PicoBrew Zymatic

[stonebrewer]

Brewing again today, a Vienna Lager based on a John Palmer recipe...had no issues with startup this time like the last time.,,maybe there was air in the RIMS and I brewed it out last session? Anyhow, really happy to have one in the fermenter and another in process!

 

[Mylo]

Well, I got jiggy with my Zymatic and refilled the glycol line. It actually heats now! It must have took 6-8 oz of glycol.

Now, the next step is to find out where the wort is leaking from. The pool of cleaning solution is very big on my bench top. It’s level. I can’t tell if it’s from splashing, stepper alignment, or just a leaky fluid arm. It seems to be coming out the side.

Mylo

 

[Mylo]

@Mike Howard do you have a tool or procedure for checking / adjusting the stepper arm alignment?

 

[Mike Howard]

I don't. I had always planned on it, but got too wrapped up in other projects. I can tell you that it is fairly easy using the Test Menu and just adjusting the set screw for the home position. Align it by eye first and then make small tweaks to fine tune it. The Zym uses an alignment disc so you really only have to adjust the HOME position. Check out the Zymatic Thread and just search for "stepper arm", you should find posts where I talk about the leak I had. There are some pics in there also. Let me know if you run into any problems. The only caution I'll give you is to pay close attention to how the disc comes apart with little plastic washers/spacers.

 

[Mike Howard]

FYI: Stepper Arm Rebuild LINKBACK

 

[Mylo]

I don't. I had always planned on it, but got too wrapped up in other projects. I can tell you that it is fairly easy using the Test Menu and just adjusting the set screw for the home position. Align it by eye first and then make small tweaks to fine tune it. The Zym uses an alignment disc so you really only have to adjust the HOME position. Check out the Zymatic Thread and just search for "stepper arm", you should find posts where I talk about the leak I had. There are some pics in there also. Let me know if you run into any problems. The only caution I'll give you is to pay close attention to how the disc comes apart with little plastic washers/spacers.

Is the "home" position the "mash in" position?

 

[Mike Howard]

Yes. Straight out the front. If you enter Test mode you can cycle through the stops.

 

[Mylo]

Ok. That's just a janky system for sealing... Looks like the fluid arm has a tube embedded inside the stainless - and there is a little silicone donut on the downtube to mate with it and with a bunch of goo on it it to fill in the air gaps. Why didn't they put an o-ring in there. I might have to redesign that after I get this thing working.

@Mike Howard So the goo you recommend is the Hayes 80S Lubri-Film vs regular keg lube - because it's a little more viscous, I assume? I repurposed some of the existing blob, and topped it off with keg lube. It slowed the leak down, but it still isn't holding back enough. I guess I'll pick up some Hayes.


Mylo

 

[Mike Howard]

Hayes Lubri-Film has a better sealing quality IMO and is designed for the restaurant industry.

 

[Mylo]

Well, still no love. I got the Hayes goop, and "packed" the area between the inner hose and the white ring. Then I applied some downward pressure to seat the 1/4" tube into its cradle. Excess goop pushed out the top, which I dressed with my finger. And then packed some more above it, just for good measure.

I did get a seal during a clean for about 15 minutes (until it lost connection to SBC and just STOPPED the cleaning job). This was late last night, so I just drained the machine and went to bed. This morning, I tried a cleaning session with Chief Wiggam's. While there were no leaks above the black plastic "U", there were leaks below, onto the optical ring, and eventually onto the top of the step filter.

Any leaks up there are basically unacceptable to me. The janky sealing system has to be improved. I think I'm going to try adding a collet to add a little compression above the white silicone, first. This should mate the ring tighter to the inner tube, and maybe bulge it out to seal better against the stainless outer wall. And if that doesn't work, I'm going to replace the white piece with something with o-rings.

Unfortunately, there is not a lot of vertical clearance for this compression collet before the 90 degree radius bend of the 1/4" starts, so I will probably have to make a taller "lower cradle" to raise the whole "inner arm" up about 3/16". That's as much vertical clearance I have before the inner arm touches the top cover. Stay tuned and wish me luck!


Milo

 

[Mike Howard]

Well, still no love. I got the Hayes goop, and "packed" the area between the inner hose and the white ring. Then I applied some downward pressure to seat the 1/4" tube into its cradle. Excess goop pushed out the top, which I dressed with my finger. And then packed some more above it, just for good measure.

