Low efficiency with Grainfather

[couchsending]

This is something that I was wondering . I take it during the mash you dont use the top plate if your stirring . So do you leave it off until you sparge?

No I just take the top plate off and stir and put it back on. Takes 2 seconds.

I think stirring has an impact but sparge time has a more direct correlation to better efficiency.

I actually got some small micron mesh and cut out a circle the same size as the bottom plate. I put that below the plate and also condition my grain. It really helps to keep particulate out of the boil and a cleaner overall wort.

If you do condition your grain you definitely need to compact the grain bed. All the intact hulls speed up the flow of the sparge water through the grain bed and you won’t extract all the sugars.

 

[Jag75]

No I just take the top plate off and stir and put it back on. Takes 2 seconds.

I think stirring has an impact but sparge time has a more direct correlation to better efficiency.

I actually got some small micron mesh and cut out a circle the same size as the bottom plate. I put that below the plate and also condition my grain. It really helps to keep particulate out of the boil and a cleaner overall wort.

If you do condition your grain you definitely need to compact the grain bed. All the intact hulls speed up the flow of the sparge water through the grain bed and you won’t extract all the sugars.

Ok so you stir mash a couple times . Are you running the pump during mash ? When you mash the grains aren't compacted only compact during sparge ? I'm just trying to figure out why both times I've missed my #'s. They've been 16 lb grain bills

 

[cpham574]

Don’t adjust your crush finer unless you want piles of debris in your boil. The filter plates on the GF are rather course. .036 should be fine.

The key to maximum efficiency on a Grainfather is:

Stirring once or twice during mash
Making sure your sparge is slow

With large grainbills your efficiency will start to decrease. The design of the GF with it’s tall and narrow grain basket doesn’t help that.

I’ve got a lot of brews under my belt on this machine and have done a few mods to try to make better beer.

My low efficiency days are always directly related to a sparge that’s too fast which in my mind means there is some sort of channeling happening. Next time when you pull the basket let it drain and actually push the top plate down to compact the grain bed slightly before you start your sparge. This will slow everything down and you should see an increase in efficiency. Try to keep the liquid at a certain level above the bed for the whole time.

If time is more important to you thy efficiency just adjust your efficiency down.

Thanks for your input. Do you start your sparge shortly after lifting the basket? Or do you let most of it drain before starting the sparge?

 

[cpham574]

Ok so you stir mash a couple times . Are you running the pump during mash ? When you mash the grains aren't compacted only compact during sparge ? I'm just trying to figure out why both times I've missed my #'s. They've been 16 lb grain bills

16lbs is on the higher end of the GF’s capacity so efficiency will definitely suffer a bit. You should be running the pump during the mash and throttle the flow so that the wort level stays below the overflow pipe

 

[Jag75]

16lbs is on the higher end of the GF’s capacity so efficiency will definitely suffer a bit. You should be running the pump during the mash and throttle the flow so that the wort level stays below the overflow pipe

Ok that's what I've done . You just solidified my thoughts on a large grain bill of this size and its struggle for efficiency. It's too much work splitting the grains then combining. I'll just deal with not meeting the projected #'s. Thanks for the input . Good stuff

 

[cpham574]

Ok that's what I've done . You just solidified my thoughts on a large grain bill of this size and its struggle for efficiency. It's too much work splitting the grains then combining. I'll just deal with not meeting the projected #'s. Thanks for the input . Good stuff

Yeah IMO one of the biggest cons of the GF is the capacity for bigger beers. My solution for this problem is brewing 4 gal batches and using some DME to hit those higher gravities

 

[jaymosbeershack]

I have a different sparge method than most with my grainfather. I was never able to get better than 70% before. Now i take my first runnings, and pump them into a second vessle(I use a keg) i add the sparge water as the basket drains. Once the sparge water is in, i stir, and recirq through the grist. I have been getting 80% and the wort is increadibly clear from the sparge water getting vorlaufed. It is a bit time consuming, but it works great.

 

[Jag75]

Yeah IMO one of the biggest cons of the GF is the capacity for bigger beers. My solution for this problem is brewing 4 gal batches and using some DME to hit those higher gravities

How do you know how much to add ?

 

[Jag75]

I have a different sparge method than most with my grainfather. I was never able to get better than 70% before. Now i take my first runnings, and pump them into a second vessle(I use a keg) i add the sparge water as the basket drains. Once the sparge water is in, i stir, and recirq through the grist. I have been getting 80% and the wort is increadibly clear from the sparge water getting vorlaufed. It is a bit time consuming, but it works great.

This seems a lot easier then splitting a big grain bill in half then combining when done. My next brew I will stir the mash a couple times then I will add sparge and recirc like you say . Hopefully this should get me closer to what the #'s are supposed to be . Thanks guys . It's nice to hear little tid bits that everyone has found to give that push to making beer better .

