I Want Maltiness!! Irish Red Recipe Help

[HollywoodTK]

Hi All,

I've brewed I think 6 batches so far, mostly partial mash or steeping, I've followed a couple recipes, and modified a few others. I like hoppy/bitter beers, but even the batches I've tried to bring out the malty profile in have turned out on the bitter end of the spectrum.

I'm looking to create a very malt-forward, rich, full, Irish Red ale. I have been looking through lots of recipes, and this is what I've come up with so far. All critiques are welcome.

Batch Size: 2.5 gallons
Yeast: Wyeast 1084 - Irish Ale yeast (also considered 1335 British Ale for the flocculation)

Fermentables:
3 lb Dry Malt Extract - Light 81.4%
4 oz American - Caramel / Crystal 80L 6.8%
2 oz American - Caramel / Crystal 120L 3.4%
2 oz German - Munich Light 3.4%
2 oz German - Caramel Pils 3.4%
1 oz American - Roasted Barley 1.7%

Hops:
.5 oz East Kent Goldings @ 60 mins
.5 oz East Kent Goldings @ 10 mins

Add 1 tsp Irish Moss @ 10 mins

I'll steep the grains and barley in 6 quarts of water at 150-152 for 40 mins, then "sparge" with 2 quarts @ ~175 F to bring the boil volume to 2 gallons.

What do you guys think? I don't mind it being dark, but will the Crystal 120 and 80 be too dark in conjunction with the Roasted Barley? I want a nice full mouthfeel and thick head.

What are your thoughts?

 

[dcp27]

i think your color is going to be about perfect for an irish red. i would make a few minor changes to the recipe tho. 2oz of munich light is going to have very lil impact, since you are going for very malt forward i'd swap it for melanoidin or aromatic, and maybe add an extra oz or 2. the carapils is a waste, its already in the DME and regular crystal has the same effect. may wanna try 2-4oz of flaked barley in its place, makes for great mouthfeel & head. I would also cut back on the late EKG add, 0.5oz is fairly hoppy for an irish red and will detract from maltiness

depending on your water profile, you could also try adding a few grams of CaCl to accentuate the malt as well.

 

[HollywoodTK]

Ok, but if I add the flaked barley, I'm going to have to add some base malt (maybe some 6 row?) to convert the starches, no?

If I go that route, how about this:
Since I'm only doing 2.5 gallons and my grain bill is quite low, I can do a tiny side-mash with
- 4 oz of 6 Row
- 2 oz Flaked Barley

"mash" that in a small muslin bag in .75 qt water at ~153 for 50 mins.

While that's converting, I can add:
4 oz crystal 80L
2 oz crystal 120L
4 oz munich (or, which melanoidin would you suggest?)
1 oz Roasted Barley

to a muslin bag in 5 qt of 153 F water for 45 mins.

I'll then rinse the mini-mini mash with .25 qts of 170F, and subsequently rinse the specialty grains with 2 qt of the same temperature water. Bringing my total volume up to 2 gallons for boiling.

OR.... is the Munich enough of a "base malt" to convert the flaked barley?

Thoughts?

 

[jmccraney]

Munich doesn't have the diastatic power to convert much more than itself, so if you're going to do a mini-mash, I would keep the 6-row (or Marris Otter? the enzymes in any pale malt will be sufficient). If you do go the mini-mash route, you can mash all those grains together at ~150, no need to segregate the flaked barley and base malts. And don't be afraid to do the mini-mash; brewing is a pretty robust process, and the malt extract will act as an extra buffer to steady the body of your beer if the mash doesn't go perfectly.

I recently brewed an Irish red as well. I won't go into too much detail in this post, but you check out the recipe and tasting notes here. Credit goes to Jamil Zainasheff for the recipe, one of my favorites so far. Remember that Irish red, while malt driven, is not a particularly bold style. It's all about balance. If you're looking for something really malty, I would probably just drop the Irish appellation, pump up the malts and carry on.

The Munich or melanoidin (never used this one) I think will be a good addition, but the flaked barley certainly doesn't have that "malty" flavor. The creamy mouthfeel is wonderful, but it's more of a vanilla milkshake creamy than a malted milk creamy I guess.

My last piece of advice is to note the color of your roast malt. They all work, but different maltsters toast to varying degrees. I ended up having to sub in 500L roast barley for 350L so I dropped the amount. If you want to come back to the recipe later, it's good to know exactly what you used.

 

[HollywoodTK]

Wow, I didn't see that recipe before I started mine, but they're almost exact! (except, of course, that that recipe is AG) The only major difference I see is that that recipe uses Crystal 40, where I have 80. I think I'll drop my 80 down to 60.

I didn't think Munich was really capable of converting the flaked barley, but good point on doing them all together. I think I'll forgo the flaked barley for now, though, after some thought.

Thanks for the advice on the roasted malt, I've been trying to be scientific in my process to learn more about how each ingredient affects the beer, so this is good advice that I hadn't known.

 

[jmccraney]

Cool, happy to help. Interested to hear how it turns out!