English Ales - What's your favorite recipe?

[duncan_disorderly]

@duncan_disorderly you are preaching to the choir here, bitter is by far one of my favorite styles, but yeah should be in cask.

There’s honestly no better beer in the world than a dry hopped, freshly tapped bitter on cask around 3%, I never grow tired of it.

I had some decent Timothy Taylors in the bottle in Scotland this summer available pretty wide in Glasgow.

If say you're a bit low at 3%, I mainly drink bitters in the 3.8 to 4.8% range. Most bitters are at least 3.4%. TT is widely available across the UK now, it seems.

 

[Colindo]

I think bitter is one of the words great beer styles, but it has to be in cask, to really work.

I think part of this is just a bad habit of the breweries when it comes to bottling. I recently tasted four Best Bitters side by side, Adnam's Southwold, Fuller's London Pride, Shepherd Neame Spitfire and Orkney Tawny Ale. Fuller's stood out massively because their beer is just filtered, not pasteurised. The aromas were much stronger and more complex than in the three other bottled beers. Those had a noticeably fruitcake flavour with not much else going on.

So I think as long as the breweries keep pasteurising their bitters, they will never taste as good as they could.

 

[Erik the Anglophile]

I know Sheperd Neame pasteurise but aren't Adnam's using a "cold filtering" process similair to Theakston for their bottled/canned beer?

 

[duncan_disorderly]

I think part of this is just a bad habit of the breweries when it comes to bottling. I recently tasted four Best Bitters side by side, Adnam's Southwold, Fuller's London Pride, Shepherd Neame Spitfire and Orkney Tawny Ale. Fuller's stood out massively because their beer is just filtered, not pasteurised. The aromas were much stronger and more complex than in the three other bottled beers. Those had a noticeably fruitcake flavour with not much else going on.

So I think as long as the breweries keep pasteurising their bitters, they will never taste as good as they could.

The majority of UK bottled beer is pasteurised I believe and yes that a big part of the problem. As well as the carbonation. I prefer naturally carbonated beer myself, and pasteurisation is a killer. I mostly drink my bottled homebrew and draught cask when I'm out and about, because I struggle to find commercial beer I really like and us worth the money that isn't cask. The less beer is tampered with, the better it is, in my view.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

The majority of UK bottled beer is pasteurised I believe and yes that a big part of the problem. As well as the carbonation. I prefer naturally carbonated beer myself, and pasteurisation is a killer. I mostly drink my bottled homebrew and draught cask when I'm out and about, because I struggle to find commercial beer I really like and us worth the money that isn't cask. The less beer is tampered with, the better it is, in my view.

Living just down the road from you I also believe bitter between 4.2-5.0% is the best beer in the world. I never buy bottled bitter and never bottle my homebrew bitter as I store them in Corny Kegs. I try to have all three filled with bitter. Currently I have Tribute, Sussex and Five Points in them.

 

[Miraculix]

I prefer it between 3.2 and 4.3 percent, tendency towards the lower end. That's where it's nicely balanced.

 

[Cheshire Cat]

3.2% is more Mild territory.

 

[CodyRonan]

I've not spent much time in England. However, I do enjoy London Pride in the bottle, and have brewed and enjoy English Porter. But the one time I did try cask ale in London, it was a huge anti climax for me. I had waited decades to try it. And I kept trying it. But it underwhelmed. It was like something you'd find in your fermenter before you carb it up, but with less flavour. I'll have to go back to confirm one day.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

I've not spent much time in England...the one time I did try cask ale in London, it was a huge anti climax for me. I had waited decades to try it. And I kept trying it. But it underwhelmed.

London as a city probably has the worst average quality of cask in the UK. For a bunch of reasons that includes too-small cellars, transient staff and tourists buying badly kept beer which gives the pub no incentive to give a damn. There are places that keep it well even in London, but you need to seek them out.

 

[duncan_disorderly]

London as a city probably has the worst average quality of cask in the UK. For a bunch of reasons that includes too-small cellars, transient staff and tourists buying badly kept beer which gives the pub no incentive to give a damn. There are places that keep it well even in London, but you need to seek them out.

Plus, it's better in the north.

 

[CodyRonan]

London as a city probably has the worst average quality of cask in the UK. For a bunch of reasons that includes too-small cellars, transient staff and tourists buying badly kept beer which gives the pub no incentive to give a damn. There are places that keep it well even in London, but you need to seek them out.