 

[couchsending]

Ok so you stir mash a couple times . Are you running the pump during mash ? When you mash the grains aren't compacted only compact during sparge ? I'm just trying to figure out why both times I've missed my #'s. They've been 16 lb grain bills

Yup always running the pump. Just shut it off when I stir and start it back up.

You shouldn’t start your sparge until A fair amount of the wort has left the grain bed. As it leaves the grainbed will naturally compact. Push the top plate down to the top of the grain bed and then push it down a little more to compact it even further. This should help to slow down sparge and up your efficiency. You should see over 80% mash efficiency with moderate grain bills. Larger grain bills will suffer regardless.

 

[couchsending]

Thanks for your input. Do you start your sparge shortly after lifting the basket? Or do you let most of it drain before starting the sparge?

I wouldn’t say most of it drain but a fair amount. There won’t be any liquid left on top of the grain bed and you should have to push the top plate down to seat it on top of the grain bed. If you were to start your sparge right away the grain bed would be too loose and you wouldn’t be able to pull all the sugars out. Efficiency would take a serious hit.

 

[Jag75]

Yup always running the pump. Just shut it off when I stir and start it back up.

You shouldn’t start your sparge until A fair amount of the wort has left the grain bed. As it leaves the grainbed will naturally compact. Push the top plate down to the top of the grain bed and then push it down a little more to compact it even further. This should help to slow down sparge and up your efficiency. You should see over 80% mash efficiency with moderate grain bills. Larger grain bills will suffer regardless.

Cool thank you

 

[beervoid]

I have a different sparge method than most with my grainfather. I was never able to get better than 70% before. Now i take my first runnings, and pump them into a second vessle(I use a keg) i add the sparge water as the basket drains. Once the sparge water is in, i stir, and recirq through the grist. I have been getting 80% and the wort is increadibly clear from the sparge water getting vorlaufed. It is a bit time consuming, but it works great.

That sounds like something I would like to try!

I'm having trouble visualizing this..
Can you elaborate on your steps?
Do you pump all the wort out into the keg?
Do you stir and recirculate when the grain basket is lifted out?
cheers

 

[jaymosbeershack]

That sounds like something I would like to try!

I'm having trouble visualizing this..
Can you elaborate on your steps?
Do you pump all the wort out into the keg?
Do you stir and recirculate when the grain basket is lifted out?
cheers

I dont pump out all the wort, just enough that i can have an inch of sparge water abover the top of the grain bed once its all added. I add the sparge water as i am pumping out the first runnings. I think of it as a hybrid fly/batch sparge. I leave the basket down in the grainfather while i stir and recirculate. Then i lift the basket, and as its running into the kettle, i push the first runnings back into the kettle with co2. Hope this helps. Good luck.

 

[beervoid]

I dont pump out all the wort, just enough that i can have an inch of sparge water abover the top of the grain bed once its all added. I add the sparge water as i am pumping out the first runnings. I think of it as a hybrid fly/batch sparge. I leave the basket down in the grainfather while i stir and recirculate. Then i lift the basket, and as its running into the kettle, i push the first runnings back into the kettle with co2. Hope this helps. Good luck.

Thank you for elaborating.
Do you heat your sparge water?

 

[jaymosbeershack]

Thank you for elaborating.
Do you heat your sparge water?

Yes. I mash out to 170 and sparge at 170

 

[thedon986]

I have a different sparge method than most with my grainfather. I was never able to get better than 70% before. Now i take my first runnings, and pump them into a second vessle(I use a keg) i add the sparge water as the basket drains. Once the sparge water is in, i stir, and recirq through the grist. I have been getting 80% and the wort is increadibly clear from the sparge water getting vorlaufed. It is a bit time consuming, but it works great.

I have been getting efficiencies in the 50s (brewhouse!) and just tried this method today and I got 77% mash efficiency! This is a great method. I used to batch sparge when I started brewing so this hybrid methodology is awesome. This is the highest efficiency I have ever gotten. I was getting 60s when crushing my own but I've been lazy.

 

[Jag75]

Man you guys shouldnt have to do anything different to get better efficiency. Maybe it's a crush issue . I dont do anything but mash in , mix really well the recirc . I'm getting 80 % efficiency

 

[sleev-les]

Man you guys shouldnt have to do anything different to get better efficiency. Maybe it's a crush issue . I dont do anything but mash in , mix really well the recirc . I'm getting 80 % efficiency

My efficiencies have been great now that I've got my water calcs spot on. Missed my numbers plenty of times as I was figuring out the system, but been great since I've gotten used to it.