English Ales - What's your favorite recipe?

[Puddlethumper]

Careful with Bramling. I used it for the first time, I found it to overwhelm the malt bill. So, it could just be I overdid it...but who knows??? I know its used a lot in the English styles, so I am sure it can work...just don't know the right ratios yet.

You are correct in advising caution with Bramling Cross. And you aren't alone in experiencing an over-the-top spiciness that Bramling can bring if used early in the boil. We find ourselves in serious trouble if we try to use Bramling as we would any other aroma/flavor variety.

Properly used, though, Bramling can bring some wonderful flavors to the party. My favorite porter calls for 1/2 oz. steeped 30 minutes post-boil. This is followed by a dry-hop of 1/2 oz Fuggles at 5 days. Wonderful beer and the Bramling Cross brings a nice black currant note to the finish.

I would not suggest its use in anything but small amounts in late additions.

Cheers!

 

[coyote68]

You are correct in advising caution with Bramling Cross. And you aren't alone in experiencing an over-the-top spiciness that Bramling can bring if used early in the boil. We find ourselves in serious trouble if we try to use Bramling as we would any other aroma/flavor variety.

Properly used, though, Bramling can bring some wonderful flavors to the party. My favorite porter calls for 1/2 oz. steeped 30 minutes post-boil. This is followed by a dry-hop of 1/2 oz Fuggles at 5 days. Wonderful beer and the Bramling Cross brings a nice black currant note to the finish.

I would not suggest its use in anything but small amounts in late additions.

Cheers!

while brambling cross can be very assertive it does make an awesome smash beer. i keep one on tap at all times.

7 lbs marris otter
.5 oz brambling cross 60 min.
.25 oz brambling cross 20 min.
.25 oz brambling cross 2 min.

mash @ 154 F/ 60 min.

the most common response i get is. " what kind of berries did you use?"

 

[BrewinBromanite]

Billie Klub's punch-berries, of course!


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[Puddlethumper]

while brambling cross can be very assertive it does make an awesome smash beer. i keep one on tap at all times.

7 lbs marris otter
.5 oz brambling cross 60 min.
.25 oz brambling cross 20 min.
.25 oz brambling cross 2 min.

mash @ 154 F/ 60 min.

the most common response i get is. " what kind of berries did you use?"

Great recipe idea! I take it you are getting a session beer out of this? Nottingham yeast? If my calculations are right you're coming in at about 3.3% ABV and about 14 IBU. Is that what you are getting?

I may give it a go when I have an open tap.

Thanks!

 

[coyote68]

Great recipe idea! I take it you are getting a session beer out of this? Nottingham yeast? If my calculations are right you're coming in at about 3.3% ABV and about 14 IBU. Is that what you are getting?

I may give it a go when I have an open tap.

Thanks!

yes it's a great session beer(ordinary bitter) the numbers look good but beersmith gives a little higher IBU. notty works great but i like west yorkshire the best.

 

[unionrdr]

Well, I found out none of the brewing supply websites had black treacle. Found it on amazon from Tate & Lyle for $6.99. Free shipping with amazon prime, so I signed up for the 30-day free trial to get it free 2-day shipping. It was listed in BS2 add-on updates. I also found a typo on Midwest site for the Brun Fronce' dark candi sugar.Listing said 5 SRM, pic of BB package said 36 SRM. BS2 said 22 SRM. James that I spoke to is going to try & fix the typo at Midwest. I changed the SRM listed in BS2.
Amazon only had 13 456g cans left, so I got that now for starters. It's said to give intense sweet flavor & dark color, but I'm only using 4 ozs in the Burton recipe.

 

[IslandLizard]

Tate & Lyle for $6.99. [...]
Free shipping with amazon prime, so I signed up for the 30-day free trial to get it free 2-day shipping.

Yup, Amazon is one of the few places selling that, although I may have seen it at the more upscale supermarkets, like Wegmans or WholeFoods, IIRC.

I hope you also put something on your calendar around the 28-day mark so you don't forget to cancel the Prime, or they'll be charging you for it, automatically!

After your free trial:
Your membership will automatically upgrade to an annual plan for $99/year.

Bast@rds!

 

[Qhrumphf]

I get my treacle (and my Ribena) from a British goods importer up the road. Haven't seen treacle anywhere else, and I'll smack anyone who says its the same as molasses.

 

[lookwow]

I get my treacle (and my Ribena) from a British goods importer up the road. Haven't seen treacle anywhere else, and I'll smack anyone who says its the same as molasses.

You better start smacking Wiki

From the treacle wiki.

