Ok so i brewed up my first stout on Friday, using wlp013 (london ale yeast) and for the first 2 days it bubbled like crazy, really slowed down by monday morning, came home wasn't bubbling at all. Took a sample and gravity seems to be ~1.015. OG was 1.065. So is it possible its done already? I figured it was going to take way longer being as its a stout, but apparently not. I'll check over the next few days to see if there's a change in the gravity but it seems like its done. I was going to leave it in the primary for 2 weeks and then secondary for 2 weeks. Will it be alright just 1 week in the primary then 2 in the secondary?
Fermented out in 3 days, wow!
- Thread starter xjncoguyx
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motobrewer
I'm no atheist scientist, but...
i could be done already, but it'd still give it at least 2 weeks in the primary to clean up.
2.5 gallons probably explains it.
2.5 gallons probably explains it.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
Clean up as in clarify? Its a stout, and i am doing a 2 week secondary anyway.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
Yeah i picked up a 3 gallon better bottle for experimental batches. This one is a chocolate stout that im splitting into 2 (1) gallon secondary fermenters and putting cocoa nibs in one, and cocoa nibs, vanilla, and bourbon soaked oak chips in the other.
motobrewer
I'm no atheist scientist, but...
clean up as in the yeast will clean up byproducts of fermentation.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
You think it really needs another 10 days for that?
It sure doesn't hurt. The general consensus is not to be in any hurry to rack to a secondary. I only use a secondary carboy when I have lots of crap to get out of my beer (huge trub, dry hops, etc.).
motobrewer
I'm no atheist scientist, but...
why would I say it?
homebrewer_99
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I've made several "Speed Brews" that ferment out in 2-3 days.
Trust me...if you don't let the yeast clean up after itself your brew will turn and taste like buttered popcorn...aka diacetyl.
Don't rack yet.
Trust me...if you don't let the yeast clean up after itself your brew will turn and taste like buttered popcorn...aka diacetyl.
Don't rack yet.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
I mean thats fine im just trying to get an understanding for why the extra time, and whether or not its necessary after a particular amount of time. As in, is it going to do anything if i let the beer sit for 5 more days after fermentation is done vs. letting it sit 15 days? If so, what are the differences, just so maybe i can use this information for another possible batch. And im mostly using the secondary for flavoring/aging.
Yeah thats what i assumed, was just trying to get more info in to rather than just, yeah don't do it yet. I am in no hurry to rack this bad boy over, considering its the middle of the summer, and having a bunch of chocolate stout around right now isn't going to do me any good. I was more so just trying to gauge a timeframe the process after fermentation is finished. Thank you sir. :rockin:I've made several "Speed Brews" that ferment out in 2-3 days.
Trust me...if you don't let the yeast clean up after itself your brew will turn and taste like buttered popcorn...aka diacetyl.
Don't rack yet.
smizak
Well-Known Member
Two weeks is a guideline for new brewers who have never seen a fermentation and don't really understand them either.
When the yeast starts to flocculate, and you've got a reasonable hydrometer reading, it's done. They're not doing anything on the bottom.
When the yeast starts to flocculate, and you've got a reasonable hydrometer reading, it's done. They're not doing anything on the bottom.
broadbill
Well-Known Member
If you are looking for a reason why you should let it sit for another 10 days, then you should taste it. That will tell you that its not ready yet...
As for gauging a time-frame, I usually figure about a month of fermentation time between brewing and kegging/bottling.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
Ok so now im confused. What you're saying completely contradicts what the others said. The yeast has flocculated out, and the refractometer reading is showing the beer where its supposed to finish up at. I was going to leave it sit in there for a total of 10 days just to be safe anyway.
motobrewer
I'm no atheist scientist, but...
yeast that have flucc'd are "done"?
then why lager?
then why lager?
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
I guess that would depend on the style as well. I've had wheat beers done in 3 weeks, threw em in the keg and they were fantastic.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
Yeah i was under the assumption they're still working.
As I understand, a refractometer does not work on (fermented) beer...only on unfermented wort. You still need a hydrometer to determine final gravity.
I have learned over the last year and a half that leaving beer in primary will not hurt in any way. As others have said, leaving the beer on the yeast gives it time to "clean up" any fermentation by-products. It will help to alleviate some of the offf-flavors that might be present. This has made a great improvement in my beers.
My current regimen is three weeks in primary, then keg condition for three weeks, then serve.
motobrewer
I'm no atheist scientist, but...
there's a conversion you can use to get true FG from a refractometer.
but you're correct. the reading of the refract. will be off for FG. alcohol, all that...
but you're correct. the reading of the refract. will be off for FG. alcohol, all that...
v2comp
Well-Known Member
Thhe yeast that has flocculated out is done, but the yeast still in suspension (and unless you crash cooled it, there is yeast still in suspension) is still doing its job.
the 2.5 gallons has more to do with the quick fermentation times I would guess, as there is less water for the sugar molecules to be spread over and it takes less time for the yeast to do its job.
this really should be a lesson in yeast pitching rates as well, most homebrewers dont really pitch enough yeast, and their fermentation times reflect it in most cases.
