Grainfather!!

[Teesquar]

The Graincoat/Reflectix only covers the boiler though. The post you are responding to is talking about insulating the exterior wort return pipe from the pump up.

No, he said malt pipe. But, whatever. Thought I'd at least provide an answer. Maybe he will expound on whether or not it was helpful.

 

[actech]

Is the GF UL approved ?

yes it is

 

[Kampenken]

How do you know your taste buds wouldn't detect a difference ?

How do you know your bed is tracking what the controller reads ? Have you plotted both temperatures for the duration of a mash ?

Do you ever do step mashes ? What is happening with the bed temps then ?

My experience. Measured, not for duration, but have seen GF settle in to expected mash temp and verified by wort temp (granted not bed temp). This is my point with your mod of a one point location 2-3" below surface-very limited, don't see value add. No I don't step mash, but do mash out.

Don't over think this. The proof is in the drinking/tasting. Is is as good as it COULD be? Who knows? It's up to you whether or not the beer is to your liking or is as perfect as it needs to be. I have not had any complaints thus far.
I also have a full blown Cal's Clone Electric Brewery that I built from scratch, and still bought a Grainfather to simplify my brew day. I still use big brother some but a two hour cleanup afterwards is really too much like work. Besides, not having to stand on my patio or in my garage brewing when it is 100 degrees (or 25 )outside, I think this thing is wonderful based on the beer it has turned out for me to date. YMMV.

Precisely! Interesting to read a Kal clone user finding the GF simplicity, this is what I imagine would occur with me. I like to keep my life simpler, less cluttered.

That thing is pretty limited.
- Power limited to 120VAC, so 1800 watts, max. It probably puts out 1500 watts.
- The boil kettle is smaller than the GF, 7.5 gallon versus 8.
- The mash tun is even smaller than the GF MT, 9.5" in diameter, versus 10.5"
- No pump, no CFC, no discharge pipe, no overflow pipe, no top screen, no hop filter, very limited controller.

It is a bare bones system, not even a good starting point because it is too small capacity wise. By the time you add a pump ($120), CFC ($100), discharge pipe, overflow pipe, top screen, hop filter and upgrade the controller, what are you saving ?

MT volume = 9.5 x 17 = 5.2 gallons. You aren't going to make a beer much over 1.060 with it.

A 1/2 gal less in boiler is not an issue- I've had more than 1g capacity room on the GF and brewed in the 70s OG. Power you were planning to mod on GF, so that's a non-issue. Mash tun size I agree (why I want to read reviews!), however brews at 15-16# should fit and that, for me at least, is max so far. The GF is intended for up to ~6.5g brews, so M&B at 6 is still beyond most folks avg 5g brews here. Of course it's bare bones, at 300 you have to expect that! Your costs are out of line. Ok, I was wrong you may not be an ideal candidate to mod the Mash & Boil. I will work on recruiting someone else here.

 

[dgently]

Ah, thanks. I preordered mine too...$179 canuckbucks

Where can you pre-order it in canada?
Thanks

 

[Kampenken]

So has anyone considered insulating the exterior malt pipe? Its probably way overkill, but could be kinda fun to do I think.

No. It's a small surface area and would only be relevant during the mash, where there is no temp holding, or ramp issue. Insulate the boiler, besides better performance you get the safety of no hot surface (well, ok except the standpipe! ).

 

[skraeling]

No, he said malt pipe. But, whatever. Thought I'd at least provide an answer. Maybe he will expound on whether or not it was helpful.

I was in fact, meaning the exterior pipe that the pump is connected to. Im fully aware of the graincoat. The GF I ordered is actually coming with one for free so yay.

 

[PCL]

Thanks all for your input on earlier questions.

GF showed up today, put it together and will clean and get in running tomorrow. Ordered from AIH, free shipping. Looks sturdy, well designed (as expected) and came in perfect condition.

What does the group think of the additional sparge water heater? A worthwhile adjunct to GF?

 

[RedlegEd]

Thanks all for your input on earlier questions.

GF showed up today, put it together and will clean and get in running tomorrow. Ordered from AIH, free shipping. Looks sturdy, well designed (as expected) and came in perfect condition.
What does the group think of the additional sparge water heater? A worthwhile adjunct to GF?

Hi. I wouldn't want to comment on whether it's worthwhile because everyone's needs/desires are different. I got a Graincoat that many think is over priced compared to Reflectix. I did not buy an additional sparge heater, rather, I bought a 5 gallon water cooler to use as a Hot Liquor Tank (HLT.) I replaced the stock spigot with 1/2" bucket spigot and use a piece of 1/2" silicone tubing to reach the basket to sparge. What I do is heat all the water of a batch to strike, then pump off the sparge amount into the cooler. It stays nice and hot while I mash. The spigot is great to control the flow. Hope that helps. Ed

 

[elreplica]

Where can you pre-order it in canada?

