FIB War Room

[middlebrow]

Guys, they did sparkle wax dip the bottles though.... Wax is #newmoney crack

 

[jeblikesbeer]

 

[Leafhouse]

I like having the opportunity to sacrifice my time in exchange for Bourbon County at a reasonable price. Secondary market opportunists won't be stopped by a higher price tag as long as it sells at a high margin (which I believe it would unless they charged like $200 a bottle or something absurd). Breweries generally don't want to alienate their customers and look like ******** by charging $100 a bottle for the limited stuff. I've had plenty of beers worth $200+ secondary but would I pay $200 for them? Hell no, I'd probably avoid that brewery altogether. Personally, I cannot afford to shell out $200 for a beer but I can afford to spend my Saturday drinking with friends in the freezing cold to spend $50 on a beer. I enjoy this "hobby" and really don't want to get priced out.

There was a cool Planet Money podcast on limited Nikes I'd recommend to anyone interested in this sort of secondary market shenanigans talk.

 

[danbanana]

People are lining up at Hailstorm 3 hours ahead of time.....lol

#newmoney really does love lines

What the **** is "Hailstorm?"

 

[sacrelicio]

I like having the opportunity to sacrifice my time in exchange for Bourbon County at a reasonable price. Secondary market opportunists won't be stopped by a higher price tag as long as it sells at a high margin (which I believe it would unless they charged like $200 a bottle or something absurd). Breweries generally don't want to alienate their customers and look like ******** by charging $100 a bottle for the limited stuff. I've had plenty of beers worth $200+ secondary but would I pay $200 for them? Hell no, I'd probably avoid that brewery altogether. Personally, I cannot afford to shell out $200 for a beer but I can afford to spend my Saturday drinking with friends in the freezing cold to spend $50 on a beer. I enjoy this "hobby" and really don't want to get priced out.

There was a cool Planet Money podcast on limited Nikes I'd recommend to anyone interested in this sort of secondary market shenanigans talk.

Yeah all this talk about raising prices to combat demand ignores the fact that most of the people who line up in this hobby have more time than money and enjoy lining up, chasing, trading, etc. Also these guys tend to be younger men from fairly modest backgrounds who would be easily alienated by any business jacking up their prices.

 

[sacrelicio]

What the **** is "Hailstorm?"

First time I ever heard of them was this release

 

[Duffman929]

What the **** is "Hailstorm?"

I'm pretty sure it's like a shitstorm, but with a less desired outcome.

 

[DanH11]

I like having the opportunity to sacrifice my time in exchange for Bourbon County at a reasonable price. Secondary market opportunists won't be stopped by a higher price tag as long as it sells at a high margin (which I believe it would unless they charged like $200 a bottle or something absurd). Breweries generally don't want to alienate their customers and look like ******** by charging $100 a bottle for the limited stuff. I've had plenty of beers worth $200+ secondary but would I pay $200 for them? Hell no, I'd probably avoid that brewery altogether. Personally, I cannot afford to shell out $200 for a beer but I can afford to spend my Saturday drinking with friends in the freezing cold to spend $50 on a beer. I enjoy this "hobby" and really don't want to get priced out.

There was a cool Planet Money podcast on limited Nikes I'd recommend to anyone interested in this sort of secondary market shenanigans talk.

And just because a few bottles will sell for high secondary prices, doesn't mean that a brewery would be able to move entire runs at that price.

For people who don't want to wait in lines, but are willing to pay higher prices, there is that option already.

 

[sacrelicio]

I'm pretty sure it's like a shitstorm, but with a less desired outcome.

Turd pellets

 

[lb304854]

Yeah all this talk about raising prices to combat demand ignores the fact that most of the people who line up in this hobby have more time than money and enjoy lining up, chasing, trading, etc. Also these guys tend to be younger men from fairly modest backgrounds who would be easily alienated by any business jacking up their prices.

I don't see the problem here.

Get some friends together and split a bottle on premise somewhere.

 

[sacrelicio]

I don't see the problem here.

Get some friends together and split a bottle on premise somewhere.

Sure, I like THAT idea but the idea of raising MSRP to double or triple what it is already probably isn't the best idea

 

[stxSS07]

Bros the solution is to advertise a .rar BA stout release and then cut down all the neckbeards in line with a hail of gunfire.

