Quantcast

I got shut down - no more outdoor brewing

HomeBrewTalk.com - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Community.

Help Support Homebrew Talk:

The Pol

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2007
Messages
11,390
Reaction score
116
Electric is fairly cheap... and it is very convenient.
 

SOB

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2006
Messages
924
Reaction score
7
Location
Delaware, OH
$70 a year, that is cheap. How many units in your association? I pay well over $1k a year but we are a small association of 7 units, one property/building. We maintain our own private pool though.
Jersey vs outside of Columbus, Ohio maybe? I think the Cost of Living is a little less. PLus this isnt a real classy area or anything. There's...I dunno...200 single family homes here? I see people technically breaking the "rules" all the time but no one gives a crap! We still have a VERY nice community, no crime, all the houses are under 10 years old, and everyone just minds their business. Unless that damn neighbor dog comes over here again, then I'm pulling out my AR-50 like that dude from AZ said!!!

That's still a direct violation of the same rule he's breaking. He's less likely to get caught, but you're still violating the same law while not standing up for yourself. But that's more important to some than others.
Do you NEED to stand up for yourself?! Let your pride\manliness go for a few minutes and RDWHAHB! That's what I say...there's much more to worry about than proving a point to something that could give a $hit less anyways. If no one sees you, you have nothing to worry about. Now, I'm not saying wear all black and hide in the bushes, just keep the garage door open a foot or two (this should keep the top open to help exhaust) and do your thing! That's what I do in the winter to keep some heat in.

:mug:
 

pen25

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
972
Reaction score
3
Location
tulsa, ok
I got a call from my homeowners association this weekend. In the message the woman says somethign to the afftect of "some people have noticed you brewing... something in the garage. Whatever it is, I think it's probably against fire safety laws and we'd like you to stop."
I called up my local fire dept this morning to get some info, and, indeed, an open flame within 10 feet of a structure is not allowed in a townhome setting like ours. He didn't say it was illegal, but if an inspector saw it they would make me stop.
I do not have a private yard large enough that would keep me 10 ft from a wall or fence, which means I'm moving operations indoors. Which means 2.5-3 gal batches since our stove sucks. Which means my banjo cooker and 20 gallon Blichmann are essencially useless to me until we move. This f'n BLOWS!
sounds like youll be going electric.
 

Zul'jin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2008
Messages
664
Reaction score
25
Location
South of most States
Useful reply.
Go electric either indoors or outdoors.
If your electric stove can't do the volume of wort you want at once and you don't want to buy a stove that can, split your batches.
Find out what exactly is "open flame" and try to make your propane burner not an open flame.

Really useful reply.
*%^& CODE ENFORCEMENT!
 

Christian

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2008
Messages
321
Reaction score
0
Location
Salt Lake City, UT
Go electric so there are no issues with the city and now that you have let the HOA know what you are brewing that will stop the letters. I live in a house but still have an HOA i hate them and their stupid rules.

As far as HOA's go... I've dealt with them for 30 years in Construction and Real Estate. I've seen areas with poor HOA's or no HOA's struggle to keep values up. I've never seen an area with a strict HOA see decreased property values..... in fact it's exactly the opposite. And, that's what they are for when run correctly.
I hate living with an HOA and paying 600 a year to live by their stupid rules. However i do love that even though the neighborhoods surrounding me have the same style and size houses and lots, all built around the same time, my neighborhoods property values are tens of thousands more and that's because of the HOA. I like money and so in that respect i do like the HOA.
 

Figbash

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 26, 2008
Messages
216
Reaction score
1
Location
Michigan
Electricity is a LOT more expensive than propane. Tell whoever is bitching to mind their own damn business. There is no difference between propane burner and a propane grill or turkey fryer. It's amazing how some feel that if someone is doing something a little out of the ordinary, they must be doing something wrong.

Tom
 

The Pol

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2007
Messages
11,390
Reaction score
116
Electricity is a LOT more expensive than propane. Tell whoever is bitching to mind their own damn business. There is no difference between propane burner and a propane grill or turkey fryer. It's amazing how some feel that if someone is doing something a little out of the ordinary, they must be doing something wrong.

Tom

Converting to electric can be more expensive in some cases, but electricity is cheaper to operate than propane, quieter, easier to control, no CO and it doesnt run out in the middle of a boil.
 

GNBrews

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2007
Messages
673
Reaction score
23
Driveway/parking lot is a pretty narrow area that would piss a lot of people off if I were to set up there. They got pissy when we had a garage sale that spilled into that area. Our direct neighbors, the ones we share walls with, don't care. They find it pretty cool, and know another homebrewer in MN. I think the association just doesn't like us very much. They've been giving us a hard time over our dog lately because he has separation anxiety and has a bad day once in a while. At least he doesn't run off leash like some other people's dogs. Grr.

