Random Beer Thoughts

[FoudreGuy]

I'll see your white people and raise you a

 

[jivex5k1]

I'll see your white people and raise you a

Man I really miss Chappelle. RIP

 

[FoudreGuy]

Man I really miss Chappelle. RIP

I've never liked John Mayer but damn I love him in that sketch.

 

[JulianB1]

Okay, which one of you donated 20 bucks to Hoppy Floppy's GFM and made the donation under the name Jonathan Wakefield?

 

[wuntrikpony]

Okay, which one of you donated 20 bucks to Hoppy Floppy's GFM and made the donation under the name Jonathan Wakefield?

Sorry for partying.

 

[Josh2]

Okay, which one of you donated 20 bucks to Hoppy Floppy's GFM and made the donation under the name Jonathan Wakefield?

Jonathon wakefield himself.

 

[FoudreGuy]

Who the **** is Hoppy Floppy? Am I supposed to know?

 

[jdd419]

Who the **** is Hoppy Floppy? Am I supposed to know?

It looks like we should all donate money for beer pictures and having a birthday this year

 

[JulianB1]

Good read (click through for the threaded tweets) for anyone wanting to understand credit and debt in the current craft beer industry and why certain sell-offs may have happened (and may happen again in the future:


(Link to media)


It also brings up a good point: "independence" is now the industry buzzword to signify not being owned by ABI/MC/private equity/etc, but are you really independent if a bank has your balls in a vice grip?

 

[iamjeff6]

It looks like we should all donate money for beer pictures and having a birthday this year

****, I wish I had a birthday this year.

 

[WhalezB4Rarez]

Good read (click through for the threaded tweets) for anyone wanting to understand credit and debt in the current craft beer industry and why certain sell-offs may have happened (and may happen again in the future:


(Link to media)


It also brings up a good point: "independence" is now the industry buzzword to signify not being owned by ABI/MC/private equity/etc, but are you really independent if a bank has your balls in a vice grip?

Meanwhile...

 

[Jnorton00]

Good read (click through for the threaded tweets) for anyone wanting to understand credit and debt in the current craft beer industry and why certain sell-offs may have happened (and may happen again in the future:


(Link to media)


It also brings up a good point: "independence" is now the industry buzzword to signify not being owned by ABI/MC/private equity/etc, but are you really independent if a bank has your balls in a vice grip?

Maybe they will start selling IAPs for less than 7 bucks a bottle/can.

 

[sherm10161]

It also brings up a good point: "independence" is now the industry buzzword to signify not being owned by ABI/MC/private equity/etc, but are you really independent if a bank has your balls in a vice grip?

Debt =/= Equity, even if you are in breach of your loan covenants.

The bank has no interest in being in the business of brewing. They just want their money back, or as much of it a is possible.

 

[sherm10161]

Good read (click through for the threaded tweets) for anyone wanting to understand credit and debt in the current craft beer industry and why certain sell-offs may have happened (and may happen again in the future:


(Link to media)


It also brings up a good point: "independence" is now the industry buzzword to signify not being owned by ABI/MC/private equity/etc, but are you really independent if a bank has your balls in a vice grip?

Also, reading the Brewbound article on this seems to imply that this was a business decision by Shmaltz, and not one where the bank had their "balls in a vice grip."

It's possible that Shmaltz took a loss on the sale of that brewery, but for some reason I doubt it. They were pretty successful contract brewing for the better part of 20 years. Maybe he could see the pressure coming down the road, and was able to get out a reason price (breakeven or small gain), but given their brand strength, selling at a loss seems silly.

If anything, this seems like potentially a bad move for Single Cut (depending on how they are financed).

 

[JulianB1]

Debt =/= Equity, even if you are in breach of your loan covenants.

The bank has no interest in being in the business of brewing. They just want their money back, or as much of it a is possible.

Agreed, didn't mean to make it come off as them being equivalent. Just that being "independent" can still involve a financial situation where someone else can pull the plug on you, as we saw with Green Flash.