Yes it was just one experience, I admit. I wanted so much to like it. But as I said the uncarbed beer in my plastic bucket had it beat. One way I'll be back and find the best spots.

 

[duncan_disorderly]

Yes it was just one experience, I admit. I wanted so much to like it. But as I said the uncarbed beer in my plastic bucket had it beat. One way I'll be back and find the best spots.

A lot of people in the UK don't like cask. It's rapidly going out of fashion. I grew up on it. I think our tastes in many things are heavily formed in the earlier stages of our lives.

 

[CodyRonan]

A lot of people in the UK don't like cask. It's rapidly going out of fashion. I grew up on it. I think our tastes in many things are heavily formed in the earlier stages of our lives.

True. I think I am used to more flavours, and carbonation. Also one of the pleasures of beer is that it is more than just the taste, and, like music, can trigger fond memories of days gone by which enhance the experience. Context can do the same - Guinness in front of a turf fire, an ice cold lager at a surf club, and no doubt a real ale in your favourite boozer with old friends.

 

[duncan_disorderly]

True. I think I am used to more flavours, and carbonation. Also one of the pleasures of beer is that it is more than just the taste, and, like music, can trigger fond memories of days gone by which enhance the experience. Context can do the same - Guinness in front of a turf fire, an ice cold lager at a surf club, and no doubt a real ale in your favourite boozer with old friends.

Absolutely. Also, for me, I got into craft ale about 25 years ago and drank a lot of it but in the last 2 or 3 years I've started to find it too much. The American hop thing, the pungency or whatever it is. That may be my tastes buds getting tired of it. It may be Covid. It may be my age. There's a lot of quite shoddy craft beer out there, over here. In my opinion. Cask ales here vary but there's a tradition and places that do it well are really skilled at providing something that is unique and I love it, when it's right. Up in the north our cask is served through a sparker, so it has a nice head, and the beer texture is smooth, and not fizzy. But it's not flat, there's a distinct different.

 

[InspectorJon]

I wonder if you all have any suggestions for me? I plan to brew an American Barleywine with my daughter and son-in-law after Christmas. I would like to do something English in the next day or two to create a yeast cake to pitch the barleywine on. I have a lot of Viking extra pale malt. I will go get any additional grain I need. There is a homebrew supply about 45 minutes away that has a decent selection of malts. I have lots of EKG and UK Fuggle hops. I have some Pub yeast I can spin up. That would be nice for the English ale, I'm not sure that would be best for the barleywine. I have lalBrew Nottingham that I think would be good for the barleywine. Maybe brew the smaller beer with the Pub and pitch some of the Notty with the yeast cake for the barleywine? Or just use the Notty on the smaller beer. I also have a pound of #2 invert syrup. I'd like the starter beer to be a 3.5 to 4 gallon batch. Any recipe suggestions for the starter beer?

 

[duncan_disorderly]

I wonder if you all have any suggestions for me? I plan to brew an American Barleywine with my daughter and son-in-law after Christmas. I would like to do something English in the next day or two to create a yeast cake to pitch the barleywine on. I have a lot of Viking extra pale malt. I will go get any additional grain I need. There is a homebrew supply about 45 minutes away that has a decent selection of malts. I have lots of EKG and UK Fuggle hops. I have some Pub yeast I can spin up. That would be nice for the English ale, I'm not sure that would be best for the barleywine. I have lalBrew Nottingham that I think would be good for the barleywine. Maybe brew the smaller beer with the Pub and pitch some of the Notty with the yeast cake for the barleywine? Or just use the Notty on the smaller beer. I also have a pound of #2 invert syrup. I'd like the starter beer to be a 3.5 to 4 gallon batch. Any recipe suggestions for the starter beer?

A nice simple English bitter, 4 to 4.5%, 30 ibu ish. Just pale malt and about 5% crystal malt is fine, but you could add some wheat, maybe a touch of chocolate malt. Fuggle and EKG would complete a very English ale with the Pub yeast.

 

[corncob]

I wonder if you all have any suggestions for me? I plan to brew an American Barleywine with my daughter and son-in-law after Christmas. I would like to do something English in the next day or two to create a yeast cake to pitch the barleywine on. I have a lot of Viking extra pale malt. I will go get any additional grain I need. There is a homebrew supply about 45 minutes away that has a decent selection of malts. I have lots of EKG and UK Fuggle hops. I have some Pub yeast I can spin up. That would be nice for the English ale, I'm not sure that would be best for the barleywine. I have lalBrew Nottingham that I think would be good for the barleywine. Maybe brew the smaller beer with the Pub and pitch some of the Notty with the yeast cake for the barleywine? Or just use the Notty on the smaller beer. I also have a pound of #2 invert syrup. I'd like the starter beer to be a 3.5 to 4 gallon batch. Any recipe suggestions for the starter beer?

