Equipment costs, and should I take a class?

[thistleglassgirl]

My husband and I want to expand into all-grain brewing. Our local brew shop guy said it's probably a good idea to take the class they offer, which is $20 a person. I think they are very knowledgeable, and could be fun, but is it worth it to spend $40, or is it simple enough to learn the method by ourselves?

Also, how much would you say we'd have to spend on the additional equipment needed for all-grain? We have everything for extract brewing already.

Thanks!

 

[JoeyChopps]

I leaned everything I know about all grain from hbt and google. So IMO paying some one 40 for a few hour class vs months of research and learning as I go to me is a no brainier.

Equipment cost is going to flux by a large portion. You can go with a cooler mash tube and a ss tube for about 50 ish and together a keggle for somewhere around 100. Or you could go full on blinkman stuff and spend a grand. Hope this helps a little. Start looking up batch sparging all grain and equipment options on god google I bet you will agree you don't need classes. Also watch YouTube videos of people all grain brewing and you be good to go.

 

[dstranger99]

Youtube video's showed me alot as well, there are quite a few AG vids on it.

 

[brew_ny]

for the 40 dollars are they letting you brew ? if so and you get the beer it would be worth it

sure you can learn it on your own, just read what other do here and what works for them

then give it a try to find out what works for you in your setup

I have not brewed long started July 11 this year with a 15 minute boil recipe from the database here all extract

it came out great last Thursday I did my first all grain 11.5 gallon batch of a pale ale, which is my fifth batch

I did two extract batches, two partial mash batches and will be doing my sixth batch tomorrow for sixty gallons since July

the beer has been good the forum here is a great resource with lots and lots of knowledge

I am using the same equipment I started with but I bought a 15.5 gallon pot with a ball valve at the start and a freezer which I added STC 1000 to control it

if I can do it I am sure you all can

all the best with your brewing

S_M

 

[Bithead]

I learned AG by reading, mostly here but other resources also. I kept costs low using:
$20, 48 Qt cooler with CPVC manifold (only a couple bucks) and brass valve that I pickled.
$40 Craigslist 15 gallon aluminum pot with burner for my kettle.
$40 Craigslist 6.5 gal cheap SS turkey fryer for my HLT.
I use my Blacker and Decker Workmate bench for the HLT and cooler.

I had been doing my mash in the kitchen using a 3.5 gal pot and 2.5 gal pot on the stove to heat water. Worked fine until I moved outside this summer with the HLT and the Workmate.

 

[CA_Mouse]

I agree, paying someone to teach you how to use their system that they want you to buy isn't a great expense. Unless you are going to buy the system they sell. Watch videos, listen to podcasts and buy one of the books on home brewing, your learning curve will be better rounded.

As for going to all grain from extract, you can start easily by getting the kettle first and doing BIAB. This will teach you about temperature control of the mash without the huge expense of a full all grain setup. Then you can decide how big of a system you want to go with (i.e. heated MT, BK & HLT, 10 gallon round cooler, 15 gallon rectangular cooler, etc). I started with extract and moved to partial mash (very small scale all grain with extract), this taught me what I needed to know and allowed me to buy my equipment as I learned the new process. If you are just looking to jump into all grain expect to spend about $200 minimum.

 

[feinbera]

Partial-mash brewing (and way too much time on this website) made the transition for me. Doing a proper mash (not just a steep) of specialty grains and a couple pounds of two-row let me "get the feel" of all-grain at a smaller, easier-to-work-with volume, and still getting most of my fermentables from extract was a great safety net, in that I could relax and not spend too much time stressing about getting everything perfect, because I'd still get some kinda beer at the end, even if the mash completely failed.

The only thing I'd do differently is get 10-gallon equipment right off the bat. It was easy to convince myself I could save $20 here and $30 there on a five-gallon cooler and a six-gallon pot, but I was wrong, you can't do moderate-gravity all-grain on that equipment without making a huge mess of everything.

 

[sundaypapers]

I took an all grain class at Austin home brew and I think it was twenty bucks. If I had to do it again I would, just because I learned a lot actually seeing it and being there to ask little questions along the way. Plus we got to kill five gallons of beer at the end and I met lots or really cool people. Do you need to do it? Not really. It's only 20 bucks though, so I'd say do it.
As far as expenses, I use a ten gallon igloo cooler with a ball valve and a large grain bag instead if a braid or false bottom, works well for me. Get on Craigslist and see if there's stuff on there for cheap. I would say to hold out for a deal if you can, you will save a ton. If you can't wait then just go for it and buy what you need a little at a time if money is tight. Like right now I only do 3 gallon batches, I have a keggle, but no burner yet or valve for it, so I'm fine doing smaller batches in the meantime and work on saving up. As far as processes go, I have found it to be as easy as extract but a little more time consuming, but if you enjoy doing it, that's not a problem.

 

[JDGator]

i think any education you can get is a bonus and for $40 i would take the lesson. reading books and watching video's are great, but i learn better doing it.

as for price for gear, you can spend a $50 to thousands. just depends on how and with what you want to brew.

 

[LandoLincoln]

It depends on what type of learner you are. Some people learn better by reading, or watching videos on their own time, others by interacting with people and asking questions.

Personally, I could have saved myself some grain/hops/yeast/water/propane/time if I had gone and taken one of these classes. I'd say it's worth the $40.

 

[Milan37]

You can go from extract to all-grain for the cost of a fine mesh voile bag. No additional equipment is needed, and if you're the least bit handy you can buy the material and sew one yourself. If you are limited by pot size, you can mash with a portion of your volume then sparge to full volume. Lots of information here on how to do that. Then if you decide you want larger batches or a different approach you can evaluate your equipment needs based on your experience and the compromises you are willing to make. I don't mind dealing with a grain bag at all so the advantages of BIAB are worth it to me.