Also, reading the Brewbound article on this seems to imply that this was a business decision by Shmaltz, and not one where the bank had their "balls in a vice grip."

It's possible that Shmaltz took a loss on the sale of that brewery, but for some reason I doubt it. They were pretty successful contract brewing for the better part of 20 years. Maybe he could see the pressure coming down the road, and was able to get out a reason price (breakeven or small gain), but given their brand strength, selling at a loss seems silly.

If anything, this seems like potentially a bad move for Single Cut (depending on how they are financed).

Sure, it may very well not apply to Schmaltz (and the author admits as much) but it's interesting to think about as a general point. A lot of craft beer fans are really in the dark about lots of the details when it comes to this kind of stuff and think that it all comes down to just "make more beer!" and "don't sell out to the evil empire!".

 

[WhalezB4Rarez]

This article has been around for a little bit but I haven't seen it mentioned here. Thought it might be worth a read to some people in here since we routinely talk about Haze.

https://vinepair.com/articles/craft-beer-ipa-sellout/

It did make me think about how in the late 70s/early 80s and so on the thing was "All there is beer-wise is Macro Lager. Look at all these other styles of beer we can make" that was the champion for craft beer. Now NEIPA is ubiquitous and becoming a default style a brewery has to make. Which seems like that is going towards the "All there is craft beer-wise is NEIPA" and other styles are either not being featured as much or are forgotten.

(not that I don't like NEIPA, some I find enjoyable, it's just that it's EVERYWHERE and all anyone seems excited about. That and Diabetes Stouts)

 

[Lutter]

Also, reading the Brewbound article on this seems to imply that this was a business decision by Shmaltz, and not one where the bank had their "balls in a vice grip."

It's possible that Shmaltz took a loss on the sale of that brewery, but for some reason I doubt it. They were pretty successful contract brewing for the better part of 20 years. Maybe he could see the pressure coming down the road, and was able to get out a reason price (breakeven or small gain), but given their brand strength, selling at a loss seems silly.

If anything, this seems like potentially a bad move for Single Cut (depending on how they are financed).

It sounds like Shmaltz is just getting ahead of where the industry is going and back to their safe space (contract brewing) so they can retain their niche. They probably ran the math and figured out they'd be making better margins just going to another brewer.

Personally, I like Shmaltz beer a whole lot and wish them well. I just wish they hadn't sold the Coney Island brand right on the wings of them releasing batch 3 of CI Barrel-Aged Human Blockhead which is still one of my favorite beers of all time. ;_;

 

[stupac2]

This article has been around for a little bit but I haven't seen it mentioned here. Thought it might be worth a read to some people in here since we routinely talk about Haze.

https://vinepair.com/articles/craft-beer-ipa-sellout/

It did make me think about how in the late 70s/early 80s and so on the thing was "All there is beer-wise is Macro Lager. Look at all these other styles of beer we can make" that was the champion for craft beer. Now NEIPA is ubiquitous and becoming a default style a brewery has to make. Which seems like that is going towards the "All there is craft beer-wise is NEIPA" and other styles are either not being featured as much or are forgotten.

(not that I don't like NEIPA, some I find enjoyable, it's just that it's EVERYWHERE and all anyone seems excited about. That and Diabetes Stouts)

This seems to me like it's just an availability heuristic fallacy. First, this has been true about IPAs for years and years, the fact that right now the hazy ones are popular doesn't really change that 4 years ago it was WC IPAs that were popular. Second, every brewery that I've been to that makes hazy IPAs (or every bar that has a significant number of taps) is less than half IPA, which doesn't seem all that different from before. Finally, "businesses supply things customers want" isn't ******* selling out, this author is an idiot (although using "selling out" pejoratively demonstrated that anyway).

 

[furley]

i can go to the store and, of the hundreds of beer choices, find...... 2 of these "hazy IPAs" that people are moaning about.

there are more gose's available. i can get more fruit beers. there are far more meads.


in less than 15 minutes i can drive to any one of 6 breweries.. and of all their offerings on tap right now... i think one of them has a single hazy IPA.

i don't get all the kvetching and pearl clutching about the state of beer.

