Regret a Pump?

[brettwasbtd]

So I have been doing some real thinking - brain hurts I wonder if adding a pump is going to just be more work/time every brew day. I only do 5-6 gallon batches and I batch sparge via gravity. I was thinking a pump would be useful for whirlpooling and aiding during chilling (don't have to stir like a mad-man), but I read a recent post by the brulospher and this actually isn't faster (minimal difference).

I am often interested in efficiency and speed during brewday and I think until I go to some sort of RIMS type system, a pump (with all the fittings at about $200+) may just not be worth it.

Anyone out there get a pump and find it didn't really improve their brewday? Let me know either way

 

[Bobby_M]

Bias disclaimer, blah blah blah.

A pump may not be an instant help. In fact, you'll have buyer's remorse the first 3 times you use it. However, It slowly creeps into your process though and you'll leverage it for more and more things and then we'll have to pry it from your cold dead hands.

Whirlpool cooling with an immersion chiller is way faster than leaving it sit still. Stirring it manually is a way to not buy a pump. No doubt, you can do everything with gravity and manual lifting. A pump lets you move liquid uphill and therefore lets you lower all your vessels to a more safe and efficient height.

 

[passedpawn]

I regret I didn't buy 2.

I brew larger batches, and always outdoors, so my situation might be different.

 

[Quaker]

No regrets. Recirc'd mash creates clear wort. Whirl pooling hops instead of just a hot steep. Faster chilling.

I'm probably not as diligent as I should be on cleaning it. I'm too prone to just recirc'd hot water through it since it's always used hot side each time and gets sanitized with the heat.

I'd like a second with a central inlet.

 

[govner1]

No regrets at all. I built a separate stand that I can move to accommodate either moving mash in water/sparge water then recirc/whirlpool while chilling w/ a CFC.

 

[storytyme]

Bias disclaimer, blah blah blah.

A pump may not be an instant help. In fact, you'll have buyer's remorse the first 3 times you use it. However, It slowly creeps into your process though and you'll leverage it for more and more things and then we'll have to pry it from your cold dead hands.

Whirlpool cooling with an immersion chiller is way faster than leaving it sit still. Stirring it manually is a way to not buy a pump. No doubt, you can do everything with gravity and manual lifting. A pump lets you move liquid uphill and therefore lets you lower all your vessels to a more safe and efficient height.

I actually just used my pump for the first time today. Everything went well so I don't regret it yet. I only have a two vessel system, so I had to manually transfer the first runnings and second running into the boil kettle (lifting a bucket with 3-4 gal wort) Little bummed about doing that with a pump sitting there. How do I avoid doing that?

I also was having a hard time figuring out how to transfer the chilled wort (I use an immersion chiller) from the kettle to the glass carboy. I have the male cam lock fitting on the end of my ball valve. Thoughts on this? I switched the cam lock fitting on the ball valve to a barb fitting just for today and then wanted to see what people did on here in regards to my issues.

I was going to post a new thread with my questions, but I feel this post was great. Thanks.

 

[wardens355]

I never want to brew again without my pump... so I bought a shelf spare. It's awesome. So much easier moving water and wort around. Transfer mash water, recirc/vorlauf, transfer to kettle, recirc/whirlpool.

I actually just used my pump for the first time today. Everything went well so I don't regret it yet. I only have a two vessel system, so I had to manually transfer the first runnings and second running into the boil kettle (lifting a bucket with 3-4 gal wort) Little bummed about doing that with a pump sitting there. How do I avoid doing that?

I also was having a hard time figuring out how to transfer the chilled wort (I use an immersion chiller) from the kettle to the glass carboy. I have the male cam lock fitting on the end of my ball valve. Thoughts on this? I switched the cam lock fitting on the ball valve to a barb fitting just for today and then wanted to see what people did on here in regards to my issues.

I was going to post a new thread with my questions, but I feel this post was great. Thanks.

For transferring the chilled wort, I recirculate boiling wort through the pump and tubing for the last 5-15 minutes of the boil (I have two ports in my kettle), which disinfects. I run the pump during chilling to keep the heat distributed during chilling and help get a bit to settle out in a cone (whirlpool). When I am ready to transfer, I turn off the pump, close all valves, and disconnect one run of tubing to transfer. I let the little bit of wort drain from the tubing and immerse in a sanitizing solution. Then open the kettle valve and fill my carboys.

