IS 30A enough for my control panel or am I too close?

[kal]

I'm thinking of doing the following:

*Regular* 30A 2-pole breaker in the panel -> 10/4 wire -> some sort of 'disconnect switch' to power the brew panel on/off -> 30A dryer outlet.

The brew panel will be plugged into the dryer outlet using this 30A/240V 2-pole 4-wire GFI cord to provide protection:

$80 off ebay: 30A Ground Fault Interrupt Plug GFI CordCable FREE SHIP - eBay (item 110302613578 end time Jan-19-09 10:23:22 PST)

It's pretty inexpensive. Anyone ever use one of these? They don't mention if it's a "Class A" GFI. That's about my only concern.

One of the nice things about putting the GFI in the cable is that I can then take my brew setup with me elsewhere as we have 'brew day' events around here. 30A dryer outlets are easy to find.

Kal

Got this 30A GFI cable today. The thing is *MASSIVE*. I had concerns about the build quality as it was hard to tell from the pictures but the cord shielding is super-thick and the actual GFI module is almost a FOOT long. It's huge the whole thing weighs almost 8 lbs.

Kal

 

[conpewter]

Hey! I didn't get mine yet I hope it arrives today... a little snow here in Chicago area.

 

[lamarguy]

Got this 30A GFI cable today. The thing is *MASSIVE*. I had concerns about the build quality as it was hard to tell from the pictures but the cord shielding is super-thick and the actual GFI module is almost a FOOT long. It's huge the whole thing weighs almost 8 lbs.

I was looking for a cheaper, more portable alternative to buying a GFI breaker...Excellent find! I ordered mine today.

 

[beerthirty]

Ya I know its an old thread, blame lamara for bringing it back to the top. I noticed when you spec your pumps you stated 1.2 amp ea. This is a running amperage, start up could take 3-6 times as much to get them spinning. Probably closer to 3 amp. So figure 4 amps for each pump when doing you calculations.

 

[kal]

So I've done a batch now on my setup with one 5500W element going as well as both March pumps and the various lights/PIDs/etc. Total current draw is less than 23A with everything runnning because the voltage is never exactly 240V - it's typically more like 230-232V.

Here's the strike water heating up:

You can see that the voltage is 232-233V (it changed as the camera took the picture) and total current draw is 23.2A. This is one 5500W element running at 100% (manual PID mode) and one pump. With the second pump also running the current draw only goes up slightly.

Building for a 30A service lets me build something portable as 30A dryer outlets are easy to come by. My GFI is on the cord too so it's truly portable.

Kal

 

[weirdboy]

Wow, that is a sweet setup.

 

[lamarguy]

Nice finish work and I love the Blichmann kettles!

Where did you purchase the AC ammeter and voltage gauges? I looked around on Ebay a while back and mainly found DC ammeter gauges.

Building for a 30A service lets me build something portable as 30A dryer outlets are easy to come by. My GFI is on the cord too so it's truly portable.

I went the same route (30A inline GFI cable), but I'm not sure I'd call it "portable". The plug won't fit most of the 30a 240v outlets in my area.

 

[kal]

Nice finish work and I love the Blichmann kettles!

Where did you purchase the AC ammeter and voltage gauges? I looked around on Ebay a while back and mainly found DC ammeter gauges.

Ebay! Actually, 90% of the control panel was puchased off ebay including the case, heat sink, all switches, buttons, digital timer, relays, etc. The PIDs and SSRs were from Auberins.com

Here's the AC Ammeter: 3½ Digital Blue LED AC 0~50A Amp Panel Meter + Shunt - eBay (item 380144952148 end time Aug-31-09 05:34:58 PDT)

If the auction's gone search for: 3½ Digital Blue LED AC 0~50A Amp Panel Meter + Shunt

Here's the AC voltmeter: 3 Digital Blue LED AC 0~700V Volt Panel Meter New - eBay (item 390084791283 end time Sep-20-09 22:36:19 PDT)

If the auction's gone search for: 3 Digital Blue LED AC 0~700V Volt Panel Meter

A hint: USE SEPARATE POWER SUPPLIES TO POWER THEM! I tested them both separately first and they worked great but then I blew both of them the first time I hooked them both up to a common 5V power supply because they have one AC line pinned to DC GND on the ammeter! The manual says nothing about this and even says you can use a shared power supply. They sent me new ones. What a pain.