 

[RedCoffee]

i don't get all the kvetching and pearl clutching about the state of beer.

WE KNOW

 

[JCastle1]

every brewery that I've been to that makes hazy IPAs (or every bar that has a significant number of taps) is less than half IPA, which doesn't seem all that different from before.

I guess you haven't been to Bearded Iris... Nine out of nine drafts were NEIPA when I went. The beer wasn't bad but I still left seriously disappointed after all I've been hearing.

 

[TommyShitt]

I guess you haven't been to Bearded Iris... Nine out of nine drafts were NEIPA when I went. The beer wasn't bad but I still left seriously disappointed after all I've been hearing.

I assumed that's how it was going to be as I hadn't seen any beer from them that wasn't a NE IPA.

 

[JCastle1]

I assumed that's how it was going to be as I hadn't seen any beer from them that wasn't a NE IPA.

I was in town for a conference, I honestly wasn't very familiar with the local scene just went by suggestions I found on reddit (should have known better).

 

[WhalezB4Rarez]

i can go to the store and, of the hundreds of beer choices, find...... 2 of these "hazy IPAs" that people are moaning about.

there are more gose's available. i can get more fruit beers. there are far more meads.


in less than 15 minutes i can drive to any one of 6 breweries.. and of all their offerings on tap right now... i think one of them has a single hazy IPA.

i don't get all the kvetching and pearl clutching about the state of beer.

This is where I live

23 - http://www.phillytapfinder.com/style/gose/

54 - http://www.phillytapfinder.com/style/ipa/

73 - http://www.phillytapfinder.com/style/pilsenerpale-lager/

254 - http://www.phillytapfinder.com/style/ipa/ (granted this is ALL IPA and not just NEIPA but still)

 

[flyingbison]

i can go to the store and, of the hundreds of beer choices, find...... 2 of these "hazy IPAs" that people are moaning about.

there are more gose's available. i can get more fruit beers. there are far more meads.


in less than 15 minutes i can drive to any one of 6 breweries.. and of all their offerings on tap right now... i think one of them has a single hazy IPA.

i don't get all the kvetching and pearl clutching about the state of beer.

That's because it is still 1982 in Green Bay.

 

[furley]

WE KNOW

you've got a lot of work to do reminding everyone who has posted about hazy IPA's sucking that you already know that, too

by my calculation about 80% of the user base and 70% of the posts in the last year

get to cracking

 

[RedCoffee]

you've got a lot of work to do reminding everyone who has posted about hazy IPA's sucking that you already know that, too

by my calculation about 80% of the user base and 70% of the posts in the last year

get to cracking

WE KNOW

 

[TommyShitt]

 

[sacrelicio]

I think a big reason behind the large number of hoppy beers, sour beers, and strong ales is that you can really experiment with those styles. There are tons of hops and different yeasts and additives to experiment with IPAs, sours can be fermented or aged a whole bunch of different ways and with different ingredients, and strong ales can be tweaked and aged all kinds of ways, plus they lend well to flavor additives. You can't really do that with ore traditional styles like Vienna lager or pils or altbier, unless you play with new hops or with barrel aging, and then you've basically turned them into something else. Plenty of breweries make those styles but they usually have one and they focus on refining it. Maybe someone could try making a 15% BA oatbock or put out a rotating series of 16 different canned pils of various strengths and with different hops, all with different birds from Audubon Society books on the label. I'd **** with 'em.

 

[WhalezB4Rarez]

This seems to me like it's just an availability heuristic fallacy. First, this has been true about IPAs for years and years, the fact that right now the hazy ones are popular doesn't really change that 4 years ago it was WC IPAs that were popular. Second, every brewery that I've been to that makes hazy IPAs (or every bar that has a significant number of taps) is less than half IPA, which doesn't seem all that different from before. Finally, "businesses supply things customers want" isn't ******* selling out, this author is an idiot (although using "selling out" pejoratively demonstrated that anyway).