If you only have one kettle valve, I would clean the tubing and sanitize it while you are chilling, then connect with a camlock and drain from kettle to carboy. Spray out the kettle valve camlock connection with some sanitizing solution before connecting (I used to just stick the nozzle in the camlock and spray til it dribbled out).

I have camlock fittings on all my equipment and almost never transfer anything by hand, and only use one pump as well. Do you only have one kettle and one cooler mash tun?

 

[storytyme]

I use a boil kettle and cooler mash tun. The problem with using the tube with the cam lock fitting is that it won't fit inside the carboy to drain from the kettle via gravity. I used to also use a aluminum turkey fryer pot for the HLT, but wanted to streamline my system and use the pump.

Also the tubing seemed to get kinked on the outlet. I have my pump head in the 6 and 12 o'clock positions.

 

[wardens355]

I use a boil kettle and cooler mash tun. The problem with using the tube with the cam lock fitting is that it won't fit inside the carboy to drain from the kettle via gravity. I used to also use a aluminum turkey fryer pot for the HLT, but wanted to streamline my system and use the pump.

Also the tubing seemed to get kinked on the outlet. I have my pump head in the 6 and 12 o'clock positions.

I pull the camlock fitting off the tubing before I transfer to the carboy. You would have to post some pictures for me to comment on your setup.

 

[LandoLincoln]

No, I don't regret my pump setup one bit. Brew days are so much easier with them around.

 

[govner1]

I actually just used my pump for the first time today. Everything went well so I don't regret it yet. I only have a two vessel system, so I had to manually transfer the first runnings and second running into the boil kettle (lifting a bucket with 3-4 gal wort) Little bummed about doing that with a pump sitting there. How do I avoid doing that?



I also was having a hard time figuring out how to transfer the chilled wort (I use an immersion chiller) from the kettle to the glass carboy. I have the male cam lock fitting on the end of my ball valve. Thoughts on this? I switched the cam lock fitting on the ball valve to a barb fitting just for today and then wanted to see what people did on here in regards to my issues.



I was going to post a new thread with my questions, but I feel this post was great. Thanks.

I use gravity to drain my MLT into my BK. At the end of the boil I chill/whirlpool w/ a CFC using my pump. Once I reach my desired temp I transfer the wort directly to my fermenters using a 1/2" silicone hose with a female SS QD attached to the ball valve on the BK.

 

[Yooper]

I had one pump, for moving hot water and wort, and then I'd gravity drain the BK. But that changed because I added a second pump. I use them all the time, and it saves heavy lifting as well as makes cleaning easier.

It depends on your system, and your brute strength, but I can't imagine trying to brew often without one. Of course, I'm a pretty weak 50 year old and not getting any bigger, or stronger!

 

[storytyme]

I pull the camlock fitting off the tubing before I transfer to the carboy. You would have to post some pictures for me to comment on your setup.

That makes sense by just removing the fitting. Probably the easiest way to do it. Also, once the pump is primed (I installed a bleeder valve to help prime) do I need to prime it every time I switch hoses around?

 

[wardens355]

That makes sense by just removing the fitting. Probably the easiest way to do it. Also, once the pump is primed (I installed a bleeder valve to help prime) do I need to prime it every time I switch hoses around?

I would just to get the small amount of air out of the line. Keep the pump valve closed when you switch to prevent most of the liquid from evacuating the lines.

 

[brettwasbtd]

@Bobby_M - haha, I can't imagine why you would recommend one But if I do end up buying one I had always planned on it being from you. Really like and appreciate the add-a-pump connection kit you have, makes it much easier.

No regrets at all. I built a separate stand that I can move to accommodate either moving mash in water/sparge water then recirc/whirlpool while chilling w/ a CFC.

Got any pictures of this unit?

No, I don't regret my pump setup one bit. Brew days are so much easier with them around.

Care to elaborate. Any specific "time savers?"

I had one pump, for moving hot water and wort, and then I'd gravity drain the BK. But that changed because I added a second pump. I use them all the time, and it saves heavy lifting as well as makes cleaning easier.

It depends on your system, and your brute strength, but I can't imagine trying to brew often without one. Of course, I'm a pretty weak 50 year old and not getting any bigger, or stronger!

What about dead space? I am pretty used to my current ways which allow every drop of hot liquor and sparge water to make its way out of the kettle. I forsee myself still wanting to get every last drop out of those vessels which would mean after pumping I would still need to pick up the pot (and now disconnect the hose fitting) to empty it into the mash tun.

