@Quadrider
Did GBT give any indication when they'd start taking pre-orders?
Did GBT give any indication when they'd start taking pre-orders?
Grounded Brewing Technologies - 240V eBIAB System
- Thread starter Quadrider
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enormous13
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$1,800?! Woof...
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Quadrider
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From what I gather, sounds like we should see full specs and pics on their website and IG within the next week, and pre-orders within 2 weeks.
I'm not surprised at the $1800 price, but, at that price, it's far from a no-brainer. I suspect there's a significant premium for the TC ports, which I think is overkill for the hot side.
I'm in the process of shopping for an electric brewing system. At this point, I still haven't ruled out 3V HERMS, eBIAB, Kettle RIMS, Counterflow HERMS...so many options with different pros/cons for each. I just can't seem to find a system that meets all my needs at a decent price point.
I'm still hoping Spike will come out with an EBIAB system. It would be so easy to build one around their base kettle with quick connects and simplified control panel and a basket. I exchanged emails with them and they implied they had something coming out, but the only announcement since then was the new TC kettle and system.
I keep coming back to either Kettle RIMS or counterflow HERMS. I like the simplicity of eBIAB, but I have concerns about capacity for high gravity brews. My last stout was 12.5% 5G batch using 25 lbs of grain. I'm not seeing much in the eBIAB world that will do that due to the dead space where the heating element is and kettle size needed.
I'm in the process of shopping for an electric brewing system. At this point, I still haven't ruled out 3V HERMS, eBIAB, Kettle RIMS, Counterflow HERMS...so many options with different pros/cons for each. I just can't seem to find a system that meets all my needs at a decent price point.
I'm still hoping Spike will come out with an EBIAB system. It would be so easy to build one around their base kettle with quick connects and simplified control panel and a basket. I exchanged emails with them and they implied they had something coming out, but the only announcement since then was the new TC kettle and system.
I keep coming back to either Kettle RIMS or counterflow HERMS. I like the simplicity of eBIAB, but I have concerns about capacity for high gravity brews. My last stout was 12.5% 5G batch using 25 lbs of grain. I'm not seeing much in the eBIAB world that will do that due to the dead space where the heating element is and kettle size needed.
I exchanged a few emails with Spike in June about an eBIAB system and they said "we do not have a time frame for such a product at this time". Doesn't mean they were telling me the truth but that's what they told me. I agree that it shouldn't be too difficult for them to do. The Grounded system checks off almost everything. Obviously the price tag is a hurdle but I think it's probably a fair price for what the system comes with. I would have also liked to see an additional port near the top of the kettle to be able to recirc downward into the basket.
I'm trying to avoid building a custom eBIAB but it seems like that may just ultimately make the most sense. A custom 15g Spike+ kettle will probably run 400-450 maybe? A basket will be another 250-350 depending on the size and features. Now you are at 700-800 for the kettle and basket. That makes the Unibrau kettle and basket seem like a bargain at about 450 for 10 gallons.
They have plans for an eBIAB kettle that includes a TC heating element port, WP port, temp port and a drain port. They quoted $350 for the 15G version. If I go custom eBIAB or kettle RIMS, I'll probably get one of those. For kettle RIMS, I can use my current kettle as a mash tun by adding a false bottom and save money that way.
For me, the bottom line is finding the system that works best for me. I could buy a Spike turn key 3V HERMS, but I'm not sold that it's the best option.
I have a 15 gallon pot and sent 11G of DIPA into the fermenter, it took 29# of grain, I did have to pour over about 2 gallons though due to space.
That's certainly an option, but I don't know if I could pull that off and get 70% BH efficiency on a 1.128 OG stout.
When you say "they have plans", do you mean they have a schematic already drawn up for a 15g kettle with those 4 ports and they can build it for 350 anytime you want it? Or that they have plans to offer an eBIAB kettle like that in the future and they plan to charge 350 for it?
MX1
Texas Ale Works
at $1800 I am glad I went with High Gravity....
beer not gear
beer not gear
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Quadrider
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Got a surprise awesome email today.....
“So after much consideration with some future products we having coming out in the near future, we have actually decided to include a 20 gallon kettle with the kit and a basket to match! The kit will remain the same price of $1800!”
20G for the same price?? Wow
“So after much consideration with some future products we having coming out in the near future, we have actually decided to include a 20 gallon kettle with the kit and a basket to match! The kit will remain the same price of $1800!”
20G for the same price?? Wow
emr25
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Will they offer both size options? I will never brew batches bigger than 6 gallons into fermentor, 5 gallons into keg. Don’t want or need 20 gallons of kettle space!
Sweet!
Same here. Hmm.
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Quadrider
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Same boat. My conical only holds 5g and don’t ever foresee myself doing 10G batches. Asked specifically about this and they responded: “No problem with 5 gallon batches. The element is around the 2 to 3 gallon mark”
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Quadrider
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More details....
“I am hoping I can make a formal announcement of all the specs towards the end of this week. Once the announcement is made we should be looking at pre orders the week after if not the following.