Again--for me, I don't have any desire at present to do larger than 5.5-gallon batches of relatively low gravity beer so my 11-gallon pot does it all. There is absolutely no requirement to invest large sums of money to make all-grain beer, and you will not be compromising efficiency or quality. It's a great way to start and you may find that it serves you perfectly well for a lifetime.

 

[TheZymurgist]

You can go from extract to all-grain for the cost of a fine mesh voile bag. No additional equipment is needed, and if you're the least bit handy you can buy the material and sew one yourself. If you are limited by pot size, you can mash with a portion of your volume then sparge to full volume. Lots of information here on how to do that. Then if you decide you want larger batches or a different approach you can evaluate your equipment needs based on your experience and the compromises you are willing to make. I don't mind dealing with a grain bag at all so the advantages of BIAB are worth it to me.

Again--for me, I don't have any desire at present to do larger than 5.5-gallon batches of relatively low gravity beer so my 11-gallon pot does it all. There is absolutely no requirement to invest large sums of money to make all-grain beer, and you will not be compromising efficiency or quality. It's a great way to start and you may find that it serves you perfectly well for a lifetime.

^This. If you're cost sensitive, then you already have the equipment you need to go all-grain. For me, I decided to do the 10 gallon cooler with a false bottom, so I put in about $100 to transfer. I think I already owned a turkey fryer and burner, so you'll have to factor that in as well. Personally, I liked the ease of cooler mashing, versus BIAB, as it's easier (for me) to hit and maintain mash temps without having to play with a stove burner.

I think taking the class would be fun, but I learned everything I needed by purchasing 'How to Brew.' You don't even need to read the entire book, just the part that walks you through the process. It's a good starting point, then you're able to learn other methods on this site that you may prefer.

 

[eltorrente]

I think you should do it - it's worth it.

My old roommate and I took a class in San Diego (Solana Beach) when we switched over to all-grain. It was very useful to be able to ask questions and just see everything in person. This was long before youtube and homebrew forums (around 1995).

We learned from the same guy who had also taught us how to extract brew, and to formulate recipes. We learned in the back of the store, and there were giant fermenters back there - since he was in the early stages of starting a new brewery. He really knew what he was doing, and gave us great advice. He kept things simple, and showed us how to just not worry about it, and the process was smooth and easy.

The brewery he started with a buddy of his was Ballast Point brewery, and they are now an award winning brewery. His name is Yusef Cherney, and I was lucky to have learned from him. It's always useful to see it in person when you first start.

Sure, you could learn from forums and youtube, but for only 20 bucks a person, it's a great deal to be able to see it in person and be able to ask questions on the spot.

 

[BrewKnurd]

As has been mentioned, it depends on how you learn best. If you learn better from demonstration than from reading, a $20 class could be well worth it. Another option to keep in mind, though, is the possibility of learning from folks in a local homebrew club. If you do have a local club (which I assume you do since there's an HBS), I'm pretty sure if you check with those guys someone will be brewing in the very near future and will be happy to have you come see their process.

Now, there's nothing to say you won't end up observing a homebrewer with horrible processes, but there's also no assurance that wouldn't be the case at the HBS class as well.

 

[kombat]

I would say definitely do it. Think of it as a date - it's less than you'd spend on a nice dinner out. While you can certainly get all the info you'd need from books and HBT, there's a lot to be said for actually SEEING someone do it in front of you. All the little nuances become clear, not to mention the opportunity to ask questions along the way.

$40 is a pittance for that kind of education, in my opinion.

 

[MindenMan]

I started with a brew kit for a gift that came with a 24 qt kettle.(My Wife I love her!) Anyway, I did a lot of batches with low efficiency, but at the time I didn't know how low they were because I did not have a hydrometer then. I made a mash/lauter tun out of two 5 gallon buckets. Google Zapap.
Any food grade bucket will work, like the ones they sell a Home Depot. $5.00. You need 2- 5 gallon buckets, a drill, a drill bit, a little time, a spigot and 1 lid. As far as a strainer goes, you could use a grain bag, or a piece of fine mesh screen.

I wish the brewing classes here were $20.00 a head, they are at least $40.00, but a nice dinner is served. Looking back it would have been cheaper to go to a class than having to drink bad home made beer. I also say "Go!"

 

[Teromous]

Ask locally. Odds are that you can find somebody to teach you and that $40 can be spent on some craft beer and pizzas for you all. Or if you have a local homebrew club then that $40 can be spent on dues and the club can teach you.

Worst case scenario you are stuck learning it online for free from all of us...

 

[ronjonacron]

Ask locally. Odds are that you can find somebody to teach you and that $40 can be spent on some craft beer and pizzas for you all. Or if you have a local homebrew club then that $40 can be spent on dues and the club can teach you.

Worst case scenario you are stuck learning it online for free from all of us...

This is a great way to make a couple friends and have potential bottle swappers and stuff too. Bring over some craft brews and hang out for a morning or afternoon. Again, the class wouldnt hurt, if theyre running a hbs i can only assume they at least have am idea of what they are doing.

Criagslist is your friend for.help fimdimg deals. Post up what equipment you already have and maybe we can help point you to the most beneficial / necessary upgrades.

 

[MindenMan]

I will say, the quality of the beer I produce is directly attributed to this website. That's good. I am more of a hands on learner, and I didn't have any hands to follow when I started making beer. I will say I was reluctant to do anything but a extract recipe, because there was just o much that could go wrong, I thought, and it really was easier to do it as I understood at the time. If nothing else, get in contact with the local home brewers club as ask for help. All most all clubs have more than a couple guys, that are willing not only to get you going, but to help you hands on. Like ronjonacron commented, ask around, bring some craft beers with you, and hang out.