Ever have a credit card number stolen???

[riverfrontbrewer]

Hello all-

Despite the condescending tone of our moderator, the response from forrest that sounded like it was written by a PR firm, and all of you that love to bash those of us that want real, actual answers, I am here to post one more time some facts that have STILL not been addressed.

-The fact that well before the "3rd party forensic team" has been able to complete it's work (or was even hired), AHS had already place the blame and changed providers. How did they know to do this if the "3rd party forensic team" was still hard at work?

-The fact that the easiest access point into any system would be a personal computer used to store CC#'s....it has been asked directly several times if they store our CC#'s and we have been told "no" or the question has been danced around. The following is a quote that I took out of an email from AHS...it was received Friday 2/11/11.

"Our computers used to only store credit card information for 1-1.5 weeks after an order was place but we are now deleting this information as soon as we ring up an order. By next Wednesday we will have switched to our new system and will no longer have access to any of our customers credit card information."

Why can't we get a straight answer from the management team? Very telling.

If you all want to bash and flame, bring it on, I don't care at this point. All I really wanted from the beginning was some honest answers. It's a bad situation for all involved, but I believe made worse, by the CYA mentality of management. This was my first and last order from AHS, but I am sure that in a few weeks those of you that want to will just forget this little incident and move on. And those of us that like to deal with people with integrity, will do the same.

Respectfully, riverfrontbrewer

 

[r8rphan]

I'm not bashing and flaming.... Nor should I be.. This is a highly personal decision for each person on how they want to react to all of this... There is no 'wrong response' (short of intentionally malicious lies and/or violence)... After all, we're talking 'money' here... It don't get more personal than that...

 

[Sacdan]

29% of all credit card holders have been a victim of credit card fraud in the last 5 years.

Perhaps 0.1% have had the opportunity to get information about it in a forum with a vendor and other affected individuals in near realtime.

I am a mod here, but I have no financial stake in this site. I've gotten no instruction from anyone as to how to respond. Not from the admin. Not from ahs. (Never do. Never was.) You can count my ahs orders on one hand. People with torches will believe what they want though.

I just can't believe that any of you think that Forrest is manipulating the info here. There are at least 100 people here picking apart every word in this thread.

I happen to think he shares too much with you all. Just about every thread I see where he is being earnest and forthright, 3 people chime on with their free business advice.

Go ahead and tell me about some other vendor that puts up with this **** in a more graceful and open way....

On a final note. If this hobby puts you at any risk in any part of your life, it might be time to recalibrate your priorities.

I would sure like to now where you get your "facts" from 29% and .1%? Seems like a lot of speculation. I highly doubt that. As far as Forest, he sure waited a LONG time before sending any emails out. This was handled in an extremely unprofessional matter. The simple fact is that his company was compromised. Period. I am a Network Engineer. Many of customers would be out of business if they were compromised. Take a look aroud. There ARE a hundred people picking him apart, with good reason.

 

[Austinhomebrew]

If that's enough for you, congratulations. All I recall Forrest commenting on was how he and others were looking externally. Others keep bringing up convoluted scenarios and ignore the simple methods. Most likely it was an unscrupulous employee with access to the account numbers.

"Just sayin"

It was not an inside job by an employee. We know that much. We are trying to find the root source which came from outside Austin Homebrew Supply.

Forrest

 

[knotquiteawake]

-The fact that the easiest access point into any system would be a personal computer used to store CC#'s....it has been asked directly several times if they store our CC#'s and we have been told "no" or the question has been danced around. The following is a quote that I took out of an email from AHS...it was received Friday 2/11/11.

"Our computers used to only store credit card information for 1-1.5 weeks after an order was place but we are now deleting this information as soon as we ring up an order. By next Wednesday we will have switched to our new system and will no longer have access to any of our customers credit card information."

Why can't we get a straight answer from the management team? Very telling.

This sounds like the most detailed answer we've seen so far.

this does not imply an inside job, outside hands can reach inside.

 

[TheBrewinator]

DaBiggin, I was not trying to be smart, I was just trying to point out the information you were asking for is what I would consider some pretty serious information that could be used against a business. I ordered on 2-9-11 and my charge went through on 2-11-11, it was manual entry per the slip that came with my perlicks and shanks (so that answers that inquiry you had). I have an interest in this too, I was not saying that just to be an ass, I just wanted to point out the information you want may be what is considered sensitive.

 

[bob1852]

There ARE a hundred people picking him apart, with good reason.

Are the "hundred" people ready to apologize if it turns out AHS is not at fault and it was a 3rd party breech?