1) Kettle thickness is 1.2mm
2) Pump will have a stainless head
3) Yes, there will be hooks for the basket to the kettle
4) No problem with 5 gallon batches. The element is around the 2 to 3 gallon mark
5) Yes, we are definitely planning on doing an instructional video for the kit
6) There will probably be a few months delay on the other heat exchanger, and the price difference will be quite a bit different. We haven’t nailed down the price yet, but it will be quite a bit different.
“I am hoping I can make a formal announcement of all the specs towards the end of this week. Once the announcement is made we should be looking at pre orders the week after if not the following.
1) Kettle thickness is 1.2mm
2) Pump will have a stainless head
3) Yes, there will be hooks for the basket to the kettle
4) No problem with 5 gallon batches. The element is around the 2 to 3 gallon mark
5) Yes, we are definitely planning on doing an instructional video for the kit
6) There will probably be a few months delay on the other heat exchanger, and the price difference will be quite a bit different. We haven’t nailed down the price yet, but it will be quite a bit different.
Switching from 15g to 20g seems like a big change so close to rollout.
emr25
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Does that mean there will be 2 to 3 gallons of “dead space” below the mash basket? Or will the basket fit inside of the heating element?
I'm curious to see their basket as well. Presumably it has legs to keep the bottom of the basket above the element and the pump intake, but who knows.
groundedbrewtech
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Hey everyone! Thank you for the interest in our system! So, I know we threw a curve ball with the different kettle size. We were just about to start production on the 20 gallon kettles, but after seeing everyones feedback on here we have decided to stick with the 15 gallon for now and release a 20 gallon version at a later date. Thanks again!
While I know it is impossible to make everyone happy, I for one was excited for the 20g Jump :/ but I am however very much looking forward to the details on your system!
Welcome to the forums
Makes sense, you will probably be able to sell more 15's than 20's. You can definitely still do 10 gallon batch BIAB in a 15G pot, I do it relatively often, you would just have to do a pourover sparge once you pull the grain. Good luck, from what I've seen this looks like a great system.
groundedbrewtech
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Thank you very much!
groundedbrewtech
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Thank you! We are hoping to have the 20gal version soon after the 15gal if everything goes as planned!
augiedoggy
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a lot of those prices are kinda high it seems they are close to double what you can buy them for if you dont go through a homebrew shop as a middleman.
For example 1.5" TC butterfly valves start at about $25 shipped each https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-5-Sanita...cone-Sealing/232303795591?hash=item3616629d87 theres about $100 in savings..
The barbed tri clamp fittings are about $5 each not 10.. https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-2-12MM-Sanitary-Hose-Barb-Pipe-Fitting-SS-SUS316-Tri-Clamp-OD-50-5MM-Ferrule/273270257448?hash=item3fa02d3728:g:cdEAAOxy7nNTWg37&_sacat=0&_nkw=1/2"+barb+tri+clamp&_from=R40&rt=nc&_trksid=m570.l1313 another $60 in saving
and those are for the type you'll find in most small breweries.. and there are multiple places to find the TC based nema plug elements for as little as $14 plus shipping.. even ebay has them for $50 shipped.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Brewing-Heater-5500w-240v-Heating-Element-2-Tri-clamp-Electric-Locking-Plug/323186402398?hash=item4b3f69245e:g:5U8AAOSwDFBaJR1K&_sacat=0&_nkw=5500w+tri+clamp+element&_from=R40&rt=nc&_trksid=m570.l1313 about $50 in savings.
The TC clamps...sell for about $2.50-$3 each so $66 for twelve is about double the going rate. https://www.ebay.com/itm/10pcs-Sing...041706463?epid=8021093985&hash=item33ee5259df about $30 in savings. I'm sure theres a lot more but these are all things I have bought many of so the prices jumped out at me..
You can bet the people building these systems arent buying the parts from other homebrewing shops so why would you use them and their retail markups to do a cost breakdown? just my thoughts on it ..
I was not using those numbers as a comparison for a system builder. They were priced as a consumer DIY. A reasonable DIY person would buy components from home brew shops, hence the prices and the beer math. That cost represents the rough amount a consumer would pay to piece out a system using similar components attempting to answer the question of is it a good value to me as a consumer.
My thought is that if they are able to offer a 20G system for the reported $1800, the least they can do is pass the cost saving on to the customer when purchasing a 15G system. I agree with @augiedoggy, the material cost for a lot of these components is much less than originally posted. However what you're looking at is an out of the box solution that appears to use premium parts, hence they charge accordingly.
augiedoggy
Well-Known Member
I disagree. I think a reasonable person would research what they need and buy the best components for the best prices based upon what they are and what they do.. If you feel a $10 barbed fitting through a middleman who likely buys them in bulk for $3 is somehow better than the same fitting directly from where it's made for $5 than more power to you. To me one of the key reasons to DIY is also to save and not overspend.
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Blazinlow86
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Well said. I agree. Cheers
Ok people, if you disagree with what someone has said, respond to what they said, and why you disagree. Disparaging another member, questioning their motives, making fun of a member, etc. is never allowed. Those kinds of posts, and any posts that quote them, will be deleted. I have had to delete a number of posts in this thread for inappropriate comments.
