Indoor BIAB

[joshesmusica]

I don't really understand how one could score 42/50 and be called flawless, then another one scores 42/50 and mentions there was one flaw to it. I'd definitely also be interested in both recipes.

 

[TexasWine]

I don't really understand how one could score 42/50 and be called flawless, then another one scores 42/50 and mentions there was one flaw to it. I'd definitely also be interested in both recipes.

I bet it was the same line of reasoning used on one of my beers in that same competition. First round a judge gave my stout a 39/50. Loved it. Second round, same judge, 32/50 and the were issues with the beer.

Interesting to note, at 32, the second round score from this judge was the outlier. Every other score sheet has it in the upper 30s and low 40s. Might have placed with that beer had he been more consistent.

Oh well. I've gotten to where I look for common themes in the comments as opposed to looking at the final score. Doing that, there are some things I can improve.

 

[Gavin C]

Oh well. I've gotten to where I look for common themes in the comments as opposed to looking at the final score. Doing that, there are some things I can improve.

That's a great point Tejas. The trend in the feedback is the important thing.

For example, I'm coming to the conclusion that even in styles where no notable hop aroma or presence is required, a lot of judges still want there to be something there, perhaps to subconciously satisfy their skillset.

I think I might experiment with a late hop addition to my Alt, Vienna and Dunkel going forward. Just a small one with a noble hop (Spalter in the case of the Alt) to add some more interest to the beer. Upping the intangible overall quality of the beer's presence.

My guess is that other beers in a flight with more of a hop presence will be enjoyed more and as a result score higher even if the style parameters don't require it. I'm just spit-balling. Could be miles off.

 

[Tiber_Brew]

Just curious; did you use a Pils recipe based on mine from the recipe database? We had a chat about the philosophy and methods for true Pilsners in the past and I hope that has helped you. You seem to have picked up on brewing German styles quite well. Congrats on the medals!

Cheers,
TB

 

[orangehero]

I don't really understand how one could score 42/50 and be called flawless, then another one scores 42/50 and mentions there was one flaw to it. I'd definitely also be interested in both recipes.

The way I'm reading it, I don't think the judge necessarily meant it as a "flaw", but rather an area that if improved would help the beer score better. Ideally good judges will provide those kinds of suggestions and feedback, although unfortunately it's rare. It clearly says "give suggestions for improvement" which the pilsner judge failed to do. If he gave it a 42 then it's not perfect.

 

[Gavin C]

Just curious; did you use a Pils recipe based on mine from the recipe database? We had a chat about the philosophy and methods for true Pilsners in the past and I hope that has helped you. You seem to have picked up on brewing German styles quite well. Congrats on the medals!

Cheers,
TB

Hey Tiber

Reading your Pils recipe sure was useful and looking at it again very similar to my own.

The grain bill is unsurprisingly similar as you would expect in a Pils. Not a whole lot of wiggle room in what can essentially be a single malt recipe. A smidge of melanoiden and acid malt (I use some in near every recipe owing to my full volume mashing)

Same yeast too. I bought a vial of WLP833 and used it for all my lagers till it eventually crapped out on me after 5 batches. This Pilsner was the last batch I made with it. Really like that yeast.

I made another Pils with 34/70 and it's not as good I think. No Melanoiden malt on that one but did use a single decoction. Still a tasty beer.

As with all my lagers I used a step mash. (Just infusions to full volume this time followed by a direct heating to mash-out)
Not sure how that compares to your profile. I targeted pH 5.45 which is also similar (probably the same within the margin of error) to your own.

The hop bill was similar to yours but I used a mix of Hallertauer and Saaz. The Saaz really worked well which is surprising given that it's not typical of the style.

Water was built from 90% RO.

My fermentation profile was different to yours. I kegged it three weeks after brewing. Lagered at 1C till it was ready. (4 weeks lagering IIRC and it had hit its stride)

OG and FG were identical to yours. 1.047 and 1.008 respectively

In short. I learned a ton from your great recipe and the many gems of knowledge you have thrown around in HBT especially WRT brewing lagers and lighter beers. Thanks again mate.

 

[Tiber_Brew]

Looks good, Gavin. Great job on execution. These beers are almost entirely process beers, given their simplicity in the ingredients. You're keeping that aspect pretty controlled, and it's paying off. Cheers!

 

[jwalk4]

Hey Gavin,

How do you manage your mineral additions when step mashing via infusion? Do you have to acidity any of the infusion water?

Thanks, and happy Easter!

 

[Gavin C]

Hey Gavin,

How do you manage your mineral additions when step mashing via infusion? Do you have to acidity any of the infusion water?

Thanks, and happy Easter!

Hey Jwalk

Happy Easter to you too mate.