Thanks[/


Noble Grape is the national (Canadian) distributor for iMake...Grainfather parent company. Call 1-844-913-2739 for assistance Mon to Fri 8am - 4:30pm (AST). They didn't have it set up online as of yet, so I guess "reserve" is the better word. I'm sure they'd put your name on a list and they do ship nationally. Buying through Noble Grape means you should be one of the first to get the controller. It's been that way for all Grainfather products. Being the national distributor, others have to order from them and so it makes sense they'll be first to have it on the market. Doing some investigation online, I found a bill of lading tracing a shipment from New Zealand to New York. I believe the Canadian order tags on to the US order (Brewcraft USA) and lands in Halifax, NS. From there, stuff is distributed to the rest of country.

 

[Kampenken]

Thanks all for your input on earlier questions.

GF showed up today, put it together and will clean and get in running tomorrow. Ordered from AIH, free shipping. Looks sturdy, well designed (as expected) and came in perfect condition.

What does the group think of the additional sparge water heater? A worthwhile adjunct to GF?

I agree with Ed. I still manually sparge with a pitcher, water heated on stovetop in a kettle (warmed up about 15 min into mash). My intention is to rig up kettle with valve and "auto" sparge as well. Also on my next lower gravity brew I will attempt a no sparge.

 

[elreplica]

Thanks all for your input on earlier questions.

GF showed up today, put it together and will clean and get in running tomorrow. Ordered from AIH, free shipping. Looks sturdy, well designed (as expected) and came in perfect condition.

What does the group think of the additional sparge water heater? A worthwhile adjunct to GF?

I initially used a GF fermenter with a 1000W heatstick and had a Reflectix jacket. They both were fine but I like the sleek looks of the fellow equipment and figured in for a penny, in for a pound. Plus, one of my fermentors is free for beer.

 

[d-bone]

Thanks all for your input on earlier questions.

GF showed up today, put it together and will clean and get in running tomorrow. Ordered from AIH, free shipping. Looks sturdy, well designed (as expected) and came in perfect condition.

What does the group think of the additional sparge water heater? A worthwhile adjunct to GF?

meh, I bought the sparge water heater, and while its nice, I would have spent the extra and got this: https://www.williamsbrewing.com/-MASH-WATER-HEATER-WITH-KEG-KING-DUAL-CONTROLLER-P4222.aspx

the later has a nice digitial readout, and ball valve so I can set up a fly sparge.

 

[BrewinSoldier]

meh, I bought the sparge water heater, and while its nice, I would have spent the extra and got this: https://www.williamsbrewing.com/-MASH-WATER-HEATER-WITH-KEG-KING-DUAL-CONTROLLER-P4222.aspx

the later has a nice digitial readout, and ball valve so I can set up a fly sparge.

I have both..The Williams I use with my 3 V setup. The Williams is nice because it has a ball valve that you can control the sparge with, but the digital controller on mine started going haywire and wouldn't control the temps anymore. It just started making the element max out and boil the water. I called Williams and tried diagnosing it over the phone with them and they didnt want to help. I ended up buying a new controller off of Amazon(different brand) and it fixed it. You also have to put something underneath it because it gets very hot on the bottom, and doesn't have a stand like the grainfather sparge heater.

The grainfather sparge heater is more compact, and you don't have the extra bulk of the controller to get in the way. On the downside, it has an analog built in controller that you have to dial in and play with a bit, but it's pretty accurate. The other downside is that there is not control over the flow of the sparge. It's either an open or closed valve. You also have to watch out not to touch the controller because it moves very easily and when you go to sparge, you will have way overshot your sparge water temp without even knowing. You also have to calculate celcius to farenheight because the controller is in celcius only. I also had problems with my tubing popping off of the valve because I didnt have a clamp to hold it on, and I made a big mess.

Out of the two, I like the Williams better but definitely was not happy with their customer service.

 

[jonesry09]

I have both..The Williams I use with my 3 V setup. The Williams is nice because it has a ball valve that you can control the sparge with, but the digital controller on mine started going haywire and wouldn't control the temps anymore. It just started making the element max out and boil the water. I called Williams and tried diagnosing it over the phone with them and they didnt want to help. I ended up buying a new controller off of Amazon(different brand) and it fixed it. You also have to put something underneath it because it gets very hot on the bottom, and doesn't have a stand like the grainfather sparge heater.

