Element rust

[Malric]

I've done about 10 batches on a new HERMS 4500W system. I noticed today that the base of the element is starting to rust. Any input from the seasoned electric brewers? Do they make stainless elements?

 

[hunter306]

Brewmation claims that their elements are Stainless and rustproof (http://brewmation.com/Heating_Elements.html). I have no experience with them, but I did glance at them shortly before simply ordering 2x 5500 Camcos.

I haven't run my setup yet, however I'm expecting some rust since our water is hard.

 

[ChuckO]

Clean off the rust and then coat the face of the element base with a thin layer of silicon adhesive. That seems to eliminate the problem until you remove the element for serious cleaning. You will have to coat it again after reassembly.

 

[renthispace]

I even tried a magnesium cathode but still got rest. I think my issue is due to the water drops remaining after the pot is empty (no more connection with the cathode for the parts that rust). Short of getting an all stainless element, I too reccomend silicone around the base.

 

[ChocolateMaltyBalls]

A thin layer of food safe silicone adhesive works great, look for DAP aquarium sealant, that's worked for me.

 

[hunter306]

This has come up before, and I was curious if anyone could explain how they applied the sealant more clearly. Did you just pull out your element and spread the sealant onto the silver metal base and allow it to dry? Or did you apply sealant to just the face of the element base while it was installed?

I'd like to coat mine before I install them to cut rusting off at the pass... =D

 

[ChocolateMaltyBalls]

This has come up before, and I was curious if anyone could explain how they applied the sealant more clearly. Did you just pull out your element and spread the sealant onto the silver metal base and allow it to dry? Or did you apply sealant to just the face of the element base while it was installed?

I'd like to coat mine before I install them to cut rusting off at the pass... =D

I used Bobby's element enclosure, so after I installed the element in the housing, I used a tongue depressor to smear a thin layer on the element face.

 

[passedpawn]

My first 2 Camco 5500W elements never rusted. I just installed a new one and it rusted right away. Odd.

 

[kenh]

I even tried a magnesium cathode but still got rest. I think my issue is due to the water drops remaining after the pot is empty (no more connection with the cathode for the parts that rust). Short of getting an all stainless element, I too reccomend silicone around the base.

Leftover water was my issue. I fixed my problem by unscrewing the main body of my RIMS tune odd the tee that holds the element and drying everything out after every brew.

 

[augiedoggy]

My 4500 watt ace hardware units also rusted at the face of the mounting area... I made the mistake of leaving water in the hot overnight.... I was surprised at how much it rusted... been cleaning it with a Scotch right before brewing but I will try the silicone.
Thanks.
PS I also notice this topic has come up many times before and some have had great success using a magnesium RV hot water tank anode rod which works to prevent rust at a molecular level if I understand it correctly.... just like they use on boat out drives.

 

[dcbw]

I tried the Magnesium anode thing in my HLT and the element base (Camco 5500w ulwd) still rusted every time I brewed, water was in the HLT for about 6 hours total each brew. I tried different elements (rheem) and same thing. Silicone to the rescue.

I just screwed my lock nut back onto the element base, got everything snug and together like I was going to brew, and then smeared RTV408 all over the base of the element and lock nut. I did not go over the sides of the lock nut, just the element base. No more rust.

 

[MyNameIsPaul]

Are y'all getting a little of the silicone on the element itself, and is that ok?

 

[ChocolateMaltyBalls]

I use the camco ripple, and it has a little silicone on the part that connects to the base, doesn't look burnt or otherwise discolored

 

[renthispace]

So what's the best silicone everyone's using?

 

[augiedoggy]

So what's the best silicone everyone's using?

I would assume something safe for food contact would be best... or aquarium sealant... others may have additives that leach into the beer.

 

[ChocolateMaltyBalls]

DAP aquarium sealant is food safe after it cures, and I believe it can handle high temp as well.

 

[augiedoggy]

So last night before brewing a honey brown I took some advice from here and wiped a drop of olive oil onto the element base after cleaning off the rust and today after brewing and rinsing and sitting overnight the rust has not come back!

Thanks to whomever suggested it on one of these element rust threads...
See this is why I love the search option rather than reinvent the wheel each time a new thread is started and hoping the right person sees it to repost his or her solution...

 

[Malric]

Interesting. I know that olive oil can be used is the fermentor as an oxygen replacement. I wonder if it breaks down in the boil or transfers through.