I know I'm ready to apologize if it turns out AHS is at fault; but again, arm-chair QB speculation isn't helping anything....

 

[bob1852]

I would sure like to now where you get your "facts" from 29%

ollllo posted more "facts" than anyone else that's suspecting an inside job, or any of the other arm-chair QB'ing going on in this thread....

http://financial.tmcnet.com/topics/...e-survey-finds-increase-credit-card-fraud.htm

 

[riverfrontbrewer]

Are the "hundred" people ready to apologize if it turns out AHS is not at fault and it was a 3rd party breech?

I know I'm ready to apologize if it turns out AHS is at fault; but again, arm-chair QB speculation isn't helping anything....

First, I never said that AHS was at fault, so no, I will not apologize either way...as a customer, I just want to be treated with respect and valued as a customer. That ship has already sailed.

 

[riverfrontbrewer]

ollllo posted more "facts" than anyone else that's suspecting an inside job, or any of the other arm-chair QB'ing going on in this thread....

http://financial.tmcnet.com/topics/...e-survey-finds-increase-credit-card-fraud.htm

Wow, people from 14 countries order from a texas HB store? So the CC fraud rate in the eastern block has an effect on this situation?

 

[bob1852]

First, I never said that AHS was at fault, so no, I will not apologize either way...as a customer, I just want to be treated with respect and valued as a customer. That ship has already sailed.

I wasn't referring to you river....

You have aired legitimate grievances that have not been answered. So, I agree with you on that...

My point is that the speculation going on is not helping anything.

 

[DaBiggin]

It was not an inside job by an employee. We know that much. We are trying to find the root source which came from outside Austin Homebrew Supply.

Forrest

Forrest, thank you for your response. Can you tell us how you know with certainty that it was not an employee? I have an email from AHS, I don't know if it was you, saying that you were hiring new employees during the same timeframe. To me it seems the most likely weak link in the chain.

 

[bob1852]

Wow, people from 14 countries order from a texas HB store? So the CC fraud rate in the eastern block has an effect on this situation?

Considering how many CC#'s are stolen and sold to places around the globe; yes.

 

[DaBiggin]

I wasn't referring to you river....

You have aired legitimate grievances that have not been answered. So, I agree with you on that...

My point is that the speculation going on is not helping anything.

Look. I've been following this thread since I was first told about it last week and found my account had been compromised. If there is any speculation it occurs on both sides. My opinion is that those in the same camp as me, are only asking for answers from AHS and assurances that our account numbers are being handled with all due care.

 

[bob1852]

Look. I've been following this thread since I was first told about it last week and found my account had been compromised. If there is any speculation it occurs on both sides. My opinion is that those in the same camp as me, are only asking for answers from AHS and assurances that our account numbers are being handled with all due care.

I agree and for the record, I e-mailed AHS on 2/7 at 8:23pm to give them a heads up that there was a likely "hack" somewhere in this system...

I think we all have the same bottom line - AHS' on-line ordering system was somehow comprimised in January, and we want it addressed and fixed in a manner that we trust to believe the situation has been taken care of. Right?

 

[Sacdan]

Are the "hundred" people ready to apologize if it turns out AHS is not at fault and it was a 3rd party breech?

I know I'm ready to apologize if it turns out AHS is at fault; but again, arm-chair QB speculation isn't helping anything....

Hell no! It IS his fault whether it was an employee or his "3rd party" processor. He is still culpable. There is NO speculation. His company IS at fault for the credit card fraud. He didn't address this fast enough and is too quick to push off blame. I am assuming that you didn't get compromised. Perhaps if you did, you would be singing a differnt song! Once agian there are too many people who want to defend him. Enjoy the Lovefest. I don't care how long he has been a vendor. Until he gets his act together I think no one should do business with him.

 

[DaBiggin]

I agree and for the record, I e-mailed AHS on 2/7 at 8:23pm to give them a heads up that there was a likely "hack" somewhere in this system...

I think we all have the same bottom line - AHS' on-line ordering system was somehow comprimised in January, and we want it addressed and fixed in a manner that we trust to believe the situation has been taken care of. Right?

I mean this with respect. Amen brother.

 

[rawlus]

what a weird direction this thread has gone in. the more info we get from AHS, the more people question it. hilarious.

 

[Austinhomebrew]

Forrest, thank you for your response. Can you tell us how you know with certainty that it was not an employee? I have an email from AHS, I don't know if it was you, saying that you were hiring new employees during the same timeframe. To me it seems the most likely weak link in the chain.