I treat all the water at the outset. Infusions are not like sparge water in that they do not need to be acidified. They are mash water and treated as such.
____________________________________________
This is just a copy and paste from my step mashing thread which covers that in bit more detail

• The full water volume is collected in the boil-kettle.
• Minerals are added to target the desired water profile.
• Sodium metabisulfite/ Potassium metabisulfite is added to eliminate chloramines and chlorine.
• A measured volume of water is drawn off to a second pot: the HLT.
• The volume in the HLT is calculated to provide all the water needed for infusions and any planned sparge. (I typically do not incorporate a sparge step into my brewing.)
• The water in the HLT is brought to a boil and a simmer maintained with the lid on.
• Strike water is heated to target and dough-in completed as normal hitting the first rest temperature.
• Pre-calculated volumes of the collected boiling water are added to the main mash, heating it to the next planned rest temperature.
• The mash is stirred thoroughly while adding the hot water to ensure homogeneity and representative temperature readings.

Hope that helps. Let me know if there is anything you want clarified.

 

[jwalk4]

Crystal clear!

 

[TopherM]

Second round, same judge, 32/50 and the were issues with the beer.

If this was a BJCP competition, the 2nd round doesn't have scores. just general feedback and ranking among the other beers in the flight. Also, the 2nd round is typically the most experienced judges, so it's not uncommon for them to give more accurate feedback than the 1st round.

 

[Gavin C]

If this was a BJCP competition, the 2nd round doesn't have scores. just general feedback and ranking among the other beers in the flight. Also, the 2nd round is typically the most experienced judges, so it's not uncommon for them to give more accurate feedback than the 1st round.

I guess you're trying to quote @Texaswine but I'll chime in as I know this not to be the case. (I am only speaking for this particular comp which is very large. I have no idea what the convention is for others)

It was a BJCP competition. Biggest one in the state of Texas. Scores were given in both 1st and 2nd rounds.

Beers received 2 scores in the first and if they advanced, 2 scores in the second round.

(4 score sheets were returned for any beers that reached the second round)

 

[TexasWine]

I guess you're trying to quote @Texaswine but I'll chime in as I know this not to be the case. (I am only speaking for this particular comp which is very large. I have no idea what the convention is for others)

It was a BJCP competition. Biggest one in the state of Texas. Scores were given in both 1st and 2nd rounds.

Beers received 2 scores in the first and if they advanced, 2 scores in the second round.

(4 score sheets were returned for any beers that reached the second round)

Yup, exactly. It's up to the organizers of the competition to decide if they want to do score sheets in both rounds. This one they did. That's how I knew it was the same judge who provided two wildly different scores for the exact same beer.

 

[BroStefan]

A few times when I've judged and then did MBOS a beer that I judged in the first time had changed radically. In one case beer was probably mishandled by the stewards. In the other one - a klosch - huge buttery diacetyl had emerged.

 

[jwalk4]

A few times when I've judged and then did MBOS a beer that I judged in the first time had changed radically. In one case beer was probably mishandled by the stewards. In the other one - a klosch - huge buttery diacetyl had emerged.

Strange that this would be the case though. I have heard of diacetyl formation happening post bottling, but only in the form of a pediococcus infection.

 

[BroStefan]

I believe it works like this. If The precursors were not boiled off they'd begin to form diacetyl when the bottle warmed up. I've bottled lagers that were fine only to find butter when its opened.

 

[TexasWine]

A few times when I've judged and then did MBOS a beer that I judged in the first time had changed radically. In one case beer was probably mishandled by the stewards. In the other one - a klosch - huge buttery diacetyl had emerged.

Gavin, sorry this is off topic.

The thing with my stout was the comments were essentially identical between the two rounds for that one judge. No flaws. He just decided it deserved a lower score.

I've got the same beer entered into the Lunar Rendezbrew and Cactus Challenge. We'll see what kind of feedback I get there as well.

 

[Gavin C]

Gavin, sorry this is off topic.

Not off topic at all TW. No worries whatsoever.

________________________________________________

Brewed up another IPA few weeks ago. 15oz of hops in this one. A little Carafa III special to play with the color.

Some of the hops used


Cascade, Centennial and Citra hops.

Tasty IPA ~6.7% ABV

My biggest Beer Yet OG 1.065 Color 10.4 SRM ~76 IBU

 

[Gavin C]

This is another recent brew.

A second effort a a German Pilsner I outlined earlier. Single decoction, Pilsner malt and some acid malt for pH adjustment. Single hop: Tettnanger.

Very enjoyable, crisp refreshing beer. great for a sunny evening in Texas

OG 1.047 FG 1.009 IBU ~36



*incorrect glassware

 

[Tiber_Brew]

Beautiful! Do you prefer Tett over Hallertau for a Pils?

 

[Gavin C]

Beautiful! Do you prefer Tett over Hallertau for a Pils?

I really am not sure . Only made two Pils so far. The current one is a single hop Tett and the other was Hallertau and Saaz. Sazz for the later additions gave a subtle floral element that was enjoyable.