The grainfather sparge heater is more compact, and you don't have the extra bulk of the controller to get in the way. On the downside, it has an analog built in controller that you have to dial in and play with a bit, but it's pretty accurate. The other downside is that there is not control over the flow of the sparge. It's either an open or closed valve. You also have to watch out not to touch the controller because it moves very easily and when you go to sparge, you will have way overshot your sparge water temp without even knowing. You also have to calculate celcius to farenheight because the controller is in celcius only. I also had problems with my tubing popping off of the valve because I didnt have a clamp to hold it on, and I made a big mess.

Out of the two, I like the Williams better but definitely was not happy with their customer service.

Is it not possible to change that "tap valve" on the GF heater to a ball valve? I am asking because that is what I was planning on doing to mine. Was hoping it had been done before.

 

[elreplica]

I have both..The Williams I use with my 3 V setup. The Williams is nice because it has a ball valve that you can control the sparge with, but the digital controller on mine started going haywire and wouldn't control the temps anymore. It just started making the element max out and boil the water. I called Williams and tried diagnosing it over the phone with them and they didnt want to help. I ended up buying a new controller off of Amazon(different brand) and it fixed it. You also have to put something underneath it because it gets very hot on the bottom, and doesn't have a stand like the grainfather sparge heater.



The grainfather sparge heater is more compact, and you don't have the extra bulk of the controller to get in the way. On the downside, it has an analog built in controller that you have to dial in and play with a bit, but it's pretty accurate. The other downside is that there is not control over the flow of the sparge. It's either an open or closed valve. You also have to watch out not to touch the controller because it moves very easily and when you go to sparge, you will have way overshot your sparge water temp without even knowing. You also have to calculate celcius to farenheight because the controller is in celcius only. I also had problems with my tubing popping off of the valve because I didnt have a clamp to hold it on, and I made a big mess.



Out of the two, I like the Williams better but definitely was not happy with their customer service.

Easy enough to put a small valve on some silicone tubing for fly sparging in fact, that's what I'll likely be doing. Or replacing the tap on the GF sparge vessel. With one that can handle the heat and control the flow. And I totally agree with the finicky knob whilst dialling in temps on the GF sparge heater.

 

[brewman !]

How many people brew with the GF in the kitchen ? How do you handle drips and spills ? How do you sparge ? What does your SO think of you brewing in the kitchen ?

Thanks

 

[SirSpectre]

How many people brew with the GF in the kitchen ? How do you handle drips and spills ? How do you sparge ? What does your SO think of you brewing in the kitchen ?

Thanks

Just brewed last night in the kitchen with it. She loved the smell!



OK issue at hand. I had my first brew day with the GF last night. Had a few issues. First, the sparging seemed to go REALLY fast. Like I could not keep up with the water level dropping. Normal?

Next, I'm not sure if I had the equipment profile wrong, or it was just something else. My OG was WAYYYYYY off. 13 points off. But I am 90% sure it was due to boil off. I wanted a 5.25 gallon batch. I collected 5.7 Gallons of wort in my fermenter. The GF had like 2.5 gallons left in the kettle. The boil was pretty pathetic, so I'm not sure it actually hit the proper boil off level. The kettle was over the scale inside, so I'm not 100% sure how much was being boiled.

12 pounds of grain, asked for 5 gallons of water, and 3.75 gallons of sparge water.

 

[bigtex52]

How many people brew with the GF in the kitchen ? How do you handle drips and spills ? How do you sparge ? What does your SO think of you brewing in the kitchen ?

Thanks

Floor in the kitchen is hard surface, so spills/drips are no big deal. Actually, SO doesn't mind at all since the kitchen ends up cleaner than when I started.
I put a 20qt kettle on the stove for sparge water and carry it over to the counter for sparging, with a 4 cup glass measuring cup. Works slick.

 

[lewandowski46]

Looking at grain absorption, .13gal per lb, you would lose 1.56 gallon to 12 lbs of grain via absorption. If you wanted 5.25 gallons into the fermenter, with trub losses of 1 gal, and boil off of .6 per hour, I see 5.25 + 1 + .6 + 1.56 = or 8.41 total volume of water.

With a mash thickness of 1.33 quarts/lb, that's 15.96 quarts or 3.96 gallons, + .9 in deadspace below mash pipe. That's 4.89 gallons of strike water, and 8.41-4.89 = 3.52 gallons of sparge or so? Not far off I don't think. Of course my calculations could be a bit off so there's always that.