Black treacle, or molasses, has a distinctively strong, slightly bitter flavour, and a richer colour than golden syrup

 

[unionrdr]

Yeah, I'll have to calculate that 28-day mark! 100 bucks could by stuff for 2-3 batches of beer! Here's what BS2 says about the Treacle, " UK mixture of molasses, invert sugar & golden corn syrup. Imparts an intense sweet flavor & dark color. Used in dark English Ales. Also called " black treacle" or the brand name Lyle's B[description cut off here]". So it's a mixture, not just molasses. BS2 gives it 100 SRM.

 

[balrog]

I used the same amazon trick to get the same thing, but I also tried making some invert #2 (earlier in thread). I have yet to use either because Life just gets in the way of important brewing sometimes.

 

[unionrdr]

I, for one, pretty much had to push the envelope of my own brewing adventures to learn new things. Book two of my home brewing series is another. Just gotta wait till retiree pay day to get the other ingredients. Then mayb a saison again? Idk. Maybe research some old English beer next?

 

[lowtones84]

Maybe research some old English beer next?

Awwwww yeeeeaaaaah

 

[Cider123]

Awwwww yeeeeaaaaah

This needs a small paper bag wrapped around it for carrying purposes.

 

[Puddlethumper]

I get my treacle (and my Ribena) from a British goods importer up the road. Haven't seen treacle anywhere else, and I'll smack anyone who says its the same as molasses.

Gonna have to see if you can slap this far too!

Treacle is just another name for molasses. Treacle/molasses is any uncrystallized sugar that occurs as a byproduct of the sugar refining process. It occurs in two forms: pale treacle or pale syrup and dark or black treacle. I would suggest that the main differences in flavors between something sold in the UK as black treacle and the very same product sold in the US as blackstrap molasses only occurs because of minute differences in the individual sugar mill's processes. For my money blackstrap molasses is completely interchangeable for brewing purposes with black treacle imported from the UK.

Cheers!

 

[Qhrumphf]

Gonna have to see if you can slap this far too!

Treacle is just another name for molasses. Treacle/molasses is any uncrystallized sugar that occurs as a byproduct of the sugar refining process. It occurs in two forms: pale treacle or pale syrup and dark or black treacle. I would suggest that the main differences in flavors between something sold in the UK as black treacle and the very same product sold in the US as blackstrap molasses only occurs because of minute differences in the individual sugar mill's processes. For my money blackstrap molasses is completely interchangeable for brewing purposes with black treacle imported from the UK.

Cheers!

Well they certainly taste different to me. They're definitely very similar, but based on palate alone I find them distinctly different. If, like you say, that's minute differences in the processes, that's fine. But they still taste different.

 

[Puddlethumper]

Well they certainly taste different to me. They're definitely very similar, but based on palate alone I find them distinctly different. If, like you say, that's minute differences in the processes, that's fine. But they still taste different.

As I was thinking on this this afternoon it occurred to me that while technically treacle and molasses are different words for the same thing, I can see where there is plenty of opportunity for the finished products delivered to different markets having some very detectable differences. After a little digging I have learned a little more and perhaps if we still have some folks from the UK on this thread they can add something to the discussion.

Most US sugar comes either from sugar beets or from cane. Beets grown in California and Idaho, cane from the Gulf Coast states and Hawaii. (Hurricanes have pretty well devastated sugar production in Florida and cane production in the Carribbean is less than half of what it was just 30 years ago.) British sugar production has traditionally come from beets grown in the UK. Some British cane sugar does come from India and a few other tropical regions. And the British have had their own sugar supply chain in place for several centuries. The American supply chain grew up as a separate industry and I haven't found much evidence that either sells much sugar into the other's markets. So yes, there are differences in their sources. And it might be safe to assume there are also differences in their processes.

Detectable to the palette? Your call.

 

[Qhrumphf]

As I was thinking on this this afternoon it occurred to me that while technically treacle and molasses are different words for the same thing, I can see where there is plenty of opportunity for the finished products delivered to different markets having some very detectable differences. After a little digging I have learned a little more and perhaps if we still have some folks from the UK on this thread they can add something to the discussion.

Most US sugar comes either from sugar beets or from cane. Beets grown in California and Idaho, cane from California and Hawaii. (Hurricanes have pretty well devastated sugar production in Florida.) British sugar production has traditionally come from beets grown in the UK. Some British cane sugar does come from India and a few other tropical regions. And the British have had their own sugar supply chain in place for several centuries. The American supply chain grew up as a separate industry and I haven't found much evidence that either sells much sugar into the other's markets. So yes, there are differences in their sources. And it might be safe to assume there are also differences in their processes.

Detectable to the palette? Your call.