 

[augiedoggy]

Yeah I'd like to avoid using the silicone because it will fall apart and end up in someones beer....
And While I dont mind it in breasts, I do in my beers.

 

[hunter306]

Just picked this stuff up at HomeDepot for 5 dollars. It explicitly says food safe (once it cures) on the package, so I'm going to go for it.

 

[kenh]

Just picked this stuff up at HomeDepot for 5 dollars. It explicitly says food safe (once it cures) on the package, so I'm going to go for it.

Let us know how it works. Right now I'm draining & wiping out my RIMS tube after every brew.

 

[Homer]

Let us know how it works. Right now I'm draining & wiping out my RIMS tube after every brew.

Any update on using this silicone, I'm thinking of picking some up today so I can leak test my kettle, but I don't want to start any rust issues. Maybe I should just do the olive oil trick for the leak test?

 

[hunter306]

FYI Gentlemen, I applied this stuff to the boil kettle when I installed the element and so far no rust. It smells utterly terrible when you apply it, so that kind of turned me off to the stuff a bit, but fortunately, once cured it has no noticeable smell at all. It is a bit tricky to apply it over the entire element base when installed, but I used a wooden skewer to spread it in the nooks and crannies and it seems to be fine. I've only fired the element and drained once since application, but no issues so far.

More testing to come as I continue to use the kettle.

 

[alien]

I use one of these Magnesium anodes from Camco.

 

[Malric]

FYI Gentlemen, I applied this stuff to the boil kettle when I installed the element and so far no rust. It smells utterly terrible when you apply it, so that kind of turned me off to the stuff a bit, but fortunately, once cured it has no noticeable smell at all. It is a bit tricky to apply it over the entire element base when installed, but I used a wooden skewer to spread it in the nooks and crannies and it seems to be fine. I've only fired the element and drained once since application, but no issues so far.

More testing to come as I continue to use the kettle.

Did you taste or smell the water after you fired it?

 

[hunter306]

Did you taste or smell the water after you fired it?

Haven't done a taste test. Assumed once it cured it was good to go as the scent is no longer present at all. I'll have to fill the pot up and give it a boil, let it cool and see if the sealant imparted any taste. I'm guessing it has not based on the food-safe markings.

 

[augiedoggy]

I use one of these Magnesium anodes from Camco.

Thats certainly one way to boost the mineral content of your water... they are sacrificial anodes that actually dissolve into the liquid with use... I know they should be fine for hot water tank use (but your not supposed to consume that water in many cases) and magnesium isnt bad for you but I just cant help but wonder if theres any other negative effect to the wort and if other metals sneak in there..probably not but who knows? the guys in china that make them?

Think about it, your just replacing one mineral contamination source (iron) with other metals (magnesium and?). Although magnesium alone is less harmful to taste than Iron so I've read.

 

[augiedoggy]

Haven't done a taste test. Assumed once it cured it was good to go as the scent is no longer present at all. I'll have to fill the pot up and give it a boil, let it cool and see if the sealant imparted any taste. I'm guessing it has not based on the food-safe markings.

food safe and food grade are two different things and most food grade of safe materials might only be so under certain temp conditions... This silicone is likely fine but I'm throwing that out there... some food safe plastics do impart off flavors...

 

[ChocolateMaltyBalls]

I used that exact DAP product in my elements without any problems, no plastic taste in water or beer. Once it cures it's inert, and it is rated for temperature based on the packaging. It smells terrible while it cures because it takes a lot of nasty volatile organic chemicals to make this material flow, it wants to be a solid. FWIW I have a little on the element itself where it connects to the base, looks just like the stuff that's on the base, no discoloration etc. The hardest part is making sure you have a nice even coat, miss a spot and you'll still get a little rust. If it's not smooth enough on the BK element you may have a harder time cleaning with proteins getting caught in any ridges.

 

[orangehero]

That nasty volatile organic chemical that silicone caulk gives off is acetic acid (vinegar).

Although I haven't tried it, you can thin silicone with naptha (or xylene, maybe acetone too) so that you can pour it and it covers everything smoothly.

Volatile solvents will result in shrinkage of the silicone in proportion to the amount of solvent added. It will extend the cure time and possibly may give off a little of the solvent once it cures too.

They do sell Flowable Silicone and Silicone Thinner as well.

One more suggestion is to make sure all the surfaces are extremely clean to ensure the silicone bonds well. Give everything a good wipedown with acetone and then denatured alcohol.