New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[schematix]

^^^ +1 measurement error

I bought a digital refract and it even dithers about 0.1 Brix between measurements.

Standard cheap brew shop hydrometers are only good for course measurements. You really want a narrow range precision hydrometer if accuracy is your thing. I have 3 to cover 0-16.5 Plato in 0.1 Plato increments. All indications are that they are amazing tools.

 

[tld6008]

^^^ +1 measurement error

I bought a digital refract and it even dithers about 0.1 Brix between measurements.

Standard cheap brew shop hydrometers are only good for course measurements. You really want a narrow range precision hydrometer if accuracy is your thing. I have 3 to cover 0-16.5 Plato in 0.1 Plato increments. All indications are that they are amazing tools.

It is a cheap hydrometer but it has always produced consistent results relative to the SG of the sample- i.e doesn't change over time in stable sample or read higher as fermentation progresses. I'll look into getting a precision unit though just to remove that variable. Two pints prior to taking readings would not produce these results either.

 

[CJWAU]

This may be a little off topic....
I have made Braufessors recipe 5 times now and have been very happy with the results. This last time as I checked the SG prior to kegging the results were .018 and .015 at days 8 and 10. I kegged on day 12 and the SG was .020. All checks were done with the sample at 60F. Any ideas to explain this?

It could be the increased CO2 in solution, maybe bubbles sticking to the hydrometer? I was in a brewery the other day and saw a pro brewer taking a gravity reading, took the sample and then poured it back and forth between two pint glasses for some time to try and release as much CO2 from solution.

 

[Hannabrew]

GO CUBBIES!!!

Go MMJ

 

[bigplunkett]

I built a similar grain bill but goofed on the yeast is the haze possible with wyeast american 2? Galaxy cent and mandarin balvaria for hops.

 

[tld6008]

It could be the increased CO2 in solution, maybe bubbles sticking to the hydrometer? I was in a brewery the other day and saw a pro brewer taking a gravity reading, took the sample and then poured it back and forth between two pint glasses for some time to try and release as much CO2 from solution.

Hmmm that's interesting. There definitely were not visible bubbles but agitating the sample would be something I should have done. It actually sat for 30 minutes in a measuring cup before I put it into the hydrometer jar. One of the mysteries of home brewing I guess.

 

[popquizkid]

I built a similar grain bill but goofed onon the yeast is the haze possible with wyeast american 2? Galaxy cent and mandarin balvaria for hops.

Wyeast American II (Anchor Liberty) definitely works well with this style. I personally have only used it once and do prefer 1318, but others have reported success with it as well.

 

[hezagenius]

I built a similar grain bill but goofed on the yeast is the haze possible with wyeast american 2? Galaxy cent and mandarin balvaria for hops.

Wyeast 1272 (American Ale 2) is supposedly similar to what Bissell uses (BSI A72) so you might be able to get some haze out of it.

 

[stickyfinger]

I just did a split batch b/w 1272 and 1318, all else the same. Both tasted exactly the same in all triangle tests I was able to do. No way to tell them apart. They are both haze monsters, especially if you are using Galaxy. Just don't use WLP051 (not the same as 1272!)

 

[ScrewyBrewer]

Love to hear what some of the other guys are doing about intake when crashing. Obviously if you are crashing in anything stainless steel you're probably not too worried about it, but I'm not there yet..

My chest freezer just barely holds two 6.5 gallon Ale Pails. During fermentation so much Co2 is produced that it burns my nose whenever I raise the freezer lid to look inside. I don't worry about o2 getting into the fermenters when cold crashing. Becuase by that time the freezer is loaded with Co2.

 

[stickyfinger]

My chest freezer just barely holds two 6.5 gallon Ale Pails. During fermentation so much Co2 is produced that it burns my nose whenever I raise the freezer lid to look inside. I don't worry about o2 getting into the fermenters when cold crashing. Becuase by that time the freezer is loaded with Co2.

Be very careful when crashing in an Ale Pail. A friend of mine started cold crashing using his, and his two resulting beers turned brown very fast; one was dark brown (he also bottles after cold crashing.) I think a ton of air was getting into the bucket or something, causing massive oxidation. I also have stopped cold crashing just to prevent this problem. Instead, I've been racking into my keg with the poppet removed so that it doesn't clog.