I will post more info as I get it. So far, we know this was an outside job so, I am treating it as such. I have changed credit card processors. I have increased our verisign ecryption to the same type of security Amazon and Paypal have. When you check out the url bar turns green = Extended Validation SSL Certificate. I don't know of another homebrew store that has this.

I am doing everything I can to make everything more secure.

Forrest

 

[DaBiggin]

My account has been closed and I am out no $. However; the same cannot be said for any merchant that has had one of these purloined accounts used to purchase goods or services and are now forced to pay chargebacks, associated fees, and in addition incurred lost products.

 

[bob1852]

Hell no! It IS his fault whether it was an employee or his "3rd party" processor. He is still culpable.

So if you crash your Ford truck into a tree, it's Ford's fault?

There is NO speculation. His company IS at fault for the credit card fraud. He didn't address this fast enough and is too quick to push off blame.

Again, I e-mailed them on the evening of 2/7 and heard back right away saying they were concerned and were looking into it.

I am assuming that you didn't get compromised. Perhaps if you did, you would be singing a differnt song!

Nope. My bank kicks ass.

Once agian there are too many people who want to defend him. Enjoy the Lovefest. I don't care how long he has been a vendor.

Fair enough.....

I'll continue to enjoy my free shipping on $100+ orders, great service, and excellent products.

Until he gets his act together I think no one should do business with him.

That's your choice....but I'll still choose to do business with AHS.

 

[r8rphan]

Thanks Forrest.. I am starting to feel confident that this is being addressed properly...

BTW, did you read my OT post (#745)?

That would make my brewing life a lot easier...

 

[DaBiggin]

I will post more info as I get it. So far, we know this was an outside job so, I am treating it as such. I have changed credit card processors. I have increased our verisign ecryption to the same type of security Amazon and Paypal have. When you check out the url bar turns green = Extended Validation SSL Certificate. I don't know of another homebrew store that has this.

I am doing everything I can to make everything more secure.

Forrest

Thanks again Forrest. I think my points have been made and I will leave it at that. Best wishes to you!

 

[jonk]

Not sure how I missed this thread.

Add me to the list of victims.

 

[riverfrontbrewer]

what a weird direction this thread has gone in. the more info we get from AHS, the more people question it. hilarious.

What more or new info have you heard? I have seen the status quo.

 

[r8rphan]

Hell no! It IS his fault whether it was an employee or his "3rd party" processor. He is still culpable.

I think you don't know the difference between the terms "fault" and "responsibility"...

There is NO speculation. His company IS at fault for the credit card fraud.

Obviously, you have access to information that the rest of us do not.. possibly even Forrest doesn't.. Care to spill the beans as to how you can make this statement with such certainty and authority?

Ultimately, AHS will share in the 'responsibility' (read cost) regardless of who is at 'fault'.. But that should not be confused with being at 'fault'.. By assigning 'fault' you are declaring that he did something wrong that directly caused the problem..

You can not possibly 'know' that!

"FAULT" lies directly at the feet of the low life ******* criminal(s) who stole the money...

 

[riverfrontbrewer]

Again forrest, since you are currently following this thread, please address this, from YOUR store. Not sure why you keep skirting a simple yes or no questions? Is the below true or not?

"Our computers used to only store credit card information for 1-1.5 weeks after an order was place but we are now deleting this information as soon as we ring up an order. By next Wednesday we will have switched to our new system and will no longer have access to any of our customers credit card information."

 

[rawlus]

where did that quote come from? if it came from forrest, why would you assume it needs to be validated as truthful? if you dont assume his statements are truthful, then him saying its truthful means nothing. dont you get that?

what is with all the picking apart every nuance of every statement looking for the red herring or the hidden meanings?

picking at scabs. crazy stuff.

 

[remilard]

where did that quote come from? if it came from forrest, why would you assume it needs to be validated as truthful? if you dont assume his statements are truthful, then him saying its truthful means nothing. dont you get that?

what is with all the picking apart every nuance of every statement looking for the red herring or the hidden meanings?

picking at scabs. crazy stuff.

Well, he made a mutually exclusive statement earlier in this thread so if that quote is from Forrest, I guess one of them is not true.

 

[DaBiggin]

where did that quote come from? if it came from forrest, why would you assume it needs to be validated as truthful? if you dont assume his statements are truthful, then him saying its truthful means nothing. dont you get that?

what is with all the picking apart every nuance of every statement looking for the red herring or the hidden meanings?

picking at scabs. crazy stuff.

Why do you care so much? Quit beating on him for asking for answers to his questions. What's it to you? The email could have come from an employees for all we know. Do you know who sent the email to him?