It could also be the same thing as with English beers found in the US (or US beers found in the UK). Now I would expect a thick sugary syrup like treacle or molasses to be highly shelf stable, so I don't know. But it could be age/oxidation/handling/whatever that creates a different flavor.

 

[Puddlethumper]

It could also be the same thing as with English beers found in the US (or US beers found in the UK). Now I would expect a thick sugary syrup like treacle or molasses to be highly shelf stable, so I don't know. But it could be age/oxidation/handling/whatever that creates a different flavor.

That could be too. It would be interesting to get a bottle of each and just do a blind taste test.

The deeper I get into this the more interesting it gets.

 

[Hanglow]

The blackstrap molasses we get here tastes completely different to T&L treacle. Molasses tends to have an ashy quality to it, or at least the ones I've tried here do

It's also a bit confusing when people say treacle to mean any syrup, I remember a Can You Brew It (i think) episode where the guy interviewed from the uk says they used treacle and I it was really brewers syrup that he meant, so they ballsed up their first attempt

It can certainly work in plenty of recipes but I suspect if its based on a commercial ale then it's been subbed for one of the darker brewers syrups that aren't available for homebrewers

 

[Hanglow]

And also Ragus gives the colour for treacle at above 1200 EBC, so the figure of 80 SRM from beer smith seems a bit out

I'd certainly think its more than 80srm

 

[JKaranka]

Blackstrap molasses tastes drier and more 'burnt' than black treacle.

 

[unionrdr]

That's where I find it interesting that black treacle is said to be molasses, invert sugar, & golden corn syrup. So maybe it's all in the sources & processing? The T & L black treacle I have coming in tomorrow is said to be a mixture of the three. I'm interested to see what the can might divulge?

 

[IslandLizard]

I may have noticed a slight metallic flavor when using molasses or brown sugar in the kettle at flameout in some spiced ale I made. I never noticed that off-flavor when Treacle was added to a secondary (or barrel). Our club did an Old Treacle Mine (from BCS) collaboration to fill a wooden rum barrel that had been used for a commercial craft beer previously. We used 6 cans of Treacle when filling the rum pickled barrel.

Sadly, 6 months later we were staring at 55 gallons of sour "old ale." It definitely got infected with acetobacter and most likely Brett. Only barely palatable to some, I find it actually very pleasing. I still have 2 kegs of it "aging out." I use it to blend old ales into imperial "Oud Bruins" a la Le Terroir/La Folie.

 

[unionrdr]

I found it interesting that, when I added the molasses & honey to my kottbusser after primary, the flavor changed a little. Before the addition, the gravity sample tasted like the hint of sweetness & dry finish kottbusser is said to have. After the additions fermented out & I tried some bottles, it tasted like a saison? That one got unsulphured molasses & clover honey. This black treacle is supposed to be just dark & sweet. I still have the jar of molasses, so maybe try a taste of each?

 

[IslandLizard]

Yeah, I'll have to calculate that 28-day mark! 100 bucks could by stuff for 2-3 batches of beer!

Yeah, that's darn right! IF you know you won't order anything else before those 30 days have passed, you may as well cancel NOW!

These companies rely on people's laxness, forgetfulness, "mis"understanding, or sheer ignorance for not reading the fine print, of what they're signing up for.

They call it a "plan" but really it's more of a "ploy." It also revolves every year, and when you see your credit card has been charged it's too late. They won't send you an opt-out notice beforehand, now, do they?

If they had the "courtesy" to charge you only $1 for the (first) 30 days, that converts to a yearly "ploy" of $99 after those 30 days are over, you could cancel the minute after you signed up and paid your $1. It would still be valid for the 30 days since you paid for it. I wonder if that holds true for this "free trial," but seriously doubt it. They've got a team of well-paid lawyers, ya know...

So CANCEL NOW or MARK THAT dreaded 28th DAY!

 

[unionrdr]

Yeah, I saw the $1 on my on-line statement. I might use it one more time, but I'll ditch it before the time's up. Money better spent elsewhere. I got it marked on the calendar just the same. Gotta wait till Monday to order the rest of the Burton ingredients, so maybe I'll see what they have vs a supply site for cheaper?...

 

[unionrdr]

Well, I finally figured out that the UPS guy didn't put my package by the door. In the mailbox instead, which it barely fit?! The can only says, " Made from cane molasses". no mention of invert sugar & gold corn syrup?

 

[balrog]

...and it tastes like....?

 

[Puddlethumper]

The more I read about this the more I come across a common point - molasses or treacle about have to be made from cane sugar. The sources I'm seeing indicate that beet sugar has some stuff in it that makes the molasses/treacle pretty much unsuitable for human consumption but ok for livestock feed