp to 75°F on day 3. Raised temp to 78/79°F on day 4.

Aroma of sample is sweet with a slight sour background. Flavor is slightly sweet with a bit of a sour note. It displays as thick and cloudy.

I would like opinions on whether to move it to secondary off of the yeast cake, what temps to continue fermentation with, also how much longer I should wait until bottling.

 

[billl]

No need to move it. Just keep the temp up and give it at least another week, but probably more. The saison yeasts have a tendency to ferment 99% of the way fairly quickly and then take their sweet time getting that last couple points off. The definitely don't just chug slowly along the whole time.

 

[ahpsp]

A lot depends on what yeast you used, which you have not identified. I brew a lot of saisons, and they typically get well below .014. Most yeasts don't stall, but the Dupont strain (purchased, not harvested) tends to stall. The temps you've listed are low for saisons. I would raise the temp.

 

[sweetcell]

what billll said.

do not move a beer off the yeast cake until it is fully attenuated, and you're happy with that attenuation. no guarantees that keeping it on the cake will improve attenuation, but you can be certain that it won't attenuate more if you move it off.

 

[NavyChief]

Thanks. I am keeping it on the yeast cake for now

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

 

[TANSTAAFB]

My saisons typically finish around 1.004...let it ride. For a while. What strain? I find my Saison Dupont brews hit their stride after a few months and keep getting better-and different-from there

 

[NavyChief]

I took a sample yesterday (1-23-2014) and S.G. was 1.012. Down 2 points in 5 days.

Flavor of sample improved. Still a light sour background aroma. Mostly fruity. Taste was less chemically and more fruity. Not much in the way of sour to the taste. Overall it has mellowed a lot.

I plan on pulling a sample late next week in order to chart the progress of attrition and flavor. Keeping temp steady at 77 F. I know many say to boost temp into the 80s, but I have the Saison on the counter at 3 1/2 ft off the floor and a London Ale on the floor at 72F. If I had a tall shelf I could move the Saison higher to get a higher temp.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

 

[sweetcell]

what saison yeast did you use?

72* for a london ale is on the high side. you've likely got some fruity esters in there. they can be quite nice but a little outta style (if you care about such things).

 

[BuckSwope]

I doubt you'll get much more attenuation out of your yeast with that high of a mash temp (154) unless you are using WY3711, French Saison. Next time, I'd recommend mashing around 147-148 for a more fermentable wort. By the way, which yeast did you use?

 

[NavyChief]

Yeast was WLP550, Belgian Ale Yeast. The brew shop I go to was out of the Saison specific yeast. But WLP550 is used in Saison as well. So I gave it a go. And so far it seems to be working out well.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

 

[TANSTAAFB]

Isn't that the Ardennes strain? I really like that yeast in my other Belgian brews and it does have a nice balance of esters, phenolics, and good ole Belgian funk! I've used it in a Belgian Pale, Golden Strong, and a Dubbel I think. I always mash low, especially Belgian styles, but I like dry beers. Every Belgian strain I've tried has attenuated very well-like down in the 1.002-006 range- but they have to be helped along by careful temp control and letting temps slowly ramp up to max out attenuation as fermentation progresses.

 

[NavyChief]

As far as mash temp goes, 154 was what the recipe I was following called for.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

 

[BuckSwope]

As far as mash temp goes, 154 was what the recipe I was following called for.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

Understandable. That mash temp is usually too high to achieve the low gravity that you want in a saison unless you use the infamous French saison yeast that rips through any wort with ease. 1.012 is a solid FG, but IMO, lower is always best in a saison. Either way, I bet your beer is going to be tits! Enjoy.

 

[DoWBrewer]

Consider wrapping you fermenter in an electric blanket and ramp up the temp slowly over a few days. I swirl my fermenters to get yeast back into suspension. I bet you get down 4 or 5 more points.

Sent from my HTC One using Home Brew mobile app

 

[NavyChief]

I bottled today adding EC-1118 Champagne yeast to get the carbonation that I am looking for. F.G. 10.10. 8.66% ABV.

I had a commercial Farmhouse Ale to compare aromas and flavors to. Very very close. Mine is young and uncarbonated. The commercial version was bottled 8 months ago. So it has had time to mature and develop flavors

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Home Brew mobile app

 

[ahpsp]

There was no need to add any yeast for bottling, there was plenty there to get the job done. The level of carbonation is a function of how much priming sugar you added. In beers that have been in the fermenter for a long time, many times longer than yours, or are significantly higher in alcohol, you might need to add yeast.