 

[SSTroller]

Guys, they did sparkle wax dip the bottles though.... Wax is #newmoney crack

Srs?
#whatthefuck

 

[Dunt1]

Bros the solution is to advertise a .rar BA stout release and then cut down all the neckbeards in line with a hail of gunfire.

Then all the .rarz is meinz??

 

[stxSS07]

Then all the .rarz is meinz??

Well not those specifically, but yah in theory you could totally buy moar.

 

[dvelcich1]

Why fight for increased prices? Because right now supply and demand are way out of balance and unless all these breweries are going to drastically increase supply (they won't, at least not quickly), then the equilibrium has to be achieved by reducing demand, which increased pricing will do. (Could maybe also say increased supply through more breweries offering quality offerings so people can't "catch them all," but at current pricing, people seem to gobble up everything available.)

I'm not saying that I would love increased pricing, just that it's the best option if you're going to do releases for off-premises without having all the truck chasers, mules, hoarders, etc etc. From there, putting out a $1000 bottle of wine as a comparison is silly. Wine has a centuries-long track record of being a luxury good, production is way more limited in ways that can't be altered, and the demand is much higher overall at this point. Also, everyday wines are already more expensive than beer. It'd be more reasonable at a point like this to expect prices to gradually double or maybe go higher, crowding out some. (I wouldn't expect prices to be anywhere near where they are on mybeercellar or were on eBay, as the demand at those prices is really low.) This means that most everyone can still afford a bottle or two, but most can't afford to chase after multiple cases and hire mules.

Another option is more breweries turning to on-premises only and keeping things around for longer, perhaps paired with bars that don't do to-go sales. I love this option. There's nothing like having a great beer at the place it was made, often times discussing with people who had a hand in making it.

I think this is more of an objective analysis of what creates less of a headache for everyone involved, specifically breweries, distributors, and retail establishments that are getting more and more tired of dealing with the **** shows that releases have become. Based on time, monetary constraints, and other variables, everyone is going to have different opinions as to what the best solution is, but individual viewpoints probably aren't the best way to determine what's best. To take your example, I would personally much rather pay $100 for one bottle of Proprietor's than $0 (and wasted time) for 0 bottles of Proprietor's.

Why does demand HAVE to equal supply? My wife and I were running a restaurant that was known for having really high quality food at a reasonable price. We started with 44 seats, but when the line started stretching out the door we increased our seating to 62. Our popularity was still increasing though, and within a few weeks the line was out the door again. We couldn't possible increase supply at that point, so what you're saying is the best thing for our customers would have been to raise the prices on our burgers so only the people who REALLY wanted them could get them? You know what, when I apply it to MY business, I'm starting to like the idea.

And my comparisons aren't silly. I'm just looking further into the future. If elitists feel that they deserve a beer more than someone else because they can afford to pay more for it and that mentality catches on, what's going to stop beer from becoming the luxury item that wine became?

I almost agree with your on-premise only thought, but my mind keeps going back to the point that draft is more suited for on-premise accounts. That's another thing I learned from the restaurant since we didn't have a draft system. Trying to get a good selection of bottled beer was like pulling teeth. You'll never get the stuff that's in high demand because you can never push as much of the year round stuff as ANY liquor store in the area.

I also understand your last part, but take the breweries out of that equation because they'd be really sad if the lines dried up. And honestly the retailers and distributors don't have much to bitch about either. It's cliche, but too much demand is not a bad problem to have. The only argument I agree with is that flippers are bad, but I don't think raising prices is the way to stop them. Has the high price of bourbon stopped people from flipping bottles? Your argument is like the war on drugs. It makes for great sound bites, but when you stop to think about it you'll see it won't solve the real problems.

And Gonzoillini, I'll argue with you later tonight.

 

[DanH11]

Why does demand HAVE to equal supply? My wife and I were running a restaurant that was known for having really high quality food at a reasonable price. We started with 44 seats, but when the line started stretching out the door we increased our seating to 62. Our popularity was still increasing though, and within a few weeks the line was out the door again. We couldn't possible increase supply at that point, so what you're saying is the best thing for our customers would have been to raise the prices on our burgers so only the people who REALLY wanted them could get them? You know what, when I apply it to MY business, I'm starting to like the idea.