Separation anxiety or not..barking dogs P*** me off too. You owe it to your neighbors to get that problem under control.
 

epimortum

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2008
Messages
93
Reaction score
6
Location
MIddleburg
This is why I'd rather be homeless somewhere in the middle of the Canadian wilderness than live within the confines of a HOA.

It is evident, as others have pointed out, that the "complaint" appears to be made out of pure ignorance as opposed to maleficence. This is reinforced by your comment regarding the lady's response. While you can't cure stupid, you can at least, attempt to raise awareness within your community.

Try starting a neighbourhood brew-club and if there is an outdoor commons area try to utilize that for your brew club's sessions. If you have to rent it, then so be it. While I understand the reasons for the "no open flame" bit; it is defiantly vague and is in need of refinement.

Otherwise, GTFO ASAP and best of luck.

Ohh, and just brew wherever everyone else uses their grills; otherwise going electric might have to keep you over. Also, maybe look into meads and wines which wouldn't require cooking.

Again, best of luck.
 

beerocd

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2008
Messages
696
Reaction score
5
OK this thread got huge. Anyone suggest affixing your banjo to the BBQ grill? It will still be against the rules but who's gonna narc on a BBQ grill? You would have to shut down probably half the subdivision for BBQ'ing. Find a loophole, follow the rules to the letter, piss em all off!

-OCD
 

Larstram

Active Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Messages
25
Reaction score
0
Location
Elizabethton, Tn.
I got fined once for a barbegue grill on my back deck of a condo in the suburbs of Atlanta. 600 bucks. I hated the fact that HOA could tell me what I could do in my own home.
+1 for buy a house with no HOA
 
OP
jacksonbrown

jacksonbrown

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2008
Messages
1,180
Reaction score
8
Location
Madison, WI
Separation anxiety or not..barking dogs P*** me off too. You owe it to your neighbors to get that problem under control.
Don't even start with me about that. Our dog is good, and rarely has issues. But once in a while, ie a hand full of times a year, he has a bad day. It happens.
 
OP
jacksonbrown

jacksonbrown

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2008
Messages
1,180
Reaction score
8
Location
Madison, WI
It's a town house, and we do own it. And we would loved to have been able to afford a SFH, but alas, they were out of our budget.

I was reminded today by my friend who got busted during her garage sale at our place that it was probably the same guy who narked her to the FD that narked me to the HOA. And he's mentally challenged. And he does think he's the neighborhood police. I'm not going to give him sh**.
 

SourHopHead

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2007
Messages
720
Reaction score
2
Location
Albuquerque, NM
HOA Suck. Been on their hit list off and on. Latest infraction was tinfoil on the windows since I work nights. Fixed that problem over the weekend with some nice tint. They always complain about weeds and they never seem to take care of them on the roads/parks like they are supposed too. Just worked on the backyard too and people started b*tching.
 

BlackNotch

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2008
Messages
136
Reaction score
3
Location
Wilmington, DE
I can actually chime in since I am a Fire Marshal in Wilmington, DE. Is your local department paid or volunteer? Check to see who enforces the codes, sometimes it's not the local FD. All jusridictions adopt different codes, I can tell you that the State of Delaware uses the NFPA codes, and this is directly from NFPA 1 "The Unifrom Fire Code"

NFPA 1:10.11.7 For other than one- and two-family dwellings, no hibachi, gas-fired grill, charcoal grill, or other similar devices used for cooking, heating, or any other purpose, shall be used or kindled on any balcony or under any overhanging portion or within 10 ft (3 m) of any structure. Listed electric ranges, grills, or similar electrical apparatus shall be permitted.

PLEASE NOTE: Many condominiums or apartment complexes have regulations on the use of barbecue grills that exceed fire code requirements. Please check with your management staff to see what requirements or exceptions apply to use of grills at your complex.


If you notice, the first sentence states "other than 1 and 2 family dwellings" Our office generally, does not deal with homes, unless there is an actual fire or an obvious issue. Our Licensing and Inspections department handles all single family homes. Your municiaplity should have all codes available online to view.


Just one side note, if they say you can't have it, follow the rules, you don't want to get jammed up with a fine or worse, an arrest.
 