Or 5% biscuit, 5% dark English crystal, 5% unmalted wheat or barley, 10-15% of that invert, mashed at 158, 3-3.5% ABV, just a pinch of those hops, with the nottingham.

For a lovely mild. Ready to drink by Christmas eve.

 

[UdonPete]

Plus, it's better in the north.

Try Hook Norton and you will change your mind

 

[duncan_disorderly]

Try Hook Norton and you will change your mind

I'm familiar with Hook Norton, they make some good beer. There are other good breweries in the south. I was only joking tbh, but I do prefer the way cask ales are served in the north, through a sparkler attached to the pump.

 

[UdonPete]

I'm familiar with Hook Norton, they make some good beer. There are other good breweries in the south. I was only joking tbh, but I do prefer the way cask ales are served in the north, through a sparkler attached to the pump.

Ah now 'sparklers' are another topic but I would suggest one could use a 'sparkler' on a 'southern' beer

 

[duncan_disorderly]

Ah now 'sparklers' are another topic but I would suggest one could use a 'sparkler' on a 'southern' beer

One could. But try asking them!

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Ah now 'sparklers' are another topic but I would suggest one could use a 'sparkler' on a 'southern' beer

You could, but it doesn't work as well, you need a different recipe for beer through a sparkler as the bitterness presents differently.

Hooky is a decent enough beer but it's a typical Thames Valley beer - bitter in other parts of the country has different water, different yeast, different grist, different fermenter geometry and some of us just prefer those different regional styles to an admittedly good example of a Thames Valley bitter.

 

[HM-2]

Or 5% biscuit, 5% dark English crystal, 5% unmalted wheat or barley, 10-15% of that invert, mashed at 158, 3-3.5% ABV, just a pinch of those hops, with the nottingham.

For a lovely mild. Ready to drink by Christmas eve.

This. Notty makes a great mild and a fantastic barley wine.

 

[tracer bullet]

5% unmalted wheat or barley

I'm familiar with the rest, but that's an ingredient I haven't used before. What does it bring?

 

[HM-2]

I'm familiar with the rest, but that's an ingredient I haven't used before. What does it bring?

Body, mostly. You could also use flaked or torrefied oats.

 

[corncob]

Body, mostly. You could also use flaked or torrefied oats.

Yeah. Flaked barley or torrified wheat was what I meant. Something to boost the body and foam a little, considering how little malt you have per gallon of water in an ale like this.

You could even use 20% 6-row (ducks to avoid flying objects).

 

[Colindo]

One could. But try asking them!

I have had it a few times in the South that they serve it through a sparkler, let it settle nicely with a proper head, and then top it up until only a millimetre of foam remains. I could have cried everytime it happened.

 

[InspectorJon]

Or 5% biscuit, 5% dark English crystal, 5% unmalted wheat or barley, 10-15% of that invert, mashed at 158, 3-3.5% ABV, just a pinch of those hops, with the nottingham.

For a lovely mild. Ready to drink by Christmas eve.

So this?

70% Viking Extra Pale 1.8L - It's what I have
6% biscuit/victory/English amber - around 30L
6% English Dark Crystal - 80L
6% flaked barley
12% #2 invert
Fuggle - 17.5 IBU
OG 1.033
FG 1.009
3.3% ABV
Nottingham around 70F/21C
Mash 158
97/55 chloride/sulfate

I upped the specialty malts a bit because the pale is more like pilsner malt than MO.

 

[Miraculix]

So this?

70% Viking Extra Pale 1.8L - It's what I have
6% biscuit/victory/English amber - around 30L
6% English Dark Crystal - 80L
6% flaked barley
12% #2 invert
Fuggle - 17.5 IBU
OG 1.033
FG 1.009
3.3% ABV
Nottingham around 70F/21C
Mash 158
97/55 chloride/sulfate

I upped the specialty malts a bit because the pale is more like pilsner malt than MO.

I'd double the minerals, otherwise it looks fine.

 

[InspectorJon]

I'd double the minerals, otherwise it looks fine.

I have very soft water, mountain runoff. Adding calcium minerals drives the pH way down. Adding lime or bicarb to counter the addition of calcium seems counter intuitive. I am not opposed, just trying to understand.