 

[ScrewyBrewer]

Be very careful when crashing in an Ale Pail. A friend of mine started cold crashing using his, and his two resulting beers turned brown very fast; one was dark brown (he also bottles after cold crashing.) I think a ton of air was getting into the bucket or something, causing massive oxidation. I also have stopped cold crashing just to prevent this problem. Instead, I've been racking into my keg with the poppet removed so that it doesn't clog.

I've been using them for about 7 years now and all that time never once had the problem you mentioned. And I've shared my beer with a lot of different people.

 

[Braufessor]

I have really liked 1272. The only difference I really noticed with it is that I felt it did drop clearer a bit sooner than say 1318.

 

[stickyfinger]

I have really liked 1272. The only difference I really noticed with it is that I felt it did drop clearer a bit sooner than say 1318.

Yeah, it's a nice yeast for sure. It may drop sooner. It seemed to be pretty comparable to 1318 in my one test batch, but I also didn't use whirfloc and used some Galaxy in the dryhop, so it's really hard to see much anyway.

 

[luizffgarcia]

Wow i am very surprised about this findings on CO2 not being the ideal way to carbonate this style to avoid oxidation and retain aroma for the longest time.

Is it possible at all to ferment in the keg with a spunding valve and NOT transfer to a serving keg??? I am thinking the first pints would be pure yeast / trub and eventually only naturally carbonated beer would start flowing?

If this is a possibility then i bet the results would be awesome!

 

[stickyfinger]

Wow i am very surprised about this findings on CO2 not being the ideal way to carbonate this style to avoid oxidation and retain aroma for the longest time.

Is it possible at all to ferment in the keg with a spunding valve and NOT transfer to a serving keg??? I am thinking the first pints would be pure yeast / trub and eventually only naturally carbonated beer would start flowing?

If this is a possibility then i bet the results would be awesome!

I assume you mean using the yeast to carbonate the beer when you say "CO2 not being the ideal way to carbonate this style"

I think anyone would agree that using yeast is at least as good as using a CO2 cylinder and almost certainly is better due to the O2 contamination in a CO2 cylinder and the absolute lack of O2 in yeast fermentation gas.

Check out this thread: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/pressurized-closed-loop-corny-keg-fermenting.600563/

Also, check out post #241 in that thread in particular. The spunding and serving in primary has been done. It may become a thing if the yeast and hops aren't a problem sitting in the primary during the serving time. If nothing else, you can do a completely closed transfer to a fermentation-CO2-purged keg and serve from there. It may be possible to use either one of the "floating dip tubes" or a keg dip tube screen such as the one shown in the post I reference below to allow for straining of hops and particulate. I haven't tried any of this yet but plan to play around with it soon.

This post has a couple anecdotal reports of not as ideal of a flavor dry hopping under pressure and using the spunding, but I'm sure many others would attest to its great results.
http://scottjanish.com/fermenting-dry-hopping-pressure/ (look at the comments below this post too.)

 

[Hannabrew]

Wow i am very surprised about this findings on CO2 not being the ideal way to carbonate this style to avoid oxidation and retain aroma for the longest time.

Is it possible at all to ferment in the keg with a spunding valve and NOT transfer to a serving keg??? I am thinking the first pints would be pure yeast / trub and eventually only naturally carbonated beer would start flowing?

If this is a possibility then i bet the results would be awesome!

Absolutely. Only downfall is you can't get a full 5G finished beer. I would start with around 4G and ferment under a tad of pressure to keep the krausen in check. Also be sure to use the kind of spunding valve that has tubing so that you have some warning before it gunks up your valve.

Lastly get yourself a floating dip tube and that solves the yeast/trub problem.

All that said, I haven't done this yet as I can't bare to go through all the work of a brewday and only get 3-3.5G of beer. One of these days I plan on doing a 6-7 gallon batch and splitting between two cornies.

 

[stickyfinger]

Absolutely. Only downfall is you can't get a full 5G finished beer. I would start with around 4G and ferment under a tad of pressure to keep the krausen in check. Also be sure to use the kind of spunding valve that has tubing so that you have some warning before it gunks up your valve.

Lastly get yourself a floating dip tube and that solves the yeast/trub problem.

All that said, I haven't done this yet as I can't bare to go through all the work of a brewday and only get 3-3.5G of beer. One of these days I plan on doing a 6-7 gallon batch and splitting between two cornies.