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augiedoggy
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My apologies
cheesebach
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As someone looking to purchase an eBIAB system in the next ~6months, I appreciate when someone does some cost analysis to estimate the cost of a comparable system done in a DIY manner. I think anyone who's done some basic research (which hopefully someone who is considering dropping $1800 would do), realizes that a DIY system will almost always be cheaper, and wouldn't take any offense to somebody estimating the cost of the components.
To me, there are 2 types of systems that would interest me:
1) A somewhat "standard" eBIAB system that comes with everything I need, offering a good value for the $$ but offering nothing unique that really sets it apart. This would be something like the Clawhammer Supply system, High Gravity, etc. - mesh basket, standard heating elements, basic controller, etc. For these, I think somewhere around a 10-20% upcharge over the cost of DIY is reasonable and probably worth it if you're not into DIY.
2) A well-thought out design that incorporates some unique design/features that help it stand out. This would be systems like the Unibrau (mash basket), BrewBoss (COFI basket, software), etc. I expect to pay more for these than something that is just repackaging existing parts that anyone could easily buy themselves online.
In either case, the DIY component cost is helpful, so you can estimate what you are paying for convenience and special design features and then decide whether it is worth it. At $1800, there's gonna have to be something that helps make this system stand out for me to give it any serious consideration.
To me, there are 2 types of systems that would interest me:
1) A somewhat "standard" eBIAB system that comes with everything I need, offering a good value for the $$ but offering nothing unique that really sets it apart. This would be something like the Clawhammer Supply system, High Gravity, etc. - mesh basket, standard heating elements, basic controller, etc. For these, I think somewhere around a 10-20% upcharge over the cost of DIY is reasonable and probably worth it if you're not into DIY.
2) A well-thought out design that incorporates some unique design/features that help it stand out. This would be systems like the Unibrau (mash basket), BrewBoss (COFI basket, software), etc. I expect to pay more for these than something that is just repackaging existing parts that anyone could easily buy themselves online.
In either case, the DIY component cost is helpful, so you can estimate what you are paying for convenience and special design features and then decide whether it is worth it. At $1800, there's gonna have to be something that helps make this system stand out for me to give it any serious consideration.
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Quadrider
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As there's no comparison that building your own setup will definitely be the most cost efficient and overall significantly cheaper way to go, some (myself included) might be seeking a complete turnkey solution in lieu of piecing everything together. I agree though, the $1,800.00 price point was definitely higher then everyone expected... especially without a chiller. Unfortunately there's only a few 240v options out there to compare:
CH - 10G w/EBS 240v Panel & Element - $1,414.00
HG – 240V w/SSbt 15Gal. & TD5 Pump - $1,135.00 (No Chiller / Nylon Bag)
BB - 15G 240v COFI - $1,620.00 (No Chiller)
UniBrau – 10G 240V w/ETC+SV240 - $1,569.00
Blichmann – 10G Brew Easy W/Plate Chiller & Butterfly Whirlpool - $2,554.00
Personally, I've been waiting since February to invest my $ on the SSBrewtech eBIAB system, but that was a complete disappointment. No basket, and we still don't even have pricing on the EKettles yet. However, with a $599.00 Controller, and EKettle "Priced similarly to our current offerings" Will probably still put you right around the $900.00 - $1,000.00 before pump, basket, chiller, fittings, etc.
Since it's an introductory kit, and brand new to the market, I'd love to see GBT possibly offer an "Early Bird" Backer or Pre-Order discount. Would definitely help garner & persuade those still on the fence or apprehensive at the current price tag.
CH - 10G w/EBS 240v Panel & Element - $1,414.00
HG – 240V w/SSbt 15Gal. & TD5 Pump - $1,135.00 (No Chiller / Nylon Bag)
BB - 15G 240v COFI - $1,620.00 (No Chiller)
UniBrau – 10G 240V w/ETC+SV240 - $1,569.00
Blichmann – 10G Brew Easy W/Plate Chiller & Butterfly Whirlpool - $2,554.00
Personally, I've been waiting since February to invest my $ on the SSBrewtech eBIAB system, but that was a complete disappointment. No basket, and we still don't even have pricing on the EKettles yet. However, with a $599.00 Controller, and EKettle "Priced similarly to our current offerings" Will probably still put you right around the $900.00 - $1,000.00 before pump, basket, chiller, fittings, etc.
Since it's an introductory kit, and brand new to the market, I'd love to see GBT possibly offer an "Early Bird" Backer or Pre-Order discount. Would definitely help garner & persuade those still on the fence or apprehensive at the current price tag.
groundedbrewtech
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Almost there! Hoping we can start pre-orders early to mid next week! Pictures of the kit will be out soon. Had a bit of a delay with one piece. We will make the announcement here as well as soon as it is available! Thank you!
Any chance you will have a pre-order option for just the kettle and basket?
groundedbrewtech
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Yes for sure! We will have 3 different options for the pre-order:
- Complete kit
- Kettle and basket
- Kettle only
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