Maybe a combination of lack of boil off with maybe too large of a crush or something that the grain didn't absorb as much? What were the pre/post boil volumes?

 

[SirSpectre]

Looking at grain absorption, .13gal per lb, you would lose 1.56 gallon to 12 lbs of grain via absorption. If you wanted 5.25 gallons into the fermenter, with trub losses of 1 gal, and boil off of .6 per hour, I see 5.25 + 1 + .6 + 1.56 = or 8.41 total volume of water.

With a mash thickness of 1.33 quarts/lb, that's 15.96 quarts or 3.96 gallons, + .9 in deadspace below mash pipe. That's 4.89 gallons of strike water, and 8.41-4.89 = 3.52 gallons of sparge or so? Not far off I don't think. Of course my calculations could be a bit off so there's always that.

Maybe a combination of lack of boil off with maybe too large of a crush or something that the grain didn't absorb as much? What were the pre/post boil volumes?

Preboil was a decent ways above the scale. Boil off was still well above it. Only about 3/4" boiled off. It definitely wasn't .6 gallons boiled off. I thought the mash looked really thin as well. I've used the same crush as I always have in my cooler system and never had an issue with it.

 

[lewandowski46]

Not accusing you of it doing this, but it almost sounds like you had a gallon too much in there from the start? I've done that before where the line I thought was the 4 gal line ended up being the 5 gal so I had to scoop some out to get down to the level I needed. I've also started referencing my volumes in liters as that has more graduations and can be more accurate. Like if i need 4.89 gallons of strike, I google it and see i need about 18.5 L.

 

[Kampenken]

How many people brew with the GF in the kitchen ? How do you handle drips and spills ? How do you sparge ? What does your SO think of you brewing in the kitchen ?

Thanks

I do, and outdoors when weather is nice. Likely moving to basement brew area I'm working on (after I complete my kitchen island, new cabinets come in this week!). I don't make too much of a mess, but on hardwood floors its an easy wipe, and I do clean the floors at the end of most brew days. Manual sparge with a pitcher, heat water on stove top, it remains there throughout my sparge with lid on and heat either off or on low. SO, hates the smell, but we work out so I have the kitchen on brew days.

...OK issue at hand. I had my first brew day with the GF last night. Had a few issues. First, the sparging seemed to go REALLY fast. Like I could not keep up with the water level dropping. Normal?

Next, I'm not sure if I had the equipment profile wrong, or it was just something else. My OG was WAYYYYYY off. 13 points off. But I am 90% sure it was due to boil off. I wanted a 5.25 gallon batch. I collected 5.7 Gallons of wort in my fermenter. The GF had like 2.5 gallons left in the kettle. The boil was pretty pathetic, so I'm not sure it actually hit the proper boil off level. The kettle was over the scale inside, so I'm not 100% sure how much was being boiled.

12 pounds of grain, asked for 5 gallons of water, and 3.75 gallons of sparge water.

No, not normal. First, did you push the top plate down after the 1st runnings completed? (it may fall down on its own, but IME the grain bed compacts about 4" after draining). If you didn't this open space may have led to your results.

As for your volume, I came up with same mash water but just ~3g of sparge. You do have to play around with your figures not just working on your boil off rate and boil length, but also amount of hops. I too used to overshoot my vol into fermenter, now I'm dialed in and I find ~1L left in GF (I tip towards pump) and 1/2c in CFC at best.

But what I really don't understand is if the GF had 2.5g left in boiler & you got 5.75g in fermenter, how was that with grain absorption of ~1.5g+?? Something isn't adding up here...

Looking at grain absorption, .13gal per lb, you would lose 1.56 gallon to 12 lbs of grain via absorption. If you wanted 5.25 gallons into the fermenter, with trub losses of 1 gal, and boil off of .6 per hour, I see 5.25 + 1 + .6 + 1.56 = or 8.41 total volume of water.

With a mash thickness of 1.33 quarts/lb, that's 15.96 quarts or 3.96 gallons, + .9 in deadspace below mash pipe. That's 4.89 gallons of strike water, and 8.41-4.89 = 3.52 gallons of sparge or so? Not far off I don't think. Of course my calculations could be a bit off so there's always that.

Maybe a combination of lack of boil off with maybe too large of a crush or something that the grain didn't absorb as much? What were the pre/post boil volumes?

I think your trub loss is too high, unless you use a LOT of hops, which indeed will change the calcs. I'm still ~.4g< than your calc.