I can definitely see an advantage to the pump and moving to a better height single tier, but I am going to have space constraints where I will be setting up the basement brewery. My initial ideas is to operate a two-tier (on on top of the other) with the top tier being a removable cooler mash tun. This would sit at 40" which although high, is very manageable for me at 5'10". Until I ever incorporate a recirculating mash system I am still not convinced a pump is worth having to stir wort a little bit. Cause that is really all I can see me using it for and making things easier. I Know I could use it for other functions, just not really seeing the benefit right now.

 

[jkovac]

I had never used pumps before but when I moved up to larger batches I had to either pump thru 75 feet of tubing or carry four carboys that far. I chose a pump (Chugger) and I have to say if I'd tried a pump earlier, I might have gone with a side by side brewing system instead of gravity. It works like magic, no problem at all pumping 75 feet. Using 75 feet of tubing has it's own issues unrelated to pumping, , but aside from that, I am now totally sold on pumps.

 

[wardens355]

Care to elaborate. Any specific "time savers?"

For me, the biggest ones are vorlauf and chilling. I don't have to runoff from the mash tun manually until clear, I just use the pump and choke it down to a low recirc flow and leave it for several minutes or so. I can get a few things ready in that few mins. For chilling, I don't have to stay by the kettle and stir to decrease chill time. I just recirc/whirlpool, go finish cleaning and sanitizing my carboys, and come back to transfer chilled wort.

If you have dip tubes installed in your kettles, you can get virtually all of the water out by tilting the kettle very slightly once its almost empty and making sure you do not start pulling air.

I also have bad shoulders, so anything that prevents me from lifting vessels filled with 6+ gallons of water is great.

 

[evanmars]

I regret buying a pump with a polysulphone head. Broke off one of the hose fittings, but was able to epoxy it back on. Then managed to break it again, only this time it shattered.
I don't have the funds for a new head at the moment, so no pump
Will be buying a stainless head soon.

(and another complete pump with stainless head...)

 

[hunter_le five]

I've two pumps. I bought them both about a year and a half ago. I've yet to use them once.

I don't really need them for my current setup, but I bought them for a Brutus-style rig I started building that I affectionately call "Best Intentions". I've got everything done but the electronics, and then I got distracted by a different money pit.

*sigh* Some day....

 

[Natdavis777]

It took some getting used to for the first few batches, but now I couldnt imagine brewing without it. Hell, I want to add a second. Really helps out moving all the liquid of a 10gal batch with the flip of a switch opposed to filling buckets.

 

[AnOldUR]

Whirlpool cooling with an immersion chiller is way faster than leaving it sit still. Stirring it manually is a way to not buy a pump.

Or stirring not so manually works too.

I used this motorized stirrer in my HLT to reduce stratifcation and then would move it to my kettle to speed up my immersion chiller. Worked fine, but I've switch to whirlpooling my boil kettle with a pump for no other reason than I like new DIY's. Still using the motorized stirrer for HLT.

It's a $5.99 135 RPM gearmotor in a Home Depot enclosure. The paddle was made from stuff I had in the shop. The gearmotor is under powered for the job, and I would recommend something with more touque, but it has worked fine for a few years. (Keep saying I'm going to replace it, but never get around to it.)

Where I really like my pump is for moving wort from MLT to Kettle. Use to gravity feed to the floor then lift to a burner. Getting too old to do that with 8-10 gallon batches.

 

[storytyme]

Or stirring not so manually works too.

I used this motorized stirrer in my HLT to reduce stratifcation and then would move it to my kettle to speed up my immersion chiller. Worked fine, but I've switch to whirlpooling my kettle with a pump for no other reason than I like new DIY's. Still using the motorized stirrer for HLT.

It's a $5.99 135 RPM gearmotor in a Home Depot enclosure. The paddle was made from stuff I had in the shop. The gearmotor is under powered for the job, and I would recommend something with more touque, but it has worked fine for a few years. (Keep saying I'm going to replace it, but never get around to it.)

Where I really like my pump is for moving wort from MLT to Kettle. Use to gravity feed to the floor then lift to a burner. Getting too old to do that with 8-10 gallon batches.

I'm a batch sparser, so when I drain my mash tun it is a very slow trickle that takes around a hour for a 5 gal batch. I currently do this via gravity. Could I still do the same thing with a pump?

 

[AnOldUR]

I'm a batch sparser, so when I drain my mash tun it is a very slow trickle that takes around a hour for a 5 gal batch. I currently do this via gravity. Could I still do the same thing with a pump?