I have a couple 3G kegs and also plan to brew up like 9 gallons of finished wort, leave 1 gal in the kettle, get 4 gallons into each of two 5G corny kegs and then spund them both. I can at least change up the dryhop between the two batches for interest.

If we use a floating dip tube in the primary and then cold crash in the primary, we could carbonate in the primary and then still transfer to a fermentation-CO2-purged serving corny couldn't we?

 

[Braufessor]

Wow i am very surprised about this findings on CO2 not being the ideal way to carbonate this style to avoid oxidation and retain aroma for the longest time.

Is it possible at all to ferment in the keg with a spunding valve and NOT transfer to a serving keg??? I am thinking the first pints would be pure yeast / trub and eventually only naturally carbonated beer would start flowing?

If this is a possibility then i bet the results would be awesome!

I have not had problems carbonating the beer with CO2.

That said, you could definitely ferment and serve from a keg. I actually have done it with some pilsners I have brewed, fermented in kegs, used spunding, etc. Often, I eventually jump to a serving keg, however, the beer is often drinking great before I every move it (5-6 weeks in primary).

If I was going to do it with this beer, I would do two things. One, I would bend the dip tube up a bit - just to get it 1/2-1 inch off the floor of the keg and out of the majority of the sediment. Two, I would make sure to have mesh sleeve of some sort on the dip tube or you will be fighting plugged keg posts constantly. Beyond that, I am sure it could be quite successful.

 

[Braufessor]

I routinely go with 4.5 gallons in kegs when I ferment..... never had any problems. I take the guts out of the post and the CO2 disconnect for the first few days in case there is any blow off - usually is not.

Floating dip tube is a great idea...... I need to get some of those to be honest.

 

[stickyfinger]

I have not had problems carbonating the beer with CO2.

That said, you could definitely ferment and serve from a keg. I actually have done it with some pilsners I have brewed, fermented in kegs, used spunding, etc. Often, I eventually jump to a serving keg, however, the beer is often drinking great before I every move it (5-6 weeks in primary).

If I was going to do it with this beer, I would do two things. One, I would bend the dip tube up a bit - just to get it 1/2-1 inch off the floor of the keg and out of the majority of the sediment. Two, I would make sure to have mesh sleeve of some sort on the dip tube or you will be fighting plugged keg posts constantly. Beyond that, I am sure it could be quite successful.

Wow, cool to hear. Have you tried serving from the primary for several months? I wonder if the yeast/hops would eventually make the beer taste bad due to autolysis or odd flavors?

 

[stickyfinger]

I routinely go with 4.5 gallons in kegs when I ferment..... never had any problems. I take the guts out of the post and the CO2 disconnect for the first few days in case there is any blow off - usually is not.

Floating dip tube is a great idea...... I need to get some of those to be honest.

People seem to have used these two products with success (WITH filters)

http://www.clearbeerdraughtsystem.com/

https://www.morebeer.com/products/r...t-60-cm-silicone-dip-tube-fermentasaurus.html

 

[Hannabrew]

I can attest to them both. If you get the fermentasaurus one you want to replace the tubing as the stock one is maddening to get on the dip tube. Also a lot of us have found you need to adjust the O ring that attaches the floating ball to the floating dip tube to only go through one side. By default it goes through both and some of us experienced issues with the dip tube sucking co2

 

[stickyfinger]

I can attest to them both. If you get the fermentasaurus one you want to replace the tubing as the stock one is maddening to get on the dip tube. Also a lot of us have found you need to adjust the O ring that attaches the floating ball to the floating dip tube to only go through one side. By default it goes through both and some of us experienced issues with the dip tube sucking co2

do you have a picture of what you mean about the O ring and reattaching it?

 

[Braufessor]

Wow, cool to hear. Have you tried serving from the primary for several months? I wonder if the yeast/hops would eventually make the beer taste bad due to autolysis or odd flavors?

I have had helles/kolsch.... things like that in there for a good 8 weeks for sure and it has been some of the best versions of the beer I have ever had. For lagers, I generally do something like the following:
5-7 days with blow off @48-52.... starting low and letting rise a bit toward day 7.
Put on Spunding.
Around day 10-12, I put the kegs out at 60 degrees
Around day 14-18 I put kegs back in chest freezer at 55 and take spunding off
Around day 18-21 I start dropping temp 3-5 degrees per day down to 32.
I just let them sit there at that point.

