hopbrad
Well-Known Member
+1,
you could also carb a bit higher to help mouthfeel. saisons should be dry. i like mine a bit bubbly too.
New Danstar Belle Saison Dry Yeast?
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+1,
you could also carb a bit higher to help mouthfeel. saisons should be dry. i like mine a bit bubbly too.
The poster would like residual sweetness and higher gravity. Do you have any ideas how they might achieve this since its what they want?
beergolf
Well-Known Member
Until you taste what this yeast does you cannot predict what it is like by gravity alone. Even though the gravity goes low it still does not taste like it. I would recommend doing abrew and letting it go. Then if you want it sweeter, then you can alter it but believe me this yeast does not feeel super dry even though thw gravity is near Zero.
hopbrad
Well-Known Member
maybe mash super high, like 158-160?
if the poster wants residual sweetness, he/she should consider another yeast or another belgian style. for dry yeast maybe t-58 is what he is looking for.
if the poster wants residual sweetness, he/she should consider another yeast or another belgian style. for dry yeast maybe t-58 is what he is looking for.
I think that maybe what the poster was getting at,is he/she wants the flavour profile but without the high attenuation and alcohol content that goes with it.
How about an under-pitch of Belle and making up the yeast difference with another,lower attenuating yeast,with a more neutral profile?
How about an under-pitch of Belle and making up the yeast difference with another,lower attenuating yeast,with a more neutral profile?
hopbrad
Well-Known Member
i haven't experimented enough with it. mixing yeasts may work but im thinking the belle may still eat the residual sugars/dextrins that the other strain doesnt.
id say mash 155-156, lower the grain bill to account for it going to 1.005 or less regardless of what you do. maybe throw in a 1/2 lb of carapils. also keep ferm temps on the lower side.
id say mash 155-156, lower the grain bill to account for it going to 1.005 or less regardless of what you do. maybe throw in a 1/2 lb of carapils. also keep ferm temps on the lower side.
![Craft A Brew - Safale S-04 Dry Yeast - Fermentis - English Ale Dry Yeast - For English and American Ales and Hard Apple Ciders - Ingredients for Home Brewing - Beer Making Supplies - [1 Pack]](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/41fVGNh6JfL._SL500_.jpg)
serum
Well-Known Member
For a lean beer with some sweetness then have a look at Brasserie Thiriez beers. They use a yeast very similar to French Saison (Mr Malty says it's the same but the brewmaster says otherwise)
They do an amber that's munich and pilsner and it has this lovely hit of sweetness at the start which fades quickly to dryness and it's fantastic. You could probably do similar with this yeast as it attenuates similarly low.
I don't know the exact balance but I'd imagine using all malt with maybe 70% munich and 30% pils with low hopping would do it.
They ferment at 20 rather than blasting the heat.
I'm going to try it but if anyone beats me to it tell me how it goes!
They do an amber that's munich and pilsner and it has this lovely hit of sweetness at the start which fades quickly to dryness and it's fantastic. You could probably do similar with this yeast as it attenuates similarly low.
I don't know the exact balance but I'd imagine using all malt with maybe 70% munich and 30% pils with low hopping would do it.
They ferment at 20 rather than blasting the heat.
I'm going to try it but if anyone beats me to it tell me how it goes!
During my brews with this yeast I managed to raise the FG from 1000 to 1002 (wow!!) raising the mash temperature from 69°C to 71°C.
Cheers from Italy!
Piteko
skunkfunk
Well-Known Member
I've done an RIS grain bill with this yeast. Turned out okay. Fermented around 64F.
Dropping the temp doesn't seem to affect attenuation terribly much. I suppose if you don't like how it turns out you could backsweeten in the glass.
CaptBrew8386
Well-Known Member
Just cooked up a saison today and pitched this yeast. The rumors are true: it's a beast! Krausen and bubbling away within an hour of pitching! Very excited to see how it all turns out!
hopbrad
Well-Known Member
speaking of dregs. has anyone soured their saison with dregs while using belle? thinking jolly pumpkin then letting it sit for a few months. wondering since it goes so low if much sour will happen
First beer with this yeast was a Vienna/Bravo SMaSH. Despite my hydrometer telling me it was bone dry it didn't really taste it, came out like an estery APA.
Second attempt was to make a more guest-pleasing beer and went with 50% pilsner/50% wheat. Has about the same gravity but subjectively tastes drier with the yeast dominating the flavor with a bit of a tangy taste. Not bad at all, goes down easy but the esters might be just a touch strong for guests.
Next week I'll be brewing up my third bath with this year. I'm thinking:
-20 IBUs of bravo for bittering and lots of bravo and summit for late additions.