I did get a seal during a clean for about 15 minutes (until it lost connection to SBC and just STOPPED the cleaning job). This was late last night, so I just drained the machine and went to bed. This morning, I tried a cleaning session with Chief Wiggam's. While there were no leaks above the black plastic "U", there were leaks below, onto the optical ring, and eventually onto the top of the step filter.

Any leaks up there are basically unacceptable to me. The janky sealing system has to be improved. I think I'm going to try adding a collet to add a little compression above the white silicone, first. This should mate the ring tighter to the inner tube, and maybe bulge it out to seal better against the stainless outer wall. And if that doesn't work, I'm going to replace the white piece with something with o-rings.

Unfortunately, there is not a lot of vertical clearance for this compression collet before the 90 degree radius bend of the 1/4" starts, so I will probably have to make a taller "lower cradle" to raise the whole "inner arm" up about 3/16". That's as much vertical clearance I have before the inner arm touches the top cover. Stay tuned and wish me luck!


Milo

I've never seen the type of leak you are seeing once the stepper arm has been rebuilt and lubed. Maybe the silicon tubing is damaged/wrong size/deformed/shrunk/etc... There shouldn't be any backpressure on that arm to force wort up and out of the stepper arm seal. I assume the answer is yes, but I gotta ask if the wort arm is completely clear and nothing is blocking it?

 

[Mylo]

I've never seen the type of leak you are seeing once the stepper arm has been rebuilt and lubed. Maybe the silicon tubing is damaged/wrong size/deformed/shrunk/etc... There shouldn't be any backpressure on that arm to force wort up and out of the stepper arm seal. I assume the answer is yes, but I gotta ask if the wort arm is completely clear and nothing is blocking it?

The fluid arm is completely clear. I ran some pipe cleaners in there. The silicone ring is not cracked or deformed. But you can see in the first picture that there is quite a bit of room between the silicone in its relaxed form and the stainless tubing that must be "taken up" by the lube. At best, it didn't leak at all. But that second cycle in the new morning, you could see a small bubble of liquid push through the lube and start to puddle up. I think with my collet that I can compress that silicone just enough to bulge it out so it contacts both the inside tube, and takes up that .005" and contacts the outer tube.

 

[Mike Howard]

Yea, that's a first for me. I wonder if this one was just a bad apple. Once you get a fix try to publish exactly what you did with part numbers and where you purchased the part. Might help someone else down the line. Good luck.

 

[Mylo]

Yea, that's a first for me. I wonder if this one was just a bad apple. Once you get a fix try to publish exactly what you did with part numbers and where you purchased the part. Might help someone else down the line. Good luck.

Well, I think I cracked the code... I'll talk through the photos from left to right. First proto parts were a bust. The radius was just too tight to get the parts to sit flush. I raised the second block as much as I could, and also thinned it out so it wasn't affected by the radius of the tube. I squeezed a few extra millimeters by countersinking the screw heads. The third picture is my collet, clamped on the to keep the silicone tube from moving vertical once locked in. Fourth picture is that whole piece lubed up. Fifth picture is the tube seated. Note there is still a couple of millimeters for the 1/4" tube to move down, compressing the silicone tube against the black "inner" tube" inside the stainless. Sixth picture is fully clamped. And the eight picture is me celebrating with a Guiness, that there is no leaks (for now, and hopefully not for quite some time).

I will post the .STL files to Thingiverse for anyone that wants to print them. I used PETG, because it's just a little more heat resistant than PLA.


Mylo

 

[stpauliboy]

Does anyone know if you can factory reset a Z machine. Or is there a way to unregister a machine from my Picobrew account? I am retiring my 2 Z's but want to continue to be able to access my kegsmart as long as the website functions.

 

[Mutant]

Does anyone know if you can factory reset a Z machine. Or is there a way to unregister a machine from my Picobrew account? I am retiring my 2 Z's but want to continue to be able to access my kegsmart as long as the website functions.

Good question. I plan on dropping my two machines off to be recycled at the dump in the next month or so.

 

[soulp]

@Mike Howard can I get a copy of the glycol instructions. Attempting to resurrect my Zymatic before I decide to give it away. It's been sitting still for ~2 years and I get error code #1 attempting to clean. Would the glycol also be the reason it doesn't pull any water from the keg?

