Messed up my decoction? Forgot sacc. rest before boiling decoction...

[Falcon3]

Couldn't find anything on this in the search, so here goes...

Started my first pilsner and wanted to do a double decoction. I thought I read all of the directions and knew how to do it, but apparently not.

So I pulled my decoction and boiled it to get to my next rest temp, but I forgot to rest the pulled decoction at sacc. temps, I just ramped it up to boiling immediately.

I went from 104-122-150

I realize 104 and 122 aren't necessary, but I wanted to do an all-RO pilsner with little added salts. I only held 122 for about 10 mins so as not to lose all head potential.

So.....the famous question.....is my beer ruined? (or rather what will be the effects of immediately boiling my decoction instead of holding at sacc. rest temp).

 

[stpug]

No, you should be fine. Just give your sacc rest a little longer to convert since very little took place in the decoction vessel. You should have left a good portion of your mash in the MLT as you decocted the other portion, and the portion you left in the MLT should have been fairly thin. This is where most of your converting enzymes are stored and as soon as you added back your decocted mash then they can get to work on the remaining starches.

 

[Yooper]

No, you should be ok. You'll have some grain from the decoction that won't convert due to boiling before the saccrification rest, but the rest of the mash would have been fine.

How big was the decoction? I'm asking about roughly how much of the grain was in the decoction and not converted. If you did something like a 12 pound grainbill, but only 3 quarts of grain was in the decoction and didn't convert, it would be pretty negligible I"d think.

 

[Falcon3]

Wow, quick replies- thanks!

10lbs Pilsner malt
20qt infusion

First decoction was 4.5qts, second was 8 qts-
First draining after sacc rest at 150 was 1.060 (corrected), so it seems like it's in the ballpark

 

[Falcon3]

Even with messing up the rests on the decoctions, I got 78% efficiency. My normal is around 70, give or take depending on the style.

 

[VladOfTrub]

Ramping up the way you did with the 1st decoction isn't too bad. Even though you didn't do a conversion per se, chances are that some conversion took place. It may have taken some time for the decoction to go from initial temp, up to the point of denaturing, slight conversion will take place. Also, you covered all the temp ranges of enzymes. Next time back off on the 20 qt infusion. Start out with 1 qt/lb. or so. The mash will be thin enough. You may need to add water for temp maintenance throughout the process if you don't have an heated mash tun. Pull the 1st decoction when main mash is below 5.8 pH. Rest at 122-125F then ramp to 155F. You want to utilize alpha because the pH is higher during the 1st decoction. Check for conversion at 10-15 minutes. If conversion didn't take place, remove some mash liquid to thin the mash. Re-establish temp and check for conversion at 20 minutes. It will convert quickly. The mash will darken at conversion. Once, converted, bring decoction to a boil and boil for 20 minutes. A longer boil will get rid of more protein gum and burst hard starch. It's best to boil the decoction long enough to reduce the foam that floats on the decoction. Kind of like boiling past a hot break. The wort color won't darken too much. It will be in the Pils color band. Use the 1st decoction to reach 149F in the tun, as you have already hit alpha conversion in the decoction kettle in a small volume of mash. Rest at 149F for 30 minutes. Then, infuse hot water to reach 158 until conversion. If main mash doesn't convert in 20 minutes, thin it down with brewing water. Then, mash out with the last decoction of mostly mash liquid. There may not be enough mash liquid to raise main mash to mash out. Infuse boiling water. You may end up with 2 qt/lb at the end. A 122F rest isn't bad, either. A few years ago Gambrinus put the protein degrading thing to bed in a lab experiment, using high modified malt. It takes a lot longer than 10 minutes to reduce protein to the point where the product is affected. If you are a batch sparge devotee, you might not want to do a protein rest. The protein that would normally collect on top of the grain bed, will be washed down the line. It's better to fly sparge decoction. Next time add a little sauer malz. If you are going to get into decoctions, use Weyermann Boh Pils floor malt. It is more suitable for decoction than standard high modified malt. Notice in German recipes, not Americanized German recipes, a low temp rest of 95F to 105F and a 122F protein rest is employed, using high modified malt. The 105F rest gives mash time for pH to stabilize. Some brewmasters dough in cold to ensure the mash is completely saturated, before going to an acid rest. All in all, ya didn't do too bad for the 1st time.