The Tettnanger rather than the Saaz seems more typical of German Pils (in my ridiculously inexperienced experience), particularly as it ages.

The bigger difference for me is in the yeast I think. WLP833 would be my preference over 34/70

More Pils and experimentation planned. This OG/FG is right on the mark though. I'll not use 34/70 again.

Next one I'm planing all Tettnanger but increasing the IBUs a bit, WLP833, infusion step mash and a whisper of melanoiden (~1%) as a mockcoction.

 

[Tiber_Brew]

Saaz, Tett, and Hallertau are all beautiful hops. I think a mixture of Hallertau and Saaz work very well for something like a Kölsch or Alt. I also think Hallertau and Tett blend well together for a Pils or Helles, too.

Keep it up!

 

[Gavin C]

Brewed a Dunkel up last Saturday. A hybrid step mash with a single decoction

Here are some random related pictures. Finished as planned. Kegging it in a couple of days where it will lager and carbonate at 33°F

Soft Water


Grain Bill


Decoction

Cold Break


Transfer to FV


OG and FG

 

[Finlandbrews]

Brewed a Dunkel up last Saturday. A hybrid step mash with a single decoction

Here are some random related pictures. Finished as planned. Kegging it in a couple of days where it will lager and carbonate at 33°F

Soft Water
View attachment 353177

Grain Bill
View attachment 353179

Cold Break
View attachment 353175

Transfer to FV
View attachment 353176

OG and FG
View attachment 353178

Gavin, what technique do you use to aerate your wort before pitching?

 

[Gavin C]

Gavin, what technique do you use to aerate your wort before pitching?

90 seconds of oxygen at enough volume to generate a little simmer of bubbles at the beer's surface

~$10 O2 tank from welding supply in hardware store

Diffusion stone close up (wand and reg were ~$50

 

[Finlandbrews]

90 seconds of oxygen at enough volume to generate a little simmer of bubbles at the beer's surface

~$10 O2 tank from welding supply in hardware store

Diffusion stone close up (wand and reg were ~$50

That looks so easy to use and is cheap in USA but seems like it is not an option in Europe because it's not sold or because too expensive... I think I'll have to go with another technique unless I can import these oxygen bottles from USA? Is the aquarium pump the next thing to go with if no oxygen bottle possible?

 

[wilserbrewer]

Is the aquarium pump the next thing to go with if no oxygen bottle possible?

I always thought the aquarium pump a mediocre solution at best since your just pumping air and not O2.

Fwiw I recently got tired of manually aerating with a wisk and fixed a portion of a plastic clothes hanger in a high speed drill. Not as good as an O2 tank but seems to workView attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1462667642.832435.jpg

 

[Gavin C]

My latest lager turned out nicely. I stuck with this soft water profile (similar to Munich Boiled) for today's brew. Another German Pilsner.

Dunkel


Todays Pils

 

[Tobinn]

I realize that you're not expecting a reply and one at this late date past your posting may very well cause you to blow out a well-earned swig of home brew but damn the torpedoes and full steam ahead! I, too, use a BIAB method although decidedly less scientifically driven that your set up. Plus, I have an electric range and can't bring anything more than about four gallons to a boil so I do 2.5 gal batches. I live in a small house so this works out well for me (I use, no laughing, several Mr. Beer fermentors - love'em; just the right size and easy to store). I would love to get your specs on the Hopperator 1000 you've got a pic of. the three bolt plastic jobber. I don't have the head or patience for iodine, ph yada, yada, yada (I just use bottled spring water and hope for the best) but that is freakin' genius. I reckon I could figure it out but I'm also lazy and don't believe in reinventing the wheel if I don't have to. Any advice on that little gizmo would be much appreciated!! Thanks much,

Mark

Ooops - I see lots of responses - I'll go back and see if there's any details on that little Hopperator 1000 (you can use the name if you want; no charge )

 

[normonster]

I realize that you're not expecting a reply and one at this late date past your posting may very well cause you to blow out a well-earned swig of home brew but damn the torpedoes and full steam ahead! I, too, use a BIAB method although decidedly less scientifically driven that your set up. Plus, I have an electric range and can't bring anything more than about four gallons to a boil so I do 2.5 gal batches. I live in a small house so this works out well for me (I use, no laughing, several Mr. Beer fermentors - love'em; just the right size and easy to store). I would love to get your specs on the Hopperator 1000 you've got a pic of. the three bolt plastic jobber. I don't have the head or patience for iodine, ph yada, yada, yada (I just use bottled spring water and hope for the best) but that is freakin' genius. I reckon I could figure it out but I'm also lazy and don't believe in reinventing the wheel if I don't have to. Any advice on that little gizmo would be much appreciated!! Thanks much,

Mark

Ooops - I see lots of responses - I'll go back and see if there's any details on that little Hopperator 1000 (you can use the name if you want; no charge )

haha!! like 30 pages of 'em!! made my day man.