 

[SirSpectre]

Not accusing you of it doing this, but it almost sounds like you had a gallon too much in there from the start? I've done that before where the line I thought was the 4 gal line ended up being the 5 gal so I had to scoop some out to get down to the level I needed. I've also started referencing my volumes in liters as that has more graduations and can be more accurate. Like if i need 4.89 gallons of strike, I google it and see i need about 18.5 L.

Suppose that could be an issue as well. I took 5 gallons of spring water and poured them in, so unless those are wrong... If this was the case, it was likely from the sparge water. Does sparge water absorb too? Because I'm pretty sure sparging went horribly, horribly, wrong. Like pouring it through a net wrong.

No, not normal. First, did you push the top plate down after the 1st runnings completed? (it may fall down on its own, but IME the grain bed compacts about 4" after draining). If you didn't this open space may have led to your results.

Bingo. I did not do that.

As for your volume, I came up with same mash water but just ~3g of sparge. You do have to play around with your figures not just working on your boil off rate and boil length, but also amount of hops. I too used to overshoot my vol into fermenter, now I'm dialed in and I find ~1L left in GF (I tip towards pump) and 1/2c in CFC at best.

But what I really don't understand is if the GF had 2.5g left in boiler & you got 5.75g in fermenter, how was that with grain absorption of ~1.5g+?? Something isn't adding up here...

I am very confused as well. There was so much left over. I double checked my boil off rate in BeerSmith, and that was correct (from post 1231 in this thread, and what the GF manual said.)

I think your trub loss is too high, unless you use a LOT of hops, which indeed will change the calcs. I'm still ~.4g< than your calc.

I'll have to check this as well. I only had 2.5 oz of hops in this batch. Less than a cup of trub in the kettle, and I usually have about .4 gal of trub in the fermenter as well.


I'll be brewing again on Sunday with some alterations. Hope I get closer this time

 

[elreplica]

How many people brew with the GF in the kitchen ? How do you handle drips and spills ? How do you sparge ? What does your SO think of you brewing in the kitchen ?



Thanks

My SO hates the smell and all things craft beerish. That being said, I'm semi-retired and she works so I brew when she's working and all is cleaned up by the time she's back. Double sinks are fine with aerator, composite floor, range hood for boil off. I'm planning on migrating everything to basement but that requires exhaust, sink, laundry tub and pump and some alterations and logistics. I've already got a kegerator and lagering fridge there so that's a great start. Now to bring in the other kegerator from the garage with my gas cylinders and get everything set up is the challenge. A one year plan I'm thinkin'...

 

[lewandowski46]

Because I'm pretty sure sparging went horribly, horribly, wrong. Like pouring it through a net wrong.

Sounds like it tunneled through the grains and like a sieve, right through. Usually takes me 15-20 minutes minimum to put 3-4 gallons of sparge water through.

 

[MeanLowerLow]

Hey all, I just got an email that the Grainfather Connect is (finally) available in the US! I have already ordered mine. Really looking forward to trying it out - I will post some thoughts after I get to use it in case anyone is interested. I'm hoping it will allow me to brew during a workday by setting up before work, then having the water heated by the time I get home.

 

[Minky]

12 pounds of grain, asked for 5 gallons of water, and 3.75 gallons of sparge water.

Where did you get the figures for your mash and sparge volumes? For a 5.25 gal. batch, the Grainfather calculator calls for 4.81 gal. mash water and 2.65 gal. sparge water for a 60 min. boil, or 2.91 gal. for a 90 min. boil.

https://www.grainfather.com/brewing-calculators

 

[user 4295]

Hey all, I just got an email that the Grainfather Connect is (finally) available in the US! I have already ordered mine. Really looking forward to trying it out - I will post some thoughts after I get to use it in case anyone is interested. I'm hoping it will allow me to brew during a workday by setting up before work, then having the water heated by the time I get home.

Yes, I just saw that. They announced it on their Facebook page as well. Here's a link to the bundle deal they're offering.


https://www.grainfather.com/shop/grainfather/grainfather-connect-bundle.html

 

[skraeling]

Yes, I just saw that. They announced it on their Facebook page as well. Here's a link to the bundle deal they're offering.


https://www.grainfather.com/shop/grainfather/grainfather-connect-bundle.html

hopefully ritebrew gets them in stock, they always charge less for stuff it seems.

 

[actech]

Floor in the kitchen is hard surface, so spills/drips are no big deal. Actually, SO doesn't mind at all since the kitchen ends up cleaner than when I started.
I put a 20qt kettle on the stove for sparge water and carry it over to the counter for sparging, with a 4 cup glass measuring cup. Works slick.

Yep pretty much !