Whisler85

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 4, 2008
Messages
191
Reaction score
1
Location
Lake Bluff, Illinois
well, as much as i agree with everyone who thinks the HOA needs to eat **** and die, thats probably a losing battle- especially if this complainer is mentally challenged, ur gonna look like a really f-ing dick in the end

but dude, you live in madison- if you cant find a brew partner with a single family home or at least no HOA, i feel sorry for you

join a club, make a friend, brew together- just take your **** over there, brew, take your carboys home (or leave them there, keeps you from screwing with them)

i'd say a brew partner with a cool pad is your best bet- and double the brews
 

Eves

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2008
Messages
382
Reaction score
4
Electricity is a LOT more expensive than propane. Tell whoever is bitching to mind their own damn business. There is no difference between propane burner and a propane grill or turkey fryer. It's amazing how some feel that if someone is doing something a little out of the ordinary, they must be doing something wrong.

Tom

Is that true? I mean after the initial cost of the equipment is it really going to cost more to use electricity for a full batch of beer than propane? I suspect if a person lived in an area where electricity rates were higher than the norm then it might be possible. But if you rates aren't outragous I question how it would cost more to use electricity.


Regardless, good luck with your housing association issue.
 

polecreek

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2008
Messages
353
Reaction score
1
Location
montrose co
I would put on my best Alaskan Bush company t-shirt, a pair of holy shorts with my junk hangen on the verge of escape. Set up shop 10.5 feet from the building in the driveway. Put on some AC/DC and brew, all this starting at about 4.30 a.m. A big nasty cigar and a lawn chair would also be a nice touch.
 

epimortum

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2008
Messages
93
Reaction score
6
Location
MIddleburg
Is there any natural gas in your place you could have someone tap into for your?
If the guy does have some mental issues, you'd for sure look like a bit of a plonker and you can't necessarily fault the bugger if its beyond his control.

Again, best of luck.
 

MikeFlynn74

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2007
Messages
3,875
Reaction score
22
Location
ANCHORAGE!!
Freaking Stepford neighborhoods... Where I live, I can do whatever the hell I please, and as long as it isn't in writing somewhere that I can't do it, I'm free.

Then again, I live on a military base, or as I like to call it, a small gated community with armed guards.
what? Ive had friends who have gotten tickets because they didnt pick up the dog poop within 30 seconds of hitting the ground. Or lawn being 1/2" too long. Car parked too close to the line, this was after there was a 12" of snow on the ground
 

beesy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 12, 2008
Messages
747
Reaction score
7
I personally believe it all boils down to this:

If we all took care of all our shXt all the time, there would never be a reason for a condo association or HOA. But we don't, so there is. It's too bad some people take it upon themselves to be little Cartman respect my authority aXXholes, but it's a given in life.

My suggestion:
1) Get a copy of your association's rule book and try to find a "suitable" solution that will still let you use your current equipment
2) Research local fire laws to see if you are breaking any
3) Once familiar with HOA rules and laws, document every time you see someone else breaking them. Of course, don't be one of those dix that reported you, but if you see it out on a walk or something, document it to. My experience tells me they make a lot of dumb axx rules to get a few people on odd things, but if they were applied to everyone all the time, (BBQ grill, etc) all would be piXXed. :rockin:

The world would be a better place if everyone would homebrew!!
 

ceannt

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 20, 2008
Messages
753
Reaction score
10
Location
Martinsburg, WV
Most of what is wrong with the world today are people that are not happy unless they are telling someone else how to live thier lives....
 

JPicasso

Hackbrewer extraordinaire
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Mar 21, 2007
Messages
482
Reaction score
25
Location
Arlington Heights
This thread is huge. I have a different take.

While I believe HOA can be run by neighborhood nazi's, they do have their place. Especially when the action of one person can ruin the lives of those who live around them. If I was particularly shy, and thought someone was frying turkeys in a garage that could threaten my home, I might be inclined to make a call. Turkey fryers are known to be dangerous. Even if you are careful, I think you would not want your neighbor to fire up his turkey fryer in a unit that is attached to yours. I'm not saying your HOA is run by reasonable, well-minded individuals, but the open flame indoors in attached dwellings ban may have some merit. (sorry)

It sounds like the HOA were surprised and relieved that you were only boiling water, not heating up oil to near-flash temperatures, that's probably a good sign. It would probably be wise to bring this fact up if you get any more flak. It also sounds like the HOA does not actually enforce any gas grill use outside of the garages. You could probably easily get away with using your turkey fryer outside when it warms / drys up.

I would seriously look into the electric thing. You'll probably need a couple of heatsticks if you only have access to 120V, otherwise, if your stove is 240, you could make a 240V stick and just plug into your stove outlet. From what I've seen you'll need about 4000-5000 Watts worth of heat to bring 5 gallons to a boil in a reasonable amount of time, and about 1/2 that to keep it rolling. You should be able to do this for less than $150.

