Poll: Do you have, or plan to get, an electric car?

[betarhoalphadelta]

For now. And -20°F is not typical for a winter day in Iowa. There are cold snaps where it gets that low, but I don't believe it's the norm. I have family in northern Iowa, and I live it a colder part of the Midwest. -20°F basically doesn't happen at all for three quarters of the year, April through November. Even December -March it's still uncommon enough that it's usually thought of as a cold snap, and it's usually overnight. I don't think I have ever noticed a forecast in this part of the world with -20°F (or colder) listed as the day's high temperature.

It can get darn cold here. Cold enough to chase people like betarhoalphadelta. Last new years we had a really bad cold snap. But I think people who have lived here a while usually try not to road trip that much in winter, with the obvious exception of late December.

Road tripping at -20°F is, IMHO, getting into outlier territory.

I remember 2 days in the 22 years I lived in Chicago and then school at Purdue where we had days like that. -20F with -40 to -60 windchill. 2 days.

If you're making EV decisions based on something that happens 2 days out of 22 years, you might be overthinking it.

You know what else I remember about those two days? ICE vehicles were having trouble starting unless they were garaged, because of the viscosity of oil at those temps. We weren't far enough north where regular people needed engine block heaters. I remember the day in Chicago they shut down all the schools (I was in HS at the time) because the buses weren't starting.

 

[tracer bullet]

I remember 2 days in the 22 years I lived in Chicago and then school at Purdue where we had days like that. -20F with -40 to -60 windchill. 2 days.

If you're making EV decisions based on something that happens 2 days out of 22 years, you might be overthinking it.

You know what else I remember about those two days? ICE vehicles were having trouble starting unless they were garaged, because of the viscosity of oil at those temps. We weren't far enough north where regular people needed engine block heaters. I remember the day in Chicago they shut down all the schools (I was in HS at the time) because the buses weren't starting.

I don't disagree. It does depend where you live. MN can get -20 for a few days in a row, and do that more than once. -10 and even just "below 0" can go on for seemingly weeks at a time.

But unless you are driving across the state frequently (sales rep perhaps), MN, ND, or SD, then even with the reduced range you can still charge daily. For normal people getting to work, chauffeuring their kids, etc. it's still not an issue at all.

ICE cars are better these days, but yes there were so many dead lead-acid batteries, I've helped people change them when they were literally swollen and oozing out frozen electrolyte. Thankfully EV batteries aren't that way.

I recall a Christmas trip leaving Duluth and heading south. Fuel froze, the line went under the car from the tank to the engine and it froze. We got towed to a shop where it warmed overnight, we put some "heat" in it (IPA, I think) and set off the next day with our fingers crossed. It worked.

I do agree that for that rare case, it's not worth considering. Rent a 3-row ICE SUV for that annual road trip, don't skip an EV for that once a year thing.

 

[sibelman]

I do get that people think about the exceptional cases when making major purchases. After all, you can't expect to rent a vehicle in the midst of an extreme weather event. And that some folks' driving needs (frequent long drives) highlight the down sides of EVs.

@A.Homebrewer wants a vehicle that does well with long drives in cold weather. Right now, notwithstanding that all vehicles can fail in extreme cold, ICE beats EV for that use case, and btw will probably keep the cabin warm, certainly without compromising range.

Sometimes, though, we all look for facts that confirm our feelings. Maybe more than sometimes.

 

[Kent88]

And sometimes people just want far more than what they need. That's why I've made the point in what feels like dozens of posts in this thread that one should look at what they ask of their current vehicle/vehicles. When my Pontiac hit the magic mileage I like to trade at, I looked at what it typically does, and I have found my Volt to be more than capable of taking on those tasks.

Sure, I'd like a vehicle that could drive 80mph over snow in a whiteout blizzard and not flip over or slide off the road. What I need is a vehicle that can handle a light snow, I need to pay attention to the forecast and plan around the weather, and I need the people I have commitments with in my life to understand that blizzards and frigid cold snaps usually mean I'm stranded at my house until the snowplows clear my street.

One point I maybe haven't made as much as I could here is that, regarding snow accumulation, the threshold for what my Volt can handle vs what my Jeep can handle isn't that different.

 

[sibelman]

Though I bought some slender cable chains for my Bolt, Chevy says not to use any such. Not my favorite thing about the car.

 

[doug293cz]

Though I bought some slender cable chains for my Bolt, Chevy says not to use any such. Not my favorite thing about the car.