You're doing it wrong.

You should be lautering as fast as your system will allow without compacting the grain bed. This is the same for batch sparging with or without a pump. If it's taking more than about 15 minutes, you're either crushing too fine or your lautering system needs to be looked at.

 

[poptarts]

My batch sparging takes like 10 minutes and within the first 3 i have the first runnings being heated in the kettle.

And love my pump, HERMS and counterflow chiller cant be done without it and I love those in my process.

 

[Spartan1979]

I bought two pumps a couple of years ago in anticipation of going to electric brewing. I haven't done that yet. Maybe this winter.

I used the pumps a couple of times, mainly to circulate the wort during chilling, and it worked great for that. But it's just another thing to clean after I'm done brewing. I'd rather keep the wort moving manually than clean the pumps, so they stay in the basement.

I only do 5 gallon batches. If I was doing more, I might think about using the pumps to move things for me.

 

[govner1]

@Bobby_M - haha, I can't imagine why you would recommend one But if I do end up buying one I had always planned on it being from you. Really like and appreciate the add-a-pump connection kit you have, makes it much easier.


Got any pictures of this unit?


Care to elaborate. Any specific "time savers?"



What about dead space? I am pretty used to my current ways which allow every drop of hot liquor and sparge water to make its way out of the kettle. I forsee myself still wanting to get every last drop out of those vessels which would mean after pumping I would still need to pick up the pot (and now disconnect the hose fitting) to empty it into the mash tun.

I can definitely see an advantage to the pump and moving to a better height single tier, but I am going to have space constraints where I will be setting up the basement brewery. My initial ideas is to operate a two-tier (on on top of the other) with the top tier being a removable cooler mash tun. This would sit at 40" which although high, is very manageable for me at 5'10". Until I ever incorporate a recirculating mash system I am still not convinced a pump is worth having to stir wort a little bit. Cause that is really all I can see me using it for and making things easier. I Know I could use it for other functions, just not really seeing the benefit right now.

I'll get some pix when I brew Thursday. Tied up w/ other projects away from my house for now.

 

[hunter_le five]

I'm a batch sparser, so when I drain my mash tun it is a very slow trickle that takes around a hour for a 5 gal batch. I currently do this via gravity. Could I still do the same thing with a pump?

It shouldn't take an hour to drain a batch sparge mash.

 

[storytyme]

It shouldn't take an hour to drain a batch sparge mash.

I normally do it quicker, but I purposefully went that slow to improve efficiency (please let's not go down that road.....many threads on that). So I guess what I'm asking is how do you do it with a pump.

 

[AnOldUR]

So I guess what I'm asking is how do you do it with a pump.

You do it the same. You can throttle a pump on the output side to duplicate whatever speed you're now doing with a gravity system.

 

[wardens355]

I normally do it quicker, but I purposefully went that slow to improve efficiency (please let's not go down that road.....many threads on that). So I guess what I'm asking is how do you do it with a pump.

I drain the mash tun with my pump until there is about a gallon of recoverable wort, and then gravity drain the rest into a small pot to dump into my kettle. Pumping all the way down generally leaves a small amount of wort in the mash tun since air can be pulled into the false bottom elbow once liquid level approaches the kettle valve, and once you turn the pump off to void the air, you lose siphon. When pumping from the mash tun, I choke down flow with the pump outlet valve to get a steady flow into my boil kettle without pumping so fast that I risk compacting the grain bed. Usually takes 5 mins or so to completely drain my mash tun for 11 gallon batches.

 

[storytyme]

I drain the mash tun with my pump until there is about a gallon of recoverable wort, and then gravity drain the rest into a small pot to dump into my kettle. Pumping all the way down generally leaves a small amount of wort in the mash tun since air can be pulled into the false bottom elbow once liquid level approaches the kettle valve, and once you turn the pump off to void the air, you lose siphon. When pumping from the mash tun, I choke down flow with the pump outlet valve to get a steady flow into my boil kettle without pumping so fast that I risk compacting the grain bed. Usually takes 5 mins or so to completely drain my mash tun for 11 gallon batches.

