Questioning JZ's Duvel recipe

[ABVIBUSRM]

Sorry originally posted on wrong thread anyway

i have attempted to brew JZ's duvel clone many times now..i dont think its even on the same planet as duvel..i followed the recipe very closely hit all the numbers fermented according to his advice..this is not duvel not even close...anybody have a tried and true duvel recipe and process? the JZ one aint cutting it for me..maybe im doing something wrong..this beer keeps elluding me..Not knocking JZ he is the man and i have a great deal of respect for him

 

[helibrewer]

Sorry originally posted on wrong thread anyway

i have attempted to brew JZ's duvel clone many times now..i dont think its even on the same planet as duvel..i followed the recipe very closely hit all the numbers fermented according to his advice..this is not duvel not even close...anybody have a tried and true duvel recipe and process? the JZ one aint cutting it for me..maybe im doing something wrong..this beer keeps elluding me..Not knocking JZ he is the man and i have a great deal of respect for him

Check the one here at Candi Syrup:
http://www.candisyrup.com/recipes.html

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

Check the one here at Candi Syrup:
http://www.candisyrup.com/recipes.html

Thanks will try..its my mission to master this beer...i might sell my soul to the duvel

 

[JonM]

Do you know what your water is like? My gut tells me that water would have a pretty big impact on a recipe like this.

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

Do you know what your water is like? My gut tells me that water would have a pretty big impact on a recipe like this.

spring water..i do not have a water test kit..but you are probably right..i nail the color no problem 3 srm

 

[duboman]

100 different people can brew the same exact recipe on different systems and get different beers simply due to the nuances involved.

My guess too is the water, it plays an important part of the equation and simply using spring water is not a good comparison. Water chemistry plays a huge part in beer, particularly when it comes to certain styles it becomes paramount.

If you have never had your water tested then you have no basis of comparison, Also remember that all spring water is not the same In addition, many times a specific manufacturer is used for each malt and if you use a different maltster you can get different flavors and results as well.

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

100 different people can brew the same exact recipe on different systems and get different beers simply due to the nuances involved.

My guess too is the water, it plays an important part of the equation and simply using spring water is not a good comparison. Water chemistry plays a huge part in beer, particularly when it comes to certain styles it becomes paramount.

If you have never had your water tested then you have no basis of comparison, Also remember that all spring water is not the same In addition, many times a specific manufacturer is used for each malt and if you use a different maltster you can get different flavors and results as well.

yes thats probably it..just wish i knew the water chemistry moortgat uses..you can probably find the water profile from that part of belgium but the question is does moortgat treat the water they use..its a tough beer to get perfect

 

[JonM]

FWIW, I recently made Northern Brewer's patersbier, which is kinda like a single version of Duvel. It is just pilsner malt with some bittering hops and Saaz as a 10 minute addition, so it's really similar.

I used a really soft water profile - something like 15 ppm Ca and 30ish chloride. No sulfate, Mg, Na, etc. It turned out really, really Duvel-like. Maybe super soft water is what you want here?

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

FWIW, I recently made Northern Brewer's patersbier, which is kinda like a single version of Duvel. It is just pilsner malt with some bittering hops and Saaz as a 10 minute addition, so it's really similar.

I used a really soft water profile - something like 15 ppm Ca and 30ish chloride. No sulfate, Mg, Na, etc. It turned out really, really Duvel-like. Maybe super soft water is what you want here?

sorta like brewing a czech pils i quess water needs to be soft..i gotta get a water test kit..maybe blending spring with distilled?

 

[duboman]

sorta like brewing a czech pils i quess water needs to be soft..i gotta get a water test kit..maybe blending spring with distilled?

You still have to have a base report and then build up the additions accordingly. Bru n' water is a great water tool and Ward Labs can give you a full report

 

[JonM]

Or all distilled with a little bit of calcium chloride.

And if you're using all pilsner malt, you'll more than likely need to add acid to the mash to get it in the right pH range. Pilsner alone probably won't get the pH low enough. If the pH is too high, it can muck up the flavor.

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

You still have to have a base report and then build up the additions accordingly. Bru n' water is a great water tool and Ward Labs can give you a full report

Im tempted to waste my time and contact duvel moortgat and ask for the water profile but i know they will laugh and tell me to eat a turd haha

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

here is what i gathered for duvel water profile..IDK if its proper..what do you all thing?

CA- 68
s04- 70
MG- 8
NA- 33
CI- 60
Carbonates- 143
hardness- n/a
Alk- n/a

but the hardness and alk is not available..

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

Or all distilled with a little bit of calcium chloride.

And if you're using all pilsner malt, you'll more than likely need to add acid to the mash to get it in the right pH range. Pilsner alone probably won't get the pH low enough. If the pH is too high, it can muck up the flavor.

very good i will try..Acid malt or what kind of acid?

 

[FarmerTed]

sorta like brewing a czech pils i quess water needs to be soft..i gotta get a water test kit..maybe blending spring with distilled?

If you're using bottled water, just go online and search for the water report. I bet you'll find it in no time. I use Crystal Geyser, and they have reports for all of their sources (the source is on the bottle)

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

If you're using bottled water, just go online and search for the water report. I bet you'll find it in no time. I use Crystal Geyser, and they have reports for all of their sources (the source is on the bottle)

yeah never did that..will for now on..but i think for my next go at duvel im gonna use distilled and build it up with calcium chloride and some acids in the mash but gotta research first..i thought calcium chloride acidifies the mash?

 

[ABVIBUSRM]

I take it back it was not JZ's recipe it was my crappy water

 

[JonM]

Here's a great place to start.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f128/brewing-water-chemistry-primer-198460/