Help with first original bohemian pils recipe

[Tommydee]

My first lager, a Munich Helles, was a great success, but kicked last week. Going bohemian pils to be ready late summer.
Let me know what you think:

Batch size ~5 gallon BIAB
Water- RO with Kai pils profile (used on helles, and was great!)
9 lb weyermann floor malted bohemian pils
1 lb cara pils

Step mash- protein rest at 120 for 20 minutes, then 151 for 60 min, 168 mash out. Cant be bothered with decoction, hope the cara pils solve some that.

75 minute boil (60 or 90?)

Northern brewer at 60
Saaz at 30
Saaz at 10
Saaz at 5

Hop Amounts tbd to achieve 40 ibu according to beersmith with 20 coming from the NB addition

Yeast- wlp800, 2L starter.should I consider saflager s 23? Other yeasts?

Fermentation-(conservative brulosophy method) 50 for 7 days, free rise to 65 for 7 days, 69 diiacetyl rest for 3 days, cold crash for 3 days at 32, keg, carb to13 lb at 38 F, drink in 2 weeks.

I'll skip the gelatin this time so I can share with a few vegetarian friends. (Is my cold crash long enough prior to kegging?)

I want a nice pils that tastes something like PU before it started to suck, and/or Budweiser/budvar. Don't care if it's a clone, just want it to taste like a good Czech pilsner.

Thoughts on the weyerman malt? Maybe I just stick with Saaz only hopping? Yeast choice?

 

[Lefou]

Yeast choices?
WLP 802 or Wyeast 2000 liquid yeast, if available.
I see you're in Jersey.
Love2Brew has WLP800 and WLP802, but is currently out of W2000 ... but has Pilsner Urquell yeast in stock. I've frequented the New Brunswick store past Rutgers, but don't want to drive into Paterson/Passaic - not my kinda turf even on a good day.

Weyermann malt opinion? I've used it and I like it, and see nothing wrong with your hop schedule if that's your preference.

 

[GoeHaarden]

You may want to take a gander at this thread. Supposedly this recipe will mimic authentic PU, without decoctions. Not true to style, but taste is what we're after anyways so who cares. Haven't tried it myself but it's on the list...

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=333411

 

[Tommydee]

You may want to take a gander at this thread. Supposedly this recipe will mimic authentic PU, without decoctions. Not true to style, but taste is what we're after anyways so who cares. Haven't tried it myself but it's on the list...

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php

Thanks for the tip. For some reason the link is not working. If this is the recipe with the rye malt and oat, where you have to toast the pilsner, it seems a bit complex/too many ingredients for my first ever pils. Maybe I'll try that after a simpler recipe.

Yes, I will be picking this grainbill up at L2brew New Brunswick, so I might ask them to make the final yeast selection for me. I could also just grab their Czech pils allgrain kit, but that would be no fun.

 

[BigEd]

My first lager, a Munich Helles, was a great success, but kicked last week. Going bohemian pils to be ready late summer.
Let me know what you think:

Batch size ~5 gallon BIAB
Water- RO with Kai pils profile (used on helles, and was great!)
9 lb weyermann floor malted bohemian pils
1 lb cara pils

Step mash- protein rest at 120 for 20 minutes, then 151 for 60 min, 168 mash out. Cant be bothered with decoction, hope the cara pils solve some that.

75 minute boil (60 or 90?)

Northern brewer at 60
Saaz at 30
Saaz at 10
Saaz at 5

Hop Amounts tbd to achieve 40 ibu according to beersmith with 20 coming from the NB addition

Yeast- wlp800, 2L starter.should I consider saflager s 23? Other yeasts?

Fermentation-(conservative brulosophy method) 50 for 7 days, free rise to 65 for 7 days, 69 diiacetyl rest for 3 days, cold crash for 3 days at 32, keg, carb to13 lb at 38 F, drink in 2 weeks.

I'll skip the gelatin this time so I can share with a few vegetarian friends. (Is my cold crash long enough prior to kegging?)

I want a nice pils that tastes something like PU before it started to suck, and/or Budweiser/budvar. Don't care if it's a clone, just want it to taste like a good Czech pilsner.

Thoughts on the weyerman malt? Maybe I just stick with Saaz only hopping? Yeast choice?

I'm a decoction mash advocate but a step mash isn't necessary here. The malt may be "slightly under-modified" compared to other malts but it's still well enough modified to mash with a single infusion The step-infusion mash it not going to add any flavor unlike a decoction step mash. If you want to do one you can, I'd suggest moving up the first temp to 128-130F for the initial 20 minute rest.

10% CaraPils seems like a lot. Half of that would be plenty IMO. BTW CaraPils won't replace anything from a decoction.

90 minutes boiling time would be your best choice.