And my comparisons aren't silly. I'm just looking further into the future. If elitists feel that they deserve a beer more than someone else because they can afford to pay more for it and that mentality catches on, what's going to stop beer from becoming the luxury item that wine became?

I almost agree with your on-premise only thought, but my mind keeps going back to the point that draft is more suited for on-premise accounts. That's another thing I learned from the restaurant since we didn't have a draft system. Trying to get a good selection of bottled beer was like pulling teeth. You'll never get the stuff that's in high demand because you can never push as much of the year round stuff as ANY liquor store in the area.

I also understand your last part, but take the breweries out of that equation because they'd be really sad if the lines dried up. And honestly the retailers and distributors don't have much to bitch about either. It's cliche, but too much demand is not a bad problem to have. The only argument I agree with is that flippers are bad, but I don't think raising prices is the way to stop them. Has the high price of bourbon stopped people from flipping bottles? Your argument is like the war on drugs. It makes for great sound bites, but when you stop to think about it you'll see it won't solve the real problems.

And Gonzoillini, I'll argue with you later tonight.

Flippers are a red herring. There has to be easily 10+ bottles that are cellared or posted for trade, or gotten for regular trading buddies for every bottle that's sold.

 

[jeblikesbeer]

Why does demand HAVE to equal supply? My wife and I were running a restaurant that was known for having really high quality food at a reasonable price. We started with 44 seats, but when the line started stretching out the door we increased our seating to 62. Our popularity was still increasing though, and within a few weeks the line was out the door again. We couldn't possible increase supply at that point, so what you're saying is the best thing for our customers would have been to raise the prices on our burgers so only the people who REALLY wanted them could get them? You know what, when I apply it to MY business, I'm starting to like the idea.

And my comparisons aren't silly. I'm just looking further into the future. If elitists feel that they deserve a beer more than someone else because they can afford to pay more for it and that mentality catches on, what's going to stop beer from becoming the luxury item that wine became?

I almost agree with your on-premise only thought, but my mind keeps going back to the point that draft is more suited for on-premise accounts. That's another thing I learned from the restaurant since we didn't have a draft system. Trying to get a good selection of bottled beer was like pulling teeth. You'll never get the stuff that's in high demand because you can never push as much of the year round stuff as ANY liquor store in the area.

I also understand your last part, but take the breweries out of that equation because they'd be really sad if the lines dried up. And honestly the retailers and distributors don't have much to bitch about either. It's cliche, but too much demand is not a bad problem to have. The only argument I agree with is that flippers are bad, but I don't think raising prices is the way to stop them. Has the high price of bourbon stopped people from flipping bottles? Your argument is like the war on drugs. It makes for great sound bites, but when you stop to think about it you'll see it won't solve the real problems.

And Gonzoillini, I'll argue with you later tonight.

this post reminded me of something thats no apt to make me angry in the land of beer... not that i'm back in FIBland I must plan the long hike out to try your burgerz!

EDIT:and I'm the moron who didnt realize... you're no longer open

 

[dvelcich1]

Flippers are a red herring. There has to be easily 10+ bottles that are cellared or posted for trade, or gotten for regular trading buddies for every bottle that's sold.

Didn't you hear? Everyone who brings out their wife to grab an extra bottle for themselves or a friend is now part of the problem. Cellaring, trading, even regular partners are starting to be discouraged.

this post reminded me of something thats no apt to make me angry in the land of beer... not that i'm back in FIBland I must plan the long hike out to try your burgerz!

EDIT:and I'm the moron who didnt realize... you're no longer open

 

[jeblikesbeer]

am much excite.

 

[Leafhouse]

Who wants to buddy up with me for the Double Deuce BIF?? It sounds like a blast!

 

[jeblikesbeer]

someone should... then we can haz a two team bang at beerfrat

 

[middlebrow]

am much excite.

How long am I gonna have to wait for a mizdow gif?

 

[jeblikesbeer]

How long am I gonna have to wait for a mizdow gif?

in response to one of your posts? say something witty, or let me come play beer with you guys or something and you're sure to achieve a mizdow

 

[daniel1]

18th Street releasing Hunter Coffee at 5:00. Line has probably started already.