 

[Mylo]

@Mike Howard Would the glycol also be the reason it doesn't pull any water from the keg?

No, that sounds like a pump problem. Maybe some particulate or dried wort keeping the head from priming. You could force some hot water through it with a large syringe, and see if you can get the diaphragm clean enough to start working and then give it a PBW deep clean (spare the filter basket).

Mylo

 

[Mike Howard]

@Mike Howard can I get a copy of the glycol instructions. Attempting to resurrect my Zymatic before I decide to give it away. It's been sitting still for ~2 years and I get error code #1 attempting to clean. Would the glycol also be the reason it doesn't pull any water from the keg?

I PM'd you

 

[soulp]

No, that sounds like a pump problem. Maybe some particulate or dried wort keeping the head from priming. You could force some hot water through it with a large syringe, and see if you can get the diaphragm clean enough to start working and then give it a PBW deep clean (spare the filter basket).

Mylo

Thanks for the response!

Would you happen to have any instructions or pictures on where to find the pump and where to insert the water?

 

[Mylo]

You might have to take the machine apart to really clean the pump - but I would start by putting some hot water in your keg, and maybe pressuring it with a little CO2 to push it through the pump. Once you get it flowing, you can depressurize it, and add some PBW. I have heard that the original polycarbonate plastic doesn't like to be exposed to PBW, so you might want to attach a hose to the stainless arm, and route it back to the keg during this cleaning process.

 

[user 348951]

There are numerous reasons you can get a Fatal Error #1, most likely introduced air into the suction line, followed by glycol. So it's always best to assume the easy ones first before digging back into the lower end.

Just to be sure, take your poppets, on both the keg and the connections, apart and check for obstructions. Also, recheck the filter. Make sure all the seals are good as I've found that they eventually go bad.

After that, put the machine in test mode and check for good pump circulation and temperature probe function. During cycling make sure you don't have any air leaks on the suction side. Use the "Test Keg Pump" and the "Test Drain Pump" when using a keg with at least a couple of gallons of water in there and no grains but all the screens.

To enter Test Mode, turn the machine off, then depress AND HOLD the rotary knob and turn the power back on. Wait until you see the logo and then release the rotary knob. To exit Test Mode just turn the machine off.

Hello Mike,
I have a zymatic that hasnt been used in a few years. When I try run a clean cycle or just the cisculate from the test menu, the machine will

There are numerous reasons you can get a Fatal Error #1, most likely introduced air into the suction line, followed by glycol. So it's always best to assume the easy ones first before digging back into the lower end.

Just to be sure, take your poppets, on both the keg and the connections, apart and check for obstructions. Also, recheck the filter. Make sure all the seals are good as I've found that they eventually go bad.

After that, put the machine in test mode and check for good pump circulation and temperature probe function. During cycling make sure you don't have any air leaks on the suction side. Use the "Test Keg Pump" and the "Test Drain Pump" when using a keg with at least a couple of gallons of water in there and no grains but all the screens.

To enter Test Mode, turn the machine off, then depress AND HOLD the rotary knob and turn the power back on. Wait until you see the logo and then release the rotary knob. To exit Test Mode just turn the machine off.

Hello Mike,
I am reaching out for help. I have a zymatic that hanst been used in a couple of years and it seems that the the keg pump is not working. Tried running the rinse cycle, cisculating from the test menu and the in tube sucks all the water out, but nothing is being pump into the machine. I am not technical, but any help is much appreciated. Thank you.

 

[Greg R]

Hey all, been a while since I've checked in on this- can someone link me to the raspberry pi solution or a PC based solution? I haven't tried to brew recently but want to run a cleaning cycle and make sure it's good to go. If the server is still running that's great, but- I also picked up a used Zy and don't have the password so I'm hoping it'll work with a local machine solution.

Thanks,

Greg

 

[day_trippr]

I believe all roads lead to this Github page...

https://github.com/hotzenklotz/picobrew-server

 

[Mike Silverton]

>First picture is my glycol fill tube, second is my bottle to top it off, third is Zymatic in a cleaning cycle.

@stonebrewer So I'm clear. The air will naturally rise up the tube and you "burp" it occasionally?

Thanks, Mike