Bubbles in airlock turning dark

[mike6432]

Hi there. First time in this forum and I'm in the process of fermenting my first batch of cider and I have some questions.

1.) everything seemed to be going fine and dandy but I noticed in one of my air locks, the bubbles getting darker at some parts, is this normal? See pic below.
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1419536844.816932.jpg

2.) these gallons are at just over a month. What would it taste like at this point if i went ahead to carbonate it and bottle it? O was really planning on two months. This is more of an initial experiment.

My goal is, if this works, to start a bunch going and have different fermenting times to experiment with taste.

It's my understanding the longer it ferments, the more alcoholic. I've also been told between a couple months and a couple years is safe. Can anyone give me insight to this?

I also want to take another picture of the entire gallons.

These are sweet apple cider from a farm and I used about a quarter packet of yeast in each, however the closer one does have more yeast.

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1419537064.439157.jpgView attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1419537091.568855.jpg

 

[Yooper]

Welcome to a great hobby!

Let me see if I can help with some of your questions.

1. Those airlocks are pretty gross! Take them off, clean them, resanitize and stick back on. They will still protect the cider, but no need to allow things to grow in them like bacteria and mold so close to the cider.

2. Should taste pretty dry, tart, and good!

3. "It's my understanding the longer it ferments, the more alcoholic. I've also been told between a couple months and a couple years is safe. Can anyone give me insight to this?"

- That is incorrect. It ferments until there are no fermentable sugars left. That usually takes just a few days, maybe up to a week in a slow fermentation. Once it's done, it won't get more alcoholic at all. It will just start aging. The way to know if it's done is to get a hydrometer. When you have a reading that is the same over at least three days or longer, it's done. It's also helpful to have a hydrometer to know how much sugar you started with so you can plan on having the alcohol content that you want. You don't want rocket fuel, so it's nice to know where you are starting so you can control it.

4. Color seems ok. Keep it in a dark place (or cover them) and they'll be fine. If you have a ton of sediment in them, it's time to rack (siphon) them to new vessels to finish clearing. You can bottle it when it's done (as shown by hydrometer readings), or let it sit and clear. I like to let it clear, as I hate sediment and crud in my bottles. Once it's clear and no longer dropping lees (sediment), you can bottle.

You can bottle it still, like wine, or carbonate it. You can stabilize it and sweeten it if you don't like it tart. I think most cidermakers do a variety of different things. I like mine tart and not sweetened, and not carbonated very much. Others like them sweet and spritzy. It's really a matter of personal taste.

 

[mike6432]

Thanks for the info!

 

[vincentAlpha]

+1 to Yooper's advice. With respect to the airlocks & cleaning, I used to use the S-type ones like you've got there but I found them to be a pain to clean. The two-stages are a nice safety against them going dry for aging but for primary I like the 3-piece types as you can easily hook up a blow-off tube and clean them with just a bit of scrubbing when they get gunky like yours have. Food for thought when you start up a new batch (which once you taste your cider I'd be willing to bet you'll be doing ).

 

[AidanSavage]

With how vigorous it had to be to push that much gunk into the airlock, it might be worth trying to start the fermentation at the lower side of the scale for your yeast. If my thinking is correct, the cooler temp might have a moderating effect on how fast and/or how much gunk is pushed into the airlock. As the others have said, you always want to keep them clean as well. If there's anything but crystal clear water/vodka, pull out the spare (definitely a good idea to have a spare airlock or three, per carboy), replace the funky one, clean it, sanitize it, put it away as the new "spare."


edit: to clarify, my yeast of choice is nottingham, and it's not yet done the "vomiting" stuff yet, so yeast choice definitely is a factor.

 

[mike6432]

I cleaned the airlocks out. Unfortunately I don't have a spare at this time. I read somewhere else that I shouldn't be using bleach with cleaning/sanitizing Them either? So I used vodka. Is this ok? The thread said use vodka.

Also I cleaned up this sediment a bit in the carbuoy towards the top and if you see the picture below, this is what it looks like when rubbed... What is this?

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1419602063.310559.jpg

Thanks

 

[grrickar]

Yeast? Looks to be the right color at least for it to be that.

Cleaning with vodka should be ok. Boiling them and putting some of the boiled water in would be ok too. That is what I typically do.

I find the 3pc airlocks easier to clean.

 

[bernardsmith]

You might want to use K-meta to sanitize. K-meta is good because it has multiple uses: you can use it to kill off wild yeasts in fruit 24 hours before you pitch your yeast. you can use it at a stronger concentration to sanitize bottles, carboys and all your fermenting equipment and you can use it at the lower concentration each time you rack and the SO2 it produces has the effect of inhibiting oxidation.
Wine makers tend to avoid using bleach because bleach can react with natural corks to produce a chemical called TCA which is incredibly hard to remove from your winery once you have introduced it.

But looking at the photos suggests that you added the airlock very soon after you pitched the yeast. IMO, you really want cider, wine, mead to have good exposure to air during the first few days of fermentation. Yeast needs air. After the gravity of the cider or the wine drops closer to 1.000 (some here suggest 1.010, I prefer 1.005) then you can rack from the primary into a secondary which you seal with a drilled bung and airlock. At that point most of the action will have really quietened down and you won't get any gunk blown into your airlock. In fact at that point you can fill the carboy right up into the mouth of the vessel to keep any contact with air to the very minimum.