 

[middlebrow]

in response to one of your posts? say something witty, or let me come play beer with you guys or something and you're sure to achieve a mizdow

I'm gonna be bottling some beer monday, you wanna come and stand behind me and do the motions? or i'm piloting some new farmhouse sunday, I can use a stand-in for the parts where I always get burned.

 

[Thorpe]

Why does demand HAVE to equal supply? My wife and I were running a restaurant that was known for having really high quality food at a reasonable price. We started with 44 seats, but when the line started stretching out the door we increased our seating to 62. Our popularity was still increasing though, and within a few weeks the line was out the door again. We couldn't possible increase supply at that point, so what you're saying is the best thing for our customers would have been to raise the prices on our burgers so only the people who REALLY wanted them could get them? You know what, when I apply it to MY business, I'm starting to like the idea.

And my comparisons aren't silly. I'm just looking further into the future. If elitists feel that they deserve a beer more than someone else because they can afford to pay more for it and that mentality catches on, what's going to stop beer from becoming the luxury item that wine became?

I almost agree with your on-premise only thought, but my mind keeps going back to the point that draft is more suited for on-premise accounts. That's another thing I learned from the restaurant since we didn't have a draft system. Trying to get a good selection of bottled beer was like pulling teeth. You'll never get the stuff that's in high demand because you can never push as much of the year round stuff as ANY liquor store in the area.

I also understand your last part, but take the breweries out of that equation because they'd be really sad if the lines dried up. And honestly the retailers and distributors don't have much to bitch about either. It's cliche, but too much demand is not a bad problem to have. The only argument I agree with is that flippers are bad, but I don't think raising prices is the way to stop them. Has the high price of bourbon stopped people from flipping bottles? Your argument is like the war on drugs. It makes for great sound bites, but when you stop to think about it you'll see it won't solve the real problems.

And Gonzoillini, I'll argue with you later tonight.

Demand certainly doesn't have to balance with supply, I'm giving solutions to evening the two out a bit. Also, not sure why everyone here is assuming prices would double or triple overnight. The example of North Coast was perfect. There are plenty of beers that are at the top of the market that sit for longer but also aren't THAT much more than others. Plus, sitting on shelves for even a bit of time helps halt the cycle. When something is around for even a week, it loses some of that luster and then might begin to sit even longer. Even a few days at this point would be an improvement.

And I'm not saying anyone in the beer industry has to do this. These are just what I see as the best solutions to fixing common problems. It's annoying to hear brewers/establishments complain about things when they're part of the problem.

In terms of people having more time than money making up most of the business, I guarantee there are plenty or people who have too little time who would be more than happy to buy up things like BCBS over a week from Binny's if given the opportunity.

Finally, those talking about eBay pricing are way off base. There, you are looking for a market of one. Here, we are taking about demand being at a 10+:1 ratio over supply, and giving solutions to get down to 5:1 or something more manageable.

Really, it'd be great to just see breweries trying different options to see what works, rather than all too often seeing "RARE X BEER ONLY X AVAILABLE!!!" and then complaining about issues those statements create.

In the end, I'm sure we will see all sorts of things in the coming years. We might see some "luxury" brands that price way above market and survive if quality dictates while there are also "every day" brands that are also successful.

Aside from this, I hope everyone is enjoying plenty of fine beers this holiday season

 

[jeblikesbeer]

I'm gonna be bottling some beer monday, you wanna come and stand behind me and do the motions? or i'm piloting some new farmhouse sunday, I can use a stand-in for the parts where I always get burned.

CORRECT MATCH... wrong gif...

 

[Leafhouse]

stuff

We're referencing prices doubling for BCBS because anything short of at least that much will very likely be ineffective. The allocations are so low that an extra $20 a bottle will hurt people but if they are already lining up at 5 AM for BCBS an extra $20 charge probably won't make them stay home so it doesn't really help much. You could price people out of buying cases of regular but variants would have to more than double in price to affect much change in demand.

I haven't heard of any breweries complaining. They make those statements to drive hype and huge lines because it is good publicity and good for business.

 

[LSMroz]

So, on vacation in FL for Christmas. Walk into ABC liquors and see 5 cases of BCBS on the floor for $22.99/4-pack. Chicago #newmoney is officially the wurst! Oh and screw Binny's and their $28 pricing.