CaCO3 question

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bbrally

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Can somebody explain the differences between these three CaCO3 numbers I have received from the city water report?

Total Hardness (CaCO3) 7.3 mg/L
Alkalinity (Total as CaCo3) 14 mg/L
Alkalinity (PP as CaCo3) Not Detected
 
Sure.

If you or mother nature dissolves 100 mg of calcium carbonate (which is 1 mmol because the molecular weight of calcium carbonate is 100) in 1 L of water using carbon dioxide as the acid the following reaction takes place: CaCO3 + H2O + CO3 --> Ca++ + 2HCO3-

Thus the 1 mmol]L of calcium carbonate give rise to 2 mmol/L of bicarbonate a 1 mmol/L of calcium ion. But there are 2 mmol/L of negative charge from the bicarbonate ions and 2 mmol/L positive charge from the calcium ions. Moles of charge are called equivalents so 100 mg/L gives 2 mEq/L each of positive and negative charge.

Alkalinity is measured by supplying hydrogen ions (from acid) to the sample until all the bicarbonate is gone:

2H+ + 2HCO3- --> 2CO2.

Thus it takes 2 mEq/L hydrogen ions to "neutralize" the 2 mEq/L bicarbonate that came from the 100 mg/L calcium carbonate with which we started. We could say that the alkalinity is 2 mEq/L and in fact that is how it is commonly stated in Europe. In the US the idea is to specify the alkalinity in terms of how much calcium carbonate it would take to produce that alkalinity were it dissolved in the natural (CO2) way. Thus 2 mEq/L ~ 100 mg/L and so, in the US, we take the alkalinity in mEq/L and mulitply by 50. Then we say the resulting number is the "alkalinity as calcium carbonate".

Now the calcium ion from 100 mg/L also contributes 2 mEq/L positive charge so we have the same correspondence. Ca++ at 2 mEq/L ~ 100 mg/L so we multiply calcium ion equivalence by 50 as well. Since calcium and magnesium ions both react with bicarbonate in the same way we also multiply magnesium equivalence by 50 and call the result "magnesium hardness as CaCO3".

So if you see Total Hardness (CaCO3) = 7.3 mg/L you know that there are 7.3/50 mEq/L of positive charge attached to calcium and magnesium ions but we can't tell how much is attached to each unless we are given the hardness of one or the other. If we were told that the magnesium hardness was 2.3 mg/L as CaCO3 we could subtract that from 7.3 and determine that the calcium hardness was 5.0 mg/L as CaCO3. This is equivalent to 5/50 = 0.1 mEq/L and, as calcium has an equivalent weight of 20 mg/mEq, the calcium ion concentration is 0.1*20 = 2 mg/L "as the ion".

We said that alkalinity is determined by adding acid to the water sample until all the bicarbonate is gone. That isn't quite true. It is done until the pH reaches an "end point" pH which varies depending on analyst but which is, in brewing, generally 4.3. At this pH nearly, but not quite all, the HCO3- has been converted to CO2 and left the sample. The alkalinity is formally defined as the number of mL of 0.1 N acid which must be added to a 100 mL sample of the water to bring it's pH to 4.3. Sometimes they stop first at pH 8.3 and note the number of mL required to get to 8.3. Obviously, this is 0 if the starting pH of the sample is less than 8.3. As 8.3 is the pH at which phenolpthalein changes color this first number is often referred to as the "P alkalinity". For sample pH < 8.3 P alkalinity is 0.
 
It's always nice to have the technical explanation ... whether you understand it or not. I just can't absorb the chemistry so I'm glad :mug:there are people who understand the details and other's who can distill the details down to something I use in practice. :mug:
 
This all seemed so easy in first year chem.

This question came about after I downloaded TH's EZ Water calculator and noticed the radio buttons for HCO3 or alkalinity (CaCO3). Where in beersmith there is only HCO3. I then found John Palmers residual alkalinity worksheet where there is no HCO3, only alkalinity as CaCO3.

