Poll: Do you have, or plan to get, an electric car?

[Airborneguy]

Ah! That’s what I get for responding before I finished my morning coffee.

 

[PCABrewing]

It ended up barely being a hiccup in the road to cellphone adoption.

Cellphone adoption was well underway before lithium batteries came on the scene.

 

[Pkrd]

I guess one of the major benefits of charging at home is not being forced to buy that compulsory pie and coffee at the gas station. I pay at the pump to avoid entering the shop whenever possible. I’m not a strong man when it comes to pies.

Finding creative ways to extract $ from charge-loiterers is the next big thing.

 

[Kharnynb]

yea, i was thinking the same, now I drive to helsinki in 4 hours, small break in the middle for toilet and coffee and onward.
If I have to charge for 30 minutes there, i'll be having a luxury lunch....

 

[Kharnynb]

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesla-speeds-odometers-avoid-warranty-213536596.html

that's really bad if true....

 

[Pkrd]

That reminds me. At school a friends mum used to get really poor mileage during school holidays. It was almost like someone was driving it around town during the day while she was hard at work at the supermarket. This stopped when we couldn’t find a mid afternoon park anywhere near where she had left it.

 

[Bilsch]

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesla-speeds-odometers-avoid-warranty-213536596.html

that's really bad if true....

Another day another Tesla hit piece.
Yawn.

 

[Kharnynb]

it seems to have some more evidence, there was a norwegian article too that showed during their electric car test, the tesla for some reason drove 14 km more than all other cars even though they all drove the same trip.

 

[mac_1103]

It should be a fairly simple matter for someone to independently determine how Tesla's odometers actually work. And if they aren't recording actual miles driven then yes, that's a big deal.

 

[Airborneguy]

Another day another Tesla hit piece.
Yawn.

Is what it is. I’ve decided to ignore it all except in staying hyper aware of my car’s surroundings.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

As much as I bad-mouth Tesla, I'm gonna need to see some proof here.

This isn't a "VW figuring out how to beat emissions tests" thing. This is something that should be obvious and easily verifiable.

Which means that for ANY automaker--even one that I don't trust--to do this would be so profoundly stupid as to make me think that nobody in their right mind... would ever knowingly authorize something like this.

And on top of that... Tesla has been shipping the Model S since 2012. They've shipped [according to Google's "AI Assistant"] close to 7M vehicles in that time. What are the odds that they've been doing this and there hasn't been over-analytical owner in that time that would have noticed this?

So, yeah... I'm gonna need to see some proof here.

 

[Bilsch]

As much as I bad-mouth Tesla, I'm gonna need to see some proof here.

That article wasn't designed for critical thinkers such as yourself. By the time someone proves this is wrong said data will never make the headlines.

 

[NeoBrew]

That article wasn't designed for critical thinkers such as yourself. By the time someone proves this is wrong said data will never make the headlines.

This is not directly about the odometer, but it shows a pattern of deceptive practices.

Some notable quotes:
...What Ponsin didn’t know was that Tesla employees had been instructed to thwart any customers complaining about poor driving range from bringing their vehicles in for service. Last summer, the company quietly created a “Diversion Team” in Las Vegas to cancel as many range-related appointments as possible...

...The directive to present the optimistic range estimates came from Tesla Chief Executive Elon Musk, this person said.
“Elon wanted to show good range numbers when fully charged,” the person said, adding: “When you buy a car off the lot seeing 350-mile, 400-mile range, it makes you feel good.”...

...If the remote diagnostics found anything else wrong with the vehicle that was not related to driving range, advisors were instructed not to tell the customer, one of the sources said. Managers told them to close the cases.
Tesla also updated its phone app so that any customer who complained about range could no longer book service appointments, one of the sources said. Instead, they could request that someone from Tesla contact them. It often took several days before owners were contacted because of the large backlog of range complaints, the source said...

 

[tracer bullet]

Reading the article, finally, I will also agree that it's unlikely Tesla is doing anything like this on purpose (or at all).

But I'd not call it a hit piece. From what I can gather it was a statement of fact that a lawsuit exists, and what it is about. It also uses words like "allege" and so on. Did the author convey an opinion at all? I didn't catch it.

 

[day_trippr]

Binning all critical articles as hit pieces ignores the plentiful legitimate targets. Like, the long running joke that is FSD...

 

[Bilsch]

There have been so many accusations about the brand, you'd think one of them might be proven true by now. No?

The range thing was solidly the fault of people not understanding the dynamics of drag and speed. It's not a secret that the EPA range estimate is tested at 60mph. Yet people, and my GF, do 80 and then complain that they did not get the full 300 miles. I've told her a 100 times to slow down to 65 or 70 and you'll get pretty close to that range but her lead foot will not let that happen.