The other problem is I only have a boil kettle and tun with fitting for the pump. I use the kettle as both HLT and BK, so after the first drain I still have my sparge water in the kettle so the first running needs to go into another vessel. I have a 5 gal SS pot and a 7 gal aluminum pot but neither have ports. Just trying to work my way around that until I get a keggle. Any suggestions would be great and with minimal lifting would be even better. Thanks

 

[baulz]

I used the pumps a couple of times, mainly to circulate the wort during chilling, and it worked great for that. But it's just another thing to clean after I'm done brewing. I'd rather keep the wort moving manually than clean the pumps, so they stay in the basement.

I use mine to pump cleaner through all my system (mashtun, tubing, chiller, etc.) after brewing. Nice and easy way to clean everything in one shot.

 

[wardens355]

The other problem is I only have a boil kettle and tun with fitting for the pump. I use the kettle as both HLT and BK, so after the first drain I still have my sparge water in the kettle so the first running needs to go into another vessel. I have a 5 gal SS pot and a 7 gal aluminum pot but neither have ports. Just trying to work my way around that until I get a keggle. Any suggestions would be great and with minimal lifting would be even better. Thanks

How big is your tun? If you have considerable head space, you could mashout with several gallons and pump into your boil kettle. Then your sparge water volume will be smaller and more manageable. So I would heat the initial mash water in your valved kettle, pump into your tun. Then heat mashout volume in your valved kettle to whatever temp to get you to around 170F, pump in after the mash, stir, vorlauf with pump, and transfer to valved kettle. Heat the smaller sparge volume in your 5 gal pot, dump into mash tun, stir, vorlauf, transfer to 5 gal pot, and dump into boil kettle.

 

[storytyme]

How big is your tun? If you have considerable head space, you could mashout with several gallons and pump into your boil kettle. Then your sparge water volume will be smaller and more manageable. So I would heat the initial mash water in your valved kettle, pump into your tun. Then heat mashout volume in your valved kettle to whatever temp to get you to around 170F, pump in after the mash, stir, vorlauf with pump, and transfer to valved kettle. Heat the smaller sparge volume in your 5 gal pot, dump into mash tun, stir, vorlauf, transfer to 5 gal pot, and dump into boil kettle.

It is a 10 gal cooler. There is usually head space unless it is a 10 gal batch. I like your thoughts on this. How do you vorlauf with the pump?

 

[AnOldUR]

How do you vorlauf with the pump?

When you recirculate the mash, it has the same effect as a vorlauf. The grain bed sets and clear wort comes out. The only difference is where you direct the flow.

 

[govner1]

I use mine to pump cleaner through all my system (mashtun, tubing, chiller, etc.) after brewing. Nice and easy way to clean everything in one shot.

*^^^This

 

[storytyme]

When you recirculate the mash, it has the same effect as a vorlauf. The grain bed sets and clear wort comes out. The only difference is where you direct the flow.

Great. Thanks.

 

[ImNoExpert]

I've two pumps. I bought them both about a year and a half ago. I've yet to use them once.

I don't really need them for my current setup, but I bought them for a Brutus-style rig I started building that I affectionately call "Best Intentions". I've got everything done but the electronics, and then I got distracted by a different money pit.

*sigh* Some day....

This makes me has a sad.

 

[wardens355]

It is a 10 gal cooler. There is usually head space unless it is a 10 gal batch. I like your thoughts on this. How do you vorlauf with the pump?

Just pump from the discharge valve back up into the top of the mash tun. I drape my hose over the rim and keep the camlock on to keep some extra weight up there. Don't want the tube slipping out and shooting wort everywhere. I start up the pump with the tube above the liquid surface so any air evacuated from the pump doesn't bubble out and splash. I choke the flow with the effluent valve until there is a relatively steady, low flow into the top that won't disturb the grain bed. I then submerge the outlet into the liquid until it doesn't want to slip out, and put the top on loosely. Let it sit for several minutes and check to see if its running clear. I could put a valve on the mash tun to recirc to, but I am content operating this way.

 

[storytyme]

Just pump from the discharge valve back up into the top of the mash tun. I drape my hose over the rim and keep the camlock on to keep some extra weight up there. Don't want the tube slipping out and shooting wort everywhere. I start up the pump with the tube above the liquid surface so any air evacuated from the pump doesn't bubble out and splash. I choke the flow with the effluent valve until there is a relatively steady, low flow into the top that won't disturb the grain bed. I then submerge the outlet into the liquid until it doesn't want to slip out, and put the top on loosely. Let it sit for several minutes and check to see if its running clear. I could put a valve on the mash tun to recirc to, but I am content operating this way.

Thanks for all the info. Can't wait to try it out.