Pol has a good thread on his setup in the DIY or Equipment section here.

Good luck and keep brewing! :tank:
 

missing link

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2007
Messages
650
Reaction score
4
Location
Highland, MI
Just do it indoors. I know lots of people who run a tank-fed propane burner indoors for making stews or whatnot (just DON'T fry a turkey or anything indoors). It's not dangerous provided you have a little ventilation and an assurance that nothing will tip the stand over. You can buy a cheap carbon monoxide detector for some assurance.
The heat given off trying to bring wort to a boil will melt, singe or ruin carpet or vinyl flooring directly under the burner. It will kill grass and even make it start smoking. Just ask how I know this!!! Using a powerful burner on anything other than concrete is asking for trouble. I know some of you use them on wood decks with success but I bet that decking is extremely hot.

The rules regarding multifamily dwellings are more stringent so your neighbor can't burn your house down with his grill. In a single family home it is perfectly fine to burn your own house down.

Linc
 

bpugh1975

Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2008
Messages
19
Reaction score
0
Location
Des Moines, IA
I know some of you use them on wood decks with success but I bet that decking is extremely hot.
I brewed one of my first batches on a large wooden deck and after I saw sap oozing and bubbling from a knot in the wood, I decided that maybe I was pushing my luck. I didn't want to cause any damage to my already aging deck.
 

p4ck37p1mp

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 27, 2008
Messages
391
Reaction score
1
Location
Acworth, GA
“Among the natural rights of the colonists are these: First a right to life, secondly to liberty, and thirdly to property; together with the right to defend them in the best manner they can”
--Samuel Adams
Get on the board, get to know the president, bribe your neighbors. All tactics I use to bypass HoA rules all the time. So long as I don't do anything very visible from the street or to degrade my home's value (I do a lot to do the opposite actually) and bringing down community property values it is NOT anyone else's business.

+1 .. to the comment about are all the people grilling getting cease and desist letters? No? Hmm, write a nasty letter back complaining about that.

But only after calling a meeting with those said grillers, have a neighborhood bbq party, bring some home brew, get to know people and tell them the story.

Crazy guy causing problems? Have you, he or others heard of Baker Act? He started **** with me, he'd get Baker Acted until he learned to mind his own business. My personal and property rights come first. Crazy person or not, I have no sympathy for 'rabble rouser' mentality. Point blank, follow the law but the HoA can be battled with a little contemplating, perseverance and sheer will.

I had a crazy neighbor once that we had arrested several times. But that is another story..
 

TommyBoy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2008
Messages
525
Reaction score
5
Location
Greenville
They didn't know. They assumed it's something illegal (likely meth). They sent the note phrasing it as a "fire hazard" issue to avoid confronting a "potentially dangerous drug dealer" about his illegal activity. The whole note reads like a "wink, wink" sort of "we know you're doing something illegal, we'll pretend it's a fire hazard thing to get you to knock it off without bringing the cops into our neighborhood but if you don't comply we'll have to get them involved".
You can't assume that this was the actual cause of the complaint. You don't know what they are thinking. :confused:

And what had you pinpoint meth as the drug? :rolleyes:

If someone thought you were manufacturing meth at your home in a neighborhood you would definitely have an officer at your place questioning you asap.
 

Bobby_M

Vendor and Brewer
HBT Sponsor
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Messages
25,067
Reaction score
3,935
Location
Whitehouse Station
If the HOA has officially (via written notice) demanded cease and desist on the garage propane burner and you later burn the entire building down, you can be sure the insurance company is going to sue you personally for damages.
 

llazy_llama

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2009
Messages
2,832
Reaction score
92
Location
Rapid City, South Dakota
what? Ive had friends who have gotten tickets because they didnt pick up the dog poop within 30 seconds of hitting the ground. Or lawn being 1/2" too long. Car parked too close to the line, this was after there was a 12" of snow on the ground
Depends on the base and the specific rules of that housing agency. Here, things are laid back and I get away with a lot more. Plus, it's an Air Force base, not an Army or Marine Corps base. :fro:
 

iamjonsharp

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2006
Messages
576
Reaction score
21
Location
Cincinnati, OH
LP-gas burners having a LP-gas container with a water capacity greater than 2.5 pounds (1.14 kg)
[nominal 1 pound (0.454 kg) LP-gas capacity] shall not be located on combustible balconies or within 10
feet (3048 mm) of combustible construction.
Figure out how to run your propane burner off of extremely tiny propane tanks.
:cross:
 
Top