These are the folks that flooded the service centers with this exact same non issue. It only started to crop up in numbers after the Y got popular. It’s not nearly as slippery as the 3 or S so the speed thing is more pronounced. Tesla when faced with service access slowing to a crawl did their best to educate and redirect range complaints to sources of information other then service managers at service centers. Meanwhile hit pieces popped up all over proclaiming Tesla cheating its customers out of range and hiding from its customers. The uninformed lapped it up because, you know, Tesla bad.

 

[doug293cz]

Moderator's note:

Keep discussions of Musk out of this thread. Stick to the topic of cars. If you wish to say anything about Musk, take it over to the "Debate" forum. Edits/deletes have been made, and will continue to be made, for posts that do not follow this guidance.

doug293cz
HBT Moderator

 

[Kent88]

We've talked about this

In this thread, let's keep talk about the top guy at Tesla to things closely related to EVs. We can acknowledge that he's also a controversial person who has taken on some "distracting projects", but this isn't the place to discuss his role in the government or relationship with politicians.

Kent88,
HBT Moderator

 

[fatjay]

I guess one of the major benefits of charging at home is not being forced to buy that compulsory pie and coffee at the gas station. I pay at the pump to avoid entering the shop whenever possible. I’m not a strong man when it comes to pies.

Finding creative ways to extract $ from charge-loiterers is the next big thing.

They have loiter fee's of i think 40 cents a minute after a 5 minute grace period, if you leave your car on the charger after it's finished, they charge a loitering fee.

 

[Airborneguy]

They have loiter fee's of i think 40 cents a minute after a 5 minute grace period, if you leave your car on the charger after it's finished, they charge a loitering fee.

It fluctuates depending on location, time, and how active that particular location is but generally it’s around $.45-$.50. I’ve seen $1.00 before (I think it was in CT).

And that’s just Tesla. I’ve seen Chargepoints in parking garages that were higher.

 

[fatjay]

It fluctuates depending on location, time, and how active that particular location is but generally it’s around $.45-$.50. I’ve seen $1.00 before (I think it was in CT).

And that’s just Tesla. I’ve seen Chargepoints in parking garages that were higher.

All the charge points around here are 4-6kw, not worth it. If I need to top off I'll stop by the electrify america charger, i get a solid 150kw there.

 

[Kent88]

I don't like the current system for idle fees. I get what they're trying to do, and I think something is necessary to keep people moving through the charging stations, but I think 5 minutes is too short, and I think it would be nice if it started a bit cheap and increase over time with a cap on how much they charge per hour.

It'd be nice if a driver wasn't $charged$ outrageously if they plug in, walk to a nearby building, and develop some kind of emergency.

 

[fatjay]

I think the motivation is for people to stay with their car. I can go from 20% to 80% in 30min, which isn't terrible.

The problem is there's only 4 chargers, and frequently there's a line of 2-3 cars waiting while all spots are full. And people take their charge to 100%. After 80%, the charge rate slows dramatically, people have no consideration for those that are waiting. So you may go from 20-80% in 30min, but from 80-100% can take another 45min. This makes the limited charging availability and long charge time much, much longer.

I have a 113kwh battery, which is about the largest of any EV. There will be a hyundai or kia or chevy of some sort charging, I pull up and I can see they're at 83-85%. I plug in and charge to 80, and they're only around 95% at that point. They don't care about battery life because they're trading it in in a couple years. Which is why I would never buy a used ev, people don't take proper care of the batteries.

 

[Bilsch]

They don't care about battery life because they're trading it in in a couple years. Which is why I would never buy a used ev, people don't take proper care of the batteries.

Or just buy one with a LiFePO4 battery and then you never have to worry about past charging transgressions.

 

[fatjay]

Or just buy one with a LiFePO4 battery and then you never have to worry about past charging transgressions.

It’s funny because only the lowest end models have lfp. Since they have lower c rating and are heavier, they’re not performance vehicles.

 

[Bilsch]

It’s funny because only the lowest end models have lfp. Since they have lower c rating and are heavier, they’re not performance vehicles.

True but this is all changing with the advent of the new LMFP batteries.

 

[sibelman]

It'd be nice if a driver wasn't $charged$ outrageously if they plug in, walk to a nearby building, and develop some kind of emergency.

or just a slower-than-predicted pizza.

5 minutes seems a bit tight. I love the idea of a graduated penalty. I assume the terms of use permit the network to tow vehicles after a while.

I have no idea how much of a problem this (cars hogging charging spots after charging is complete) really is.

 

[Kent88]

or just a slower-than-predicted pizza.

5 minutes seems a bit tight. I love the idea of a graduated penalty. I assume the terms of use permit the network to tow vehicles after a while.

I have no idea how much of a problem this (cars hogging charging spots after charging is complete) really is.

Thankfully it's not something I have encountered yet.

Yet.

 

[Bilsch]

Thankfully it's not something I have encountered yet.

Yet.

Here too. In 6 years of EV I have yet to wait for a charging spot but then I mostly charge at home.

 

[Airborneguy]

I’ve never waited either, though I have taken the last open spot twice. I’ve only even seen people waiting a handful of times.