-Even amounts of munich and 2-row for the base malt and just a little bit of caramunich and roasted barley, just enough to get it up to a deep red. Probably a bit of brown sugar while I'm at it.
Hopefully enough maltiness will survive this voracious yeast and there'll be enough hoppiness to balance out the esters a bit. I don't mind them, just don't want them completely dominant.
Second attempt was to make a more guest-pleasing beer and went with 50% pilsner/50% wheat. Has about the same gravity but subjectively tastes drier with the yeast dominating the flavor with a bit of a tangy taste. Not bad at all, goes down easy but the esters might be just a touch strong for guests.
Next week I'll be brewing up my third bath with this year. I'm thinking:
-20 IBUs of bravo for bittering and lots of bravo and summit for late additions.
-Even amounts of munich and 2-row for the base malt and just a little bit of caramunich and roasted barley, just enough to get it up to a deep red. Probably a bit of brown sugar while I'm at it.
Hopefully enough maltiness will survive this voracious yeast and there'll be enough hoppiness to balance out the esters a bit. I don't mind them, just don't want them completely dominant.
I went to the LHBS a few days ago to get some Belle Saison yeast, to use in a wit beer when the house is warm and I really can't control the temperature. They didn't have any, so I'm going to use T-58 instead and hope for the best. I've used T-58 before in a wheat beer (not wit) and really liked it.
Yeah, hasn't carbed up yet so I can't get the full picture. I don't like the sweetness of a lot of wheat beers and this yeast certainly took care of that despite me not using much in the way of hops so that good, we'll see what happens to the tang I'm getting from it after a few weeks in bottles.
But seems to work just fine for wheat beers in general if you account for the crazy high attenuation.
Osedax
Well-Known Member
According to the brewing publication "Yeast" you should never underpitch. You should just use a yeast with a different ester profile.
This yeast seems like a pretty resilient little guy and I'm not sure you will see much more ester production by underpitching. I have accidentally underpitched this yeast and it didn't seem to matter. Very similar flavor profile either way.
Give it a go if your up for experimentation.
I just used this yeast for the first time and rehydrated 1 packet only for a 1.054 saison. Got to 1.002 in 5 days. I doubt that's underpitching and so far, it tastes very good.
This yeast is a beast and I only got it to about 80!
This yeast is a beast and I only got it to about 80!
skunkfunk
Well-Known Member
+1. I've direct pitched a pack into un-oxygenated non-aerated 1.079 wort, 6+ gallons. It didn't care.
Pitched about 1/7th of a pack into 1gal of 1.050 wort which put it into a 90F swamp "heater". Will see what happens.
double post
skunkfunk
Well-Known Member
The_Glue said:
The_Glue said:
20 minutes apart? What?!
I had to do some work in the kitchen and after i got back to the phone it still displayed the post editor screen so i hit the submit burton but it seems like i already submitted it before i went to the kitchen
tennesseean_87
Well-Known Member
I've used 3711 for my saisons in the past and I'm giving this yeast a go. When I did session strength beers (1.035-1.040) I added some character malts and even special B AND mashed at 160 in an attempt to preserve some mouth-feel and body with 3711's crazy attenuation, and it still went down to 1.004ish, body intact. I'm thinking of doing one with a simpler malt bill (pils, rye, wheat) at 1.040. Would you guys having experience with this yeast say a high mash temp would still work?
P.S. the only time I didn't get a super-low FG with 3711 was in a yeti belgian imperial stout clone, which was at 1.014. That might not have even been finished, because some bottles eventually started gushing a little.
My second saison (the one with 50% pils 50% wheat and light hopping) went really really dry. Mashed high but the yeast laughed at silly ideas about mashing high resulting in higher FG and went to town anyway.
So dry it has a bit of a sour tang since there's so little maltose left to balance natural beer acidity. Still tasty and very drinkable but the esters kind of dominate a bit. Tastes like a dry "summer" hefe. Doesn't really taste "thin" like a commercial lager or somesuch, has decent mouthfeel just not even the slightest bit sweet.
My third saison (the one you're quoting about) just tastes like a mouthfull of trubby wort now, too early in the fermentation process to know yet.
SWMBO wants something sweet and low in alcohol and I don't have the temp control for anything but saison so thinking:
-2 kilos pils.
-2 kilos munich.
-450 grams crystal 40l.
-Dilute with top-off water until the gravity gets down to 1.033 or so.
-Mash high.
-Veeeeeeery few hops.
Inspired by a clone recipe for Kozel dark (very sweet but tasty malty/caramelly Czech dark lager that my wife loves) I found but without any roasted malts. Looking for something along the lines of an amber psuedo-mild, will call it Nice Guy Ale. Next up will be a saison psuedo-ESB...
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