Did GM say why they recommend against chains? Is it at all related to its being an EV?

Brew on

 

[sibelman]

Just fender well clearance AFAIK. There could be some aerodynamic advantage to minimal clearance...?

 

[doug293cz]

Just fender well clearance AFAIK. There could be some aerodynamic advantage to minimal clearance...?

Yes, there is an aerodynamic advantage to minimal clearance.

Brew on

 

[Bilsch]

About the only thing you added was that you need to refill/recharge in under 10min and you need a range of 400 miles. 400 miles from a recharge, at an average speed of 59mph that takes over 6h45min to deplete. I don't know about anyone else, but I usually have to get out and stretch, grab something to eat, put some new fluid in and leave some old fluid behind more often than that.

I don't understand the edge case reasoning either. For the capability to drive a very long distance that one time in the -20 weather, with only a 10 minute stop. Then for the rest of the years of ownership you are going to pay 3-5 times the fuel cost, multiple times the maintenance plus aggravation? It doesn't seem like a good tradeoff.

In an EV for that extra hour you may end up charging on that long cold drive you could pass the time counting all the money you saved over the years.

 

[Kent88]

I don't understand the edge case reasoning either. For the capability to drive a very long distance that one time in the -20 weather, with only a 10 minute stop. Then for the rest of the years of ownership you are going to pay 3-5 times the fuel cost, multiple times the maintenance plus aggravation? It doesn't seem like a good tradeoff.

In an EV for that extra hour you may end up charging on that long cold drive you could pass the time counting all the money you saved over the years.

I understand the desire for 400+ miles of range. I expect to be driving an EV with that kind of range in a decade or so. Having that kind of range would be helpful for my trips to see family.

But 250 miles on a full charge and maybe one more well placed charging station on each of my usual routes to see parents and inlaws, and I'm good. I already have charging stations in spots that could make those trips work, so extra just gives more options in case one happens to be malfunctioning.

 

[Bilsch]

I understand the desire for 400+ miles of range. I expect to be driving an EV with that kind of range in a decade or so. Having that kind of range would be helpful for my trips to see family.

But 250 miles on a full charge and maybe one more well placed charging station on each of my usual routes to see parents and inlaws, and I'm good. I already have charging stations in spots that could make those trips work, so extra just gives more options in case one happens to be malfunctioning.

But lets be honest the 250 mile range with scarce charging stations is already 5 or more years ago technology. Range today is 300 and this average includes cars not really meant for long road trips which means there are other cars that will do much longer. Also other brands have access to many more charging options taking the worry out of planning.

I guess what I'm saying is waiting 10 years for better things to happen is.. well, you get my point.

 

[Kent88]

You're looking at it from a Tesla owner point of view. I was looking from a Bolt owner POV, as they're one of the more affordable EVs to buy new.

As for the 10 years, that wasn't well thought out. It doesn't really work with my typical trading schedule.

 

[Bilsch]

I was more looking at the US averages. The data says of all the electric cars sold here this year 300 miles was the average range. The top 10 are all over 300 with Lucid leading the pack at 516 miles.

Sure I understand you are looking at things through a GM lens which is probably why the post in question gave the readers the idea that these longer ranges with plentiful and reliable charging infrastructure is something yet to come. I just wanted to make it clear, that future is already here.

The really sad thing is General Motors could have been the leader by a good long way but instead chose to crush that tech and drag their heels for the last 23 years.

 

[Kent88]

GM's attitude has been puzzling. But most of the old, established automakers have been weird with their transition. Stellantis -Fiat-Chrysler is terrible. Ford was a little late to the party, but GM gave them a major opportunity to catch up and they took it. GM made a PHEV, then a BEV, and sat around until others caught up.

 

[Bilsch]

I don't think either GM or Stellantis are going to make it. Ford is more likely since they actually seem serious about the future and electric vehicles.

 

[passedpawn]

I'll bet you guys will like this one. In the waning days of ICE hotrods, there are still some winners, but not in the speed dept. (I have to admit I'd love to buy that Blackwing and stick it in a garage for 25 yrs).

 

[Bilsch]

I'll bet you guys will like this one. In the waning days of ICE hotrods, there are still some winners, but not in the speed dept. (I have to admit I'd love to buy that Blackwing and stick it in a garage for 25 yrs).

If I was driving the blue car I would have just taken that first left due to the utter embarrassment.

 

[day_trippr]

(I have to admit I'd love to buy that Blackwing and stick it in a garage for 25 yrs).

lololol! After 25 years it may not be able to leave the garage...