 

[AidanSavage]

An airlock on primary seems less about being an oxygen barrier and probably more about being a "best practices" sort of thing that would involve protecting the cider from things falling into it for the first few days.

 

[bernardsmith]

An airlock on primary seems less about being an oxygen barrier and probably more about being a "best practices" sort of thing that would involve protecting the cider from things falling into it for the first few days.

I dunno... a clean towel or dishcloth over the mouth of a bucket will do just that, won't it, or even the plastic bucket cap placed loosely on top? Sealing with a bung and airlock in the first few days is not IMO "good practice" never mind "best practice" in wine making. Are you not unnecessarily stressing the yeast? The air that you may have incorporated before you pitched the yeast will have all been consumed in the first few hours. The airlock disinclines the vintner from stirring the wine, from incorporating more air into the liquid or from removing CO2 from the liquid. What makes that "best practice"? Brewing has different requirements - banging in an airlock or blow off tube immediately after pitching the yeast may make good sense when brewing. It is counter intuitive when making wine.

 

[MarkKF]

While I agree that the first few days the airlock is not needed. A loose lid or towel is more than enough. I disagree with the rest. This is cider not wine. The O2 in there at the beginning is more than enough. You should never stir or shake cider after fermentation starts. There is no harm in adding an airlock. And if fermentation slows having one there already eliminates the possibility of delaying or forgetting to add one later.

I always start with a three piece airlock. I don't add the vodka until after I pitch the yeast. When I rack into a secondary I use the S style airlock. After fermentation slows changes in temperature may result in suck back in a three piece airlock. Just my opinion.

 

[AidanSavage]

I dunno... a clean towel or dishcloth over the mouth of a bucket will do just that, won't it, or even the plastic bucket cap placed loosely on top? Sealing with a bung and airlock in the first few days is not IMO "good practice" never mind "best practice" in wine making. Are you not unnecessarily stressing the yeast? The air that you may have incorporated before you pitched the yeast will have all been consumed in the first few hours. The airlock disinclines the vintner from stirring the wine, from incorporating more air into the liquid or from removing CO2 from the liquid. What makes that "best practice"? Brewing has different requirements - banging in an airlock or blow off tube immediately after pitching the yeast may make good sense when brewing. It is counter intuitive when making wine.

Cider may be (usually) made like wine, taxed like wine, and defined as a wine, and bottled like a wine, but that does not mean it needs to treated AS a wine from head to tail. The simplest reason for that is the mere fact that it's not made from the same thing as what people traditionally think of wine being made from; grapes. Apples have a hell of a lot of things grapes dont, and doesnt have a lot of what grapes do. I'm sure there's others that are capable of getting technical about the differences with the nitpicking details, but suffice it to say this is literally a case of comparing oranges (grapes) to apples.

To top it off, no, it's not unnecessarily stressing the yeast. If you're pitching the proper amount of yeast, whether dry, liquid/starter, or a slurry from a washed cake, the existing oxygen is more than enough for the yeast to propagate to a healthy level. Additionally, once the fermentation starts, oxygen is burned out by the yeast in less than 24 hours, if even that long. After that, if your yeast isnt propagated enough, you didnt add enough yeast, or the yeast was old/dead when pitched.

To be frank, I've never had rhino farts in any severity, no sulfur compounds revealing themselves at bottling time, nor any when drinking, no harsh tastes attributed to "stressed" yeast, or anything you're fearing. I pitch and lock immediately. Never added yeast nutrient either. Either I'm not doing it wrong, or the yeast is far more resilient than you give it credit. Not to mention I wouldnt be surprised that most people will get the absolute vigorous part of the fermentation shortly after the yeast finish off the remaining DO in the juice. Granted, that is also attributed to yeast strain as well, which is the other reason an airlock or blowoff tube is a "best practice" action. I'd rather not have nothing capping the carboy just to come home and find out the yeast basically vomited out a few liters of cider that I could have saved/mitigated with an airlock or blowoff.


Also, I just realized I'm just over an hour away from Angry Orchard's facility. Wonder if they do tours....

 

[bernardsmith]

Grapes are one fruit that vintners turn into wine. I make wine from apples, mangoes, gooseberries, bananas, raspberries, blueberries, oranges, cherries, elderberries, and elderflowers, from rhubarb, from varietal honey, from hibiscus . They all have different qualities. Not all wine is made from grapes ... and I also have never experienced H2S problems. Cheers mate.

 

[D-west]

I am new to this, all of the reading I have done and advice I have been given, I can tell you what that is, and how to prevent it next time by making one change.

The foamy gunk you seek is called Krausen, its not bad, it can however cause you problems if you dont clean it up.

Do as others suggested, clean your airclock, you can use the diluted solution of sanatizer for the liquid in the airlock, I use starsan.

Looks like you are using 1gal primarys, if you can find a 1.5gal primary that would be ideal. Or when you start a new batch in the 1gal jug, dont fill it so full. I only fill mine to the start of the shoulder. It gives plenty of room for oxygen, and if your yeast decide to throw a party like they did in yours, they will have room to expand without getting in your airlock.

hope that helps