WLP-800 is fine although I prefer the Wyeast 2001. The Budvar yeast WLP-802 is a bit bland to me.

The fermentation schedule is OK but be prepared for the beer to follow it's own path in the real world. If it finishes more quickly or needs more time let it.

 

[GoeHaarden]

Thanks for the tip. For some reason the link is not working. If this is the recipe with the rye malt and oat, where you have to toast the pilsner, it seems a bit complex/too many ingredients for my first ever pils.

I fixed the link...helps when you copy the whole url. But yes it is the recipe with rye malt, oak, and self toasted pilsner. I was think the same thing about the complexity of it, but if it's in place of decoctions than it seems like a good trade off.

 

[Pappers_]

As suggested above, I would cut or drop the Carapils. If you want to adjust your grainbill to mimic a decocation, a little melandoidan malt might help.

I know some people who swear by the fast lager fermentation process but my experience is different - the best lagers I've made have been the ones with which I was the most patient.

 

[shelly_belly]

I've made a Bo-pils with 9# weyermann regular pils & 1# carapils before and it turned out great. I used WLP802 (1 gal starter) which attenuated very well helping to negate the 1# carapil sweetness. I like WLP802 as it does not add flavor to the beer. I prefer to taste the grain & hops in a pilsner. I have since dropped the carapils to 8oz in my pilsners if any at all.

 

[arnobg]

Check out my Czechmate Pilsner in the recipe section. Similar to yours and turned out fantastic.

 

[Novims]

I love Weyermann's bohemian FM pilsner. It always gives me a rich mouthfeel. It's kinda hard to explain, but with every beer I brewed with it, I just wanted to take an other sip as it's was so satisfying, malty, but not sweet. With a lager yeast, it should be awesome.
I never step mashed with this malt and my attenuation never suffered. But experimentation is what this hobby is all about, so go for it!

 

[Master]

I've done two batches of Bohemian Pils on a HERMS Electric system using fly sparge vs Decotion. You are in the hunt with the design you have. Here is mine:

(this is for a 5g kegged batch)

OG 1.053 (Tweak to suit your system efficiency, I get pretty high mash efficiency)

7.5 lb Wyermann Pilsner Malt
1 lb Carahell
1/2 lb Wyermann Acid Malt (or adjust pH via other means, I went full Reinheitsgebot on this one)
1/2 lb 10L Munich
122F Protein Rest, 30 minutes.
152F 1 hour Mash
168F Mashout.. Held 10 minutes (started timer at 167)

60 Min Boil

3.6 % Saaz Hops
1.5 oz 60 mins
1.5 oz 30 mins
1.5 oz 15 min
1 Whirlfloc at 15 min (ok, cheated the purity law here.. Omi and Opa forgive me)

1.75L Starter made with Muntons Extra Light DME to 1.035, and 1 vial of WLP 800. Pitched entire amount, didn't decant.

Two weeks (went on time, as I was deployed and wife only can be bothered to adjust the temp control on the fermenter, she ain't gonna take a SG reading) at 54F.

Three Day Diacetyl at 62F

1 degree per day decrease until it got to 40F.

Let sit on the yeast (never dumped anything after pitching)

Kegged at about 2 months in. Keg Carbed 2 weeks at 12psi.

 

[Tommydee]

This forum is awesome..I'm settling on the following, beg borrowing, and stealing from many of you.... the idea of roasting some of the malt has really grown on me, so I'm going to give it a shot, but otherwise simplify the recipe from the PU clone as follows.

Kai pilsner RO water chemistry lactic acid for ph if necessary per brun water

8.5 lb wyeermans bohemian fm pilsner
1 lb weyermans bohemian fm, unground, roasted, then crushed with rolling pin.
0.5 lb cara pils
3 oz melanoiden

20 minute protein rest at 125?
60 minute sacch rest at 151.
10 minute mashout at 168

90 minute boil
All Saaz hop schedule, similar to fat Czech recipe, shoot for 40 ibu in beersmith.

Irish moss

Wyeast 2001 2L starter, conservative brulosophy lager method.1-2 week cold crash prior to kegging, since I'm skipping the gelatin on this.

Last minute critiques are always welcome.
I'll plug into beer smith...trying to find a helper to brew this weekend since my back is still on the mend....if not, maybe next weekend.

 

[Dcpcooks]

I do my protein rest between 113-121. 125 is a bit hot. A scarification rest between 143 -146 is a good stop for nice fermentable wort followed by 168 final rise. I've made several pils the past few years. This schedule makes a beer that's comparable to a double and triple decoction. Nice malt profile that ferments nicely and finishes dry with a malt backbone. I've used the fm pils several times, just got another sac for my Octoberfest. You'll like it, it's a nice grain!

 

[applescrap]

There are other options, see warm ferment thread, if other options are something that interest you.