Usually, they are already starting to taste pretty good at sampling around week 5

I am generally letting them sit there to condition and to drop bright.

Often, if they drop bright, I might jump them to a serving keg and put it on tap in one of my kegerators. But, if they are being stubborn, they might sit for 6-8 weeks with me sampling off them out of the fermenting freezer. I have noticed nothing detrimental about this. In fact, the reason I starting letting them sit was I was finding less success jumping them off at week 2-3. Had a few that got overlooked when I was busy and when I got to them and sampled them in the primary they were just fantastic. I think it is a combination of no chance for oxygen ingress, and also just giving that lager/kolsch type yeast longer to do its thing.


**I would be less concerned about the beer on the yeast for 4-8 weeks and more concerned about the beer being on hop material for a long time. I think that has some potential for grassy/chlorophyll type flavors after time.
Plus, this "time" is generally at cold temps, which slow any autolysis issues down if there were going to be any issues in the first place.

 

[TimmyWit]

I have a couple 3G kegs and also plan to brew up like 9 gallons of finished wort, leave 1 gal in the kettle, get 4 gallons into each of two 5G corny kegs and then spund them both. I can at least change up the dryhop between the two batches for interest.

If we use a floating dip tube in the primary and then cold crash in the primary, we could carbonate in the primary and then still transfer to a fermentation-CO2-purged serving corny couldn't we?

On my last few batches, I did 8 gallon no-sparge instead of the 15 gallons I usually do so I could do exactly what you mentioned. Also consider trying different yeast strains when you split batches. I have a lot of fun with that.

When you transfer a carbonated batch, you'll want to use counter-pressure to prevent the Co2 from breaking out of solution. Just put your spunding valve on the receiving keg and set it to a slightly lower pressure than the pressure you are using to push. If you crash first, I think it would be a good idea to chill the receiving keg as well.

On my most recent batch, I transferred before chilling because I had dry hops waiting in the receiving keg and I wanted some contact at room temperature. The beer was carbonated to ~35psi. I had the spunding valve set to 40 on the receiving keg and I pushed it with 42 psi. I had the CBDS floating dip tubes in both kegs and it worked like a champ!

I think it was @schematix who recently brought up natural carbonation in this thread and I think there's something to be said for that. This is the batch that I transferred post-carbonation. It's sort of a DH farmhouse that was 8 days grain to glass. It has one of the most persistent, rocky heads I have seen. It almost looks like latte foam on there

 

[jakturner]

All that said, I haven't done this yet as I can't bare to go through all the work of a brewday and only get 3-3.5G of beer. One of these days I plan on doing a 6-7 gallon batch and splitting between two cornies.

I alway brew a 6 gallon batch then water down 2 of the gallons and make a quick sour Berliner or gose, that way I don’t feel like a wasted a brew day on 3 gallons.

 

[cheesebach]

I think it was @schematix who recently brought up natural carbonation in this thread and I think there's something to be said for that. This is the batch that I transferred post-carbonation. It's sort of a DH farmhouse that was 8 days grain to glass. It has one of the most persistent, rocky heads I have seen. It almost looks like latte foam on there

Looks great! Which yeast did you use for that batch? I can't say that I've noticed any change in the head characteristics since I switched from forced to natural carbonation for most of my beers, but I do notice differences in the head produced using different yeasts. 1318 seems to be better in that respect than either of the Conan variants I've tried, but they both make a good NEIPA.

 

[TimmyWit]

Looks great! Which yeast did you use for that batch? I can't say that I've noticed any change in the head characteristics since I switched from forced to natural carbonation for most of my beers, but I do notice differences in the head produced using different yeasts. 1318 seems to be better in that respect than either of the Conan variants I've tried, but they both make a good NEIPA.

This was a split batch with Omega's Voss and Hornindal strains. I pitched a NE IPA on top of those cakes this past Saturday and hope to have results in a few days.

 

[Hannabrew]

do you have a picture of what you mean about the O ring and reattaching it?

This is somebody else's pic but this is the way I had it originally and was having an issue with it sucking co2. I then changed it so that little ring only goes through one of the holes (there is another hole you can't see on the other side) and that forces the dip tube into the beer a bit more and haven't had an issue.