think about it like this, if you pitch a 1/2 teaspoon of dry US-05 into 5 gallons of 1.065 wort, it will ferment, and it will most likely completely attenuate eventually.
long story short, you can get most beers to ferment out very quickly given the proper yeast pitch and temperature profile. just give it a try and see if im as full of it as you think I sound....LOL
the 2.5 gallons has more to do with the quick fermentation times I would guess, as there is less water for the sugar molecules to be spread over and it takes less time for the yeast to do its job.
this really should be a lesson in yeast pitching rates as well, most homebrewers dont really pitch enough yeast, and their fermentation times reflect it in most cases.
think about it like this, if you pitch a 1/2 teaspoon of dry US-05 into 5 gallons of 1.065 wort, it will ferment, and it will most likely completely attenuate eventually.
long story short, you can get most beers to ferment out very quickly given the proper yeast pitch and temperature profile. just give it a try and see if im as full of it as you think I sound....LOL
motobrewer
I'm no atheist scientist, but...
i think someone on this forum did an experiment like that.
he made three 2.5 gallon worts or something like that. underpitched, normal pitched, and overpitched. i forget the results, lol.
he made three 2.5 gallon worts or something like that. underpitched, normal pitched, and overpitched. i forget the results, lol.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
You misunderstand then. There is a conversion to get your FG from a refractometer. I heard it can sometimes be off a point or two, but every time i've verified with a hydrometer the readings are exactly the same. There's actually a conversion tool in beersmith that will do this for you.
I have had several 1.045-1.055 beers finish out in around 3 days with London Ale yeasts, Nottingham and London Ale III both have chewed up to <1.010 in that timeframe, so it's certainly within reason...
midfielder5
Well-Known Member
personally, i am "over" the wow! factor in short ferments.
Hmm, I do like to watch the yeast-action in my glass starters-- so to each their own!
how does it TASTE ?
-wendy
Hmm, I do like to watch the yeast-action in my glass starters-- so to each their own!
how does it TASTE ?
-wendy
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
Yeah i was very weary about the conversion method because some said it was inaccurate up to a couple of points. But every time i've done it, i've taken a hydrometer measurement and its been exactly the same.
Thats what i was hoping to see, if anyone had gotten these kind of numbers with that yeast strain. It was my first beer that didn't get a big krausen. Kinda looked like a swamp.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
I haven't tasted it yet, because i want to make sure its done. I took a reading yesterday so i'll see today and tomorrow if there's any change. If not, then i'll take a taste, maybe let it sit until next week, so i have time to soak the oak chips in bourbon.personally, i am "over" the wow! factor in short ferments.
Hmm, I do like to watch the yeast-action in my glass starters-- so to each their own!
how does it TASTE ?
-wendy
Also has anyone worked with vanilla beans before? Im weary of sticking an entire vanilla bean in 1 gallon, i almost feel like that would be way too much and would overpower the beer.
I got a pretty hefty krausen on Notty (Danstar Dry) yeast but the Wyeast London Ale III is more along the lines of what you note... Swamp Monster Krausen... Good idea for beer name... working on Jethro Tull lyrics down to the bog to warm my feet... hmmmmmmm.
Pretty sure that would be WAY overkill, but have a look around and search the forums. I recall reading quite a few warnings about overdoing the vanilla when using whole beans.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
Yeah i kinda figured that, vanilla is a really strong flavor, even in small amounts. I kinda wanted to use vanilla bean, but maybe i'll have to settle on extract.
permo
Well-Known Member
I would leave a beer of the gravity in primary for more than three weeks, then go sraight to the keg or bottle. My better beers are the ones I have let sit undisturbed, in primary for a very long time.......I'm just sayin.
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
Yes but i have to have a secondary for this batch. And if you leave it in the primary too long isn't there a chance of yeast autolysis. I don't think not disturbing a beer is what is going to make it better. Aging obviously will make it better. But sitting on the same yeast over time gives risk to off flavors.
There is no one-sized fits all fermentation rule, IMO.
v2comp
Well-Known Member
I did a vanilla / chocolate porter last year, and I split open the vanilla bean and scraped the insides into a small bowl and mixed it with 2 teaspoons of vodka. that was for 5 gallons and it was plenty. (as an aside, a little really goes a long way, and if you get it wrong, it tastes terrible and overpowering)
midfielder5
Well-Known Member
Cue Revvy in 5, 4, 3, 2...
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xjncoguyx
Well-Known Member
Yeah exactly what im trying to avoid. I figure i can add a little at a time but i can't subtract it, so im gonna start with a really small dose of vanilla, and add more if needed.
I dunno what this means.
smizak
Well-Known Member
Contrary to what most will tell you, even in a lager, primary fermentation is done within two weeks. The yeast have finished off the sugar and their by-products.
Lagering is simply for clearing. It helps at cold temps to drop the yeast and proteins out completely. I have had lagers that were bottled after two weeks and spent about a month in the refrigerator, and I would defy anyone who tasted it to tell me it wasn't bulk cold-conditioned.
Even my ales aren't really clear and perfectly carbed unless they've had at least a week in the fridge, most two.
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