I used two of these tiny power supplies: http://cgi.ebay.com/LM317-In-DC-or-...in_0?hash=item56349acebe&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14

Search for: LM317 In DC or AC 4V-30V Out DC 1.5V-27V 1A Converter

They're variable so that you can adjust the display brightness to match the other displays. Two step-down transformers should be used too. Here's a picture inside back when I only had one 120V->10V step-down transformer and power supply (near the top middle of the backplane):

More closeups:

(The power connection in the above photo is for testing purposes only...)

I went the same route (30A inline GFI cable), but I'm not sure I'd call it "portable". The plug won't fit most of the 30a 240v outlets in my area.

Strange. It's a standard 240v/30A dryer plug. Fits in my dryer outlet and every other dryer outlet I've seen sold at Home Depot or other electrical stores. If your house is older or not in North America it may be different.

Standard 30A/240V dryer outlet:

Kal

 

[lamarguy]

Looks like you put a lot of time and energy into selecting the components and designing/building the rig. Very impressive.

Here's the AC Ammeter: 3½ Digital Blue LED AC 0~50A Amp Panel Meter + Shunt - eBay (item 380144952148 end time Aug-31-09 05:34:58 PDT)

If the auction's gone search for: 3½ Digital Blue LED AC 0~50A Amp Panel Meter + Shunt

Thanks, that's what I was looking for! Since you're measuring total system amperage (120v and 240v components), I assume you installed the shunt in series with the shared "hot" leg, correct?

 

[beerthirty]

One of the prettiest electric setups I've seen. Very Nice

 

[kal]

Looks like you put a lot of time and energy into selecting the components and designing/building the rig. Very impressive.

Thanks!

Thanks, that's what I was looking for! Since you're measuring total system amperage (120v and 240v components), I assume you installed the shunt in series with the shared "hot" leg, correct?

That's right. There are two 120V hot legs, one neutral, and a ground. Everything goes through one of the hots and then if it's a 120V item it returns across the neutral. If it's one of the two heater elements it returns across the other hot to get 240V total.

Kal

 

[conpewter]

Kal I love your setup! Very detailed and very well done. I like that you even have great labels on everything.

 

[kal]

Kal I love your setup! Very detailed and very well done. I like that you even have great labels on everything.

Thanks! The labels are easy ... just about any trophy shop or engraving shop will sell them to you for about $1/each.

While the user of the system probably knows exactly what everything does, it just looks completely wrong to have a bunch of lights/dials/controls with absolutely no labels on it. (At least it does to me)

Kal

 

[egurney]

Kal,
To answer the subject of the thread, you ended up going with the 30A circuit correct?
Have you had any problems?

I'm looking at 4500W heater with 2.4A pump running concurrently.
I really like your system including the venting...

 

[kal]

Kal,
To answer the subject of the thread, you ended up going with the 30A circuit correct?
Have you had any problems?

I'm looking at 4500W heater with 2.4A pump running concurrently.
I really like your system including the venting...

No problems at all. I pull 22-23A with the 5500W element running at 100% and two March pumps and all my dials/switches. So I'm fine.

Kal

 

[Cliff897]

What's the wire size you are using.

 

[kal]

What's the wire size you are using.

Not sure what wire you're referring to or if the question's directed at me, but for the 30A 240VAC line going between the electrical panel breaker and my control panel which distributes the power, I'm using 10/3 with ground (sometimes called 10/4). This is to code. Anything smaller would be a violation of code and dangerous.

Kal

 

[egurney]

Kal,
Where did you have your legend plates done?

 

[kal]

Kal,
Where did you have your legend plates done?

www.signsbannerstags.ca

Kal