Cheers!

 

[sibelman]

GM electric truck delayed another year

 

[Airborneguy]

Demand for non-Tesla vehicles is terrible. Until everyone is on the Tesla network and weary buyers see it functioning, it will likely get worse.

The big guys screwed up. They waited too long and were content to “outsource”the charging issue to a patchwork of start ups that, besides Tesla, failed miserably.

When discussing this topic there’s ICE cars, EVs, then Tesla. They’re three different categories.

 

[Kent88]

Demand for non-Tesla vehicles is terrible.

Around my area most Bolts aren't even making it to the lots before they sell. My wife and I finally got to test drive and EUV a couple weeks ago (we had been trying for about a year), and the dealership was due to get a few more by now. A few days later the salesman called to say one was spoken for and I told him that if the others made it to the lot to call me. Haven't heard from him.

 

[whoaru99]

I saw that this weekend. I guess it's a funny story about the government workers, but it really isn't anything a lot of EV drivers don't already know before they buy.

I don't find it funny at all that she had an "advance team" block out charging spot just for her in the dog and pony show.

EV drivers are not the target audience of that story, to your point they already know. The target audience is those on the fence and without that incident all it would have been is sunshine and roses.

Good on whoever called the cops and exposed the shenanigans/hypocrisy.

 

[whoaru99]

Far as the poll itself no current plans to get one.

Rented at Tesla 3 for a few days. It was a blast to drive. Zero complaints about the car itself and was a very urban area so no problem finding chargers from small level 2 up to 250kW superchargers.

All that said, just last Saturday I bought an ICE rig, a 2021 Jeep Grand Cherokee Trailhawk.

 

[Kent88]

I don't find it funny at all that she had an "advance team" block out charging spot

I don't find it very amusing myself. I assume that anti-EV folk who hear about it got a big chuckle, and it was their joke of the moment.

EV drivers are not the target audience of that story, to your point they already know. The target audience is those on the fence

I doubt that. Unfortunately, and for reasons I don't understand, ICE vs EV is a polarizing subject. I expect the type of people attending the kinds of events on such a tour are pro-EV, they're just on the fence about when to actually make the switch from an ICE to an EV.

Far as the poll itself no current plans to get one.

All that said, just last Saturday I bought an ICE rig, a 2021 Jeep Grand Cherokee Trailhawk.

I married into a Chrysler/Ram/Jeep family and we're pretty disappointed with what they're offering for EVs. The PHEV Jeeps have incredibly low electric range and are ridiculously expensive. I don't know if Jeep has a true BEV on the market at all. But we have a Volt and are seriously considering a Bolt EUV.

 

[whoaru99]

I'd think EV folks would be even more bothered by it considering the comments I see about ICE blocking spots, let alone to support a political agenda. But, I suppose it's a pass on that front since it's an EV agenda anyway.

 

[Kent88]

Fortunately, I have yet to get to a charging station and find it ICE'd, so I'm not one to ask about that. I can understand that it would be frustrating, though.

As for "political agendas", we don't discuss those here.

 

[whoaru99]

Yup, no plan to go there other than mentioning what it is/was.

 

[Airborneguy]

I've encountered ICE'ings here and there. The closest I have ever come to a total ICE'ing was on my first trip to Florida when at a supercharger on hotel grounds in NC there was only one open spot. The rest were all blocked, and of course showing as available according to Tesla, which could have created a nightmare scenario for me.

I see these types as the scum of the earth. I seriously considered doing something stupid. But with the open spot I did what I had to do and went on my way.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

Demand for non-Tesla vehicles is terrible.

The big guys screwed up.

Around my area most Bolts aren't even making it to the lots before they sell.

One of the ways I think a lot of them screwed up is prioritizing EV trucks. Take the vehicle with the most weight, requiring the biggest battery to support the range, a vehicle that is often asked to tow heavy loads, targeted at likely the most non-EV-trusting buying segment. And then make them super-expensive (b/c of that big battery). What could go wrong?

 

[Kent88]

Aren't a lot of people used to trucks being expensive?

I don't think making EV trucks was a bad idea. Truck drivers are the drivers that need to be convinced that EVs are good vehicles. EV trucks are good. Take that group head-on and show them that EVs are good vehicles.

Edit: I should say, there are a lot of truck drivers who need to be convinced that EVs are good vehicles. Some already know. Some who are fervently anti-EV don't drive trucks.