It sounds like these are different ways of expressing the same thing.


Does this sound right:

The Alkalinity as CaCO3 quoted in the water report is not the actual quantity of CaCO3 in the water but the amount of CaCO3 that would be required to produce the alkalinity of the sample from pure water.

The CaCO3 dissolved into the water, becomes calcium and bicarbonate. Thus if a water report gives a bicarbonate quantity, the alkalinity as CaCO3 can be calculated and visa versa.

The total hardness is a measure of the CaCo3 that would be required to produce the ions present in the sample. So knowing the Ca and Mg present in the water you can determine the total hardness as CaCO3.


Thanks for the explanation, I hope I understood it correctly.
 
For typical drinking water pH of less than 8.3, alkalinity and bicarbonate are roughly analogous. But their unit of measure (concentration) can be quite different.

You can obtain an accurate conversion of alkalinity to its carb and bicarb components at AJ's website: http://ajdel.wetnewf.org:81/ from his Nearly Universal Brewing Water Spreadsheet.

If you want a Reader's Digest version that isn't as accurate but acceptable, download Bru'n Water from my site shown in my signature line.
 
I then found John Palmers residual alkalinity worksheet where there is no HCO3, only alkalinity as CaCO3.
IIRC, there is a little not-so-obvious dropdown menu to toggle between the two as far as entering your info. I think the displayed results are always 'as CaCO3'. But it's been a while since I used it.

Brewing this weekend and look forward to trying your calculator mabrungard (knew that name looked familiar, welcome!).
 
It sounds like these are different ways of expressing the same thing.

At low (< 8.3) pH bicarb = 61*alk/50


Does this sound right:

The Alkalinity as CaCO3 quoted in the water report is not the actual quantity of CaCO3 in the water but the amount of CaCO3 that would be required to produce the alkalinity of the sample from pure water.

Yes, provided it was dissolved using CO2 i.e. as nature does it (usually). Just keep in mind that if you put 100 mg of NaOH (lye) in a liter of DI water and gave that to an analyst he'd come back and tell you that the alaklinity is 91 mg/L as calcium carbonate even though there is no calcium or carbonate (or bicarbonate) in the water. It's best to think of it ("as Calcium Carbonate") as 50 times the alkalinity expressed in mEq/L and I wish they'd do it that way.


The CaCO3 dissolved into the water, becomes calcium and bicarbonate. Thus if a water report gives a bicarbonate quantity, the alkalinity as CaCO3 can be calculated and visa versa.

The total hardness is a measure of the CaCo3 that would be required to produce the ions present in the sample. So knowing the Ca and Mg present in the water you can determine the total hardness as CaCO3.

Not exactly. No amount of CaCO3 is going to produce a magnesium ion concentration.

Hardness is, in concept, measured exactly the same way as alkalinity. A chelating agent (EDTA) of known strength is titrated into a sample of given volume until all the calcium and magnesium (and iron and strontium and ...) are sucked up at which point (the end point) there is a dramatic color change in an indicator dye which has also been put into the solution. The total hardness is 50 times the number of mEq/L of the chelating agent required to reach the end point. It is the weight of the equivalent amount of calcium carbonate which would have to be dissolved (with any acid this time) if CaCO3 were the only source of calcium. Similarly as with alkalinity we note that 100 mg epsom salts added to 1 L of DI water would yield magnesium hardness of 39 mg/L as CaCO3 even though no calcium or carbonate or bicarbonate is involved. 100 mg/L CaCO3 dissolved in 1L gives 100 mg/L as CaCO3.

The second part of the statement is true: Total_Hardness_as_CaCO3 = 50*[Mg]/12.15 + 50*[Ca]/20 where [Mg] and [Ca] are, respectively, the magnesium and calcium concentrations in mg/L. The first term is the magnesium hardness and the second the calcium hardness.

In more modern laboratories the calcium and magnesium concentrations are measured by atomic absorption or inductively coupled plasma technique and the results plugged into this last formula. These methods eliminate the interference from strontium etc.
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