Different fermentation flavors from different chilling rates?

[scooterunderwood]

Can you get different fermentation/yeast flavors from different chilling rates?

I was looking at glycol jacketed conical FVs (aka dreaming) and I started to wonder if you can achieve different flavors in ales by resting at various temps as you chill your beer, similar to a diacetyl rest with lagers, or entirely eliminate certain fermentation/yeast flavors by chilling really fast through certain ranges?

 

[Clementine]

What do you mean by chilling? Typically beer is cooled after boil as quickly as possible but this is nothing to do with flavor rather to get it cooled and into the fermenter in a sanitary condition so nothing starts growing in ti before the yeast get a chance to go to work.

Commercial breweries use glycol jacketed fermenter as they want to control the fermentation temperature very accurately for several brews that are large all in the one room. If you have 30 Barrels of beer actively fermenting it will require a lot more cooling than air can give it (unless the air temp was very low).

Most brewers try to maintain very even temps specific for the yeast strain they are using through out the fermentation. Temps are set for the flavor profile and not varied, A great example of this is getting different results from a hefewiezen yeast by using a lower or higher temperature is common practice however the beer is not stepped through temperature ranges. Raising the temp at the end of fermentation is used to get the yeast to actively clean up the beer and complete fermentation (esp if going near the cold end of their acceptable range), not so much make particular flavor profiles.

Hope this answers your question

Clem

 

[runningweird]

as I understand it the development and extraction of sugars and proteins happens during the mash. A longer boil can alter flavors as can scorching, But I don't imagine that chilling it incrementally would have any impact on flavor. All the flavors are there after the boil just waiting for inoculation.

fermenting at certain temperatures does lend to different flavor profiles- hence the glycol chilled vessels but what I get from your question would likely lead to infected and soured wort.


if I am misunderstanding you I apologize.

 

[scooterunderwood]

Sorry for any misunderstanding. I was referring to rate of crash cooling after fermentation. Sort of the opposite of how a you raise a lager temperature at about 60% attenuation for a diacetyl rest, if there is anything below ale temperatures you would want to rest at (or avoid) while you're crash cooling.

More specifically the scenario in my head is, if you had an under powered glycol chiller that took you three day to crash cool vs an over powered chiller that would chill your FV in under an hour, would there be a difference? Not just in taste, but attenuation or flocculation as well? ...Obviously this will/could vary strain by strain, or perhaps just be plain voodoo.

I suspect you would get healthier yeast with a quick drop in temp as you'd be suspending more yeast while its still active. Possibly better/worse flocculation as the cell walls would wrinkle more/less? I haven't seen any literature relating to how fast you should or shouldn't crash cool after fermentation. If anyone can cite literature on the subject, that would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[RichBenn]

Sorry for any misunderstanding. I was referring to rate of crash cooling after fermentation. Sort of the opposite of how a you raise a lager temperature at about 60% attenuation for a diacetyl rest, if there is anything below ale temperatures you would want to rest at (or avoid) while you're crash cooling.

More specifically the scenario in my head is, if you had an under powered glycol chiller that took you three day to crash cool vs an over powered chiller that would chill your FV in under an hour, would there be a difference? Not just in taste, but attenuation or flocculation as well? ...Obviously this will/could vary strain by strain, or perhaps just be plain voodoo.

I suspect you would get healthier yeast with a quick drop in temp as you'd be suspending more yeast while its still active. Possibly better/worse flocculation as the cell walls would wrinkle more/less? I haven't seen any literature relating to how fast you should or shouldn't crash cool after fermentation. If anyone can cite literature on the subject, that would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Since "fermentation is complete", how could there be a difference in attenuation? As far as flocculation, it's the time at lower temperature, not the speed at which it gets to lower temperature, AFAIK.

Since you are talking about "healthier yeast", perhaps you are talking specifically about lagering. However, lower temperatures, as they help clarify the beer, drop out more, not less yeast(and other components) in suspension. Perhaps what is left in suspension is healthier, but I can't speak to that or other aspects of lagering.

Rich

 

[Homercidal]

You can absolutely get a different taste from chilling your beer faster. The longer you have to wait to drink your beer, the better it will taste!

 

[orangehero]

Yeast is harvested for repitching during the active fermentation.

The yeast is dumped several times during lagering, but it is discarded.

Some ales are cold conditioned, but usually they use a centrifuge or filter to get rid of yeast and large particles.

I don't think you'd want to chill as fast as possible, but still at a reasonable rate. For cold conditioning of ales and lagering the yeast still